Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #1   Report Post  
Old 15-04-2008, 08:35 PM posted to rec.gardens.roses
external usenet poster
 
First recorded activity by GardenBanter: Feb 2008
Posts: 16
Default Fertilizer - Synthetic vs. Natural

Quick question for the group - Fertilizer. Apart from not being
"green", as is the current fad, are there any long term detrimental
effects that the the modern day synthetic fertilizers may cause to
rose bushes? I am specifically asking about the Bayer Systemic 2-in-1
fertilizer that protects from bug damage etc.

The reason I bring this up is I was recently told by a mail-order rose
company that I am in effect reducing the life expectancy of the roses
using that type of fertilizer. I am not sure if I necessarily believe
that since the product is fairly recent. Also, the concept of green
gardening is something I practice for my vegetables since I will
ingest them, but since the roses are just for looking good, I am less
concerned about the environmentalist pressures that are ever present.

Thoughts? Opinions?

  #2   Report Post  
Old 16-04-2008, 11:41 AM posted to rec.gardens.roses
external usenet poster
 
First recorded activity by GardenBanter: Aug 2006
Posts: 99
Default Fertilizer - Synthetic vs. Natural

I've used Bayer products and find them to be of high quality. I don't use
the systemic system, just 'cause I think topical application of insect and
fungus/black spot control to be more effective.

There are a ton of articles on line providing the pro's and con's for both
synthetic (generally petroleum based) and organic fertilizers, including
American Rose Society.

With 3000 square feet of garden, I find granulated fertilizer an real
benefit. Its easy to apply, consistent in its composition, and cost
effective.

I think the main issues of synthetics from my experience is the salt
build-up in the soil (and run-off in the water, if you're not careful), as
well as increasing pH. Both have a tendency to decrease the plant's ability
to take up the nurturance in the soil. (Martin and Gail, in reference to
your "roses are busting out all over" thread, this is why, so I'm told, that
they recommend you replace soil when placing a new rose in an old rose
site.)

There are several products that can reduce salt buildup, including gypsum.
It has the additional benefit of clumping clay, so you get better root
aeration. In addition, I monitor my soil's pH and adjust it to 6 to 6.5.

I also use horse manure based compose, but I find it is not very high in
nitrogen. The wood chips used in stalls these days are very high in carbon,
which actually leaches nitrogen out of the soil, so I add nitrogen to the
pile while I'm composting it.

And that's my main concern with most "natural" fertilizers. Its really hard
to know how much of what is in it, and it varies from batch to batch. As a
result, you can never be sure you're providing all of the substrates the
plant requires. (Well, I guess if your plants are big, green, healthy, and
full of blooms, you must be doing something right.) Also, if you have a big
area, it can get quite costly.

Hope this helps

Jeff, Southeast Michigan, Zone 5


wrote in message
...
Quick question for the group - Fertilizer. Apart from not being
"green", as is the current fad, are there any long term detrimental
effects that the the modern day synthetic fertilizers may cause to
rose bushes? I am specifically asking about the Bayer Systemic 2-in-1
fertilizer that protects from bug damage etc.

The reason I bring this up is I was recently told by a mail-order rose
company that I am in effect reducing the life expectancy of the roses
using that type of fertilizer. I am not sure if I necessarily believe
that since the product is fairly recent. Also, the concept of green
gardening is something I practice for my vegetables since I will
ingest them, but since the roses are just for looking good, I am less
concerned about the environmentalist pressures that are ever present.

Thoughts? Opinions?



  #3   Report Post  
Old 18-04-2008, 07:31 PM posted to rec.gardens.roses
external usenet poster
 
First recorded activity by GardenBanter: Jan 2007
Posts: 115
Default Fertilizer - Synthetic vs. Natural

"Jeffrey L. Kline" wrote in message
...
I've used Bayer products and find them to be of high quality. I
don't use the systemic system, just 'cause I think topical
application of insect and fungus/black spot control to be more
effective.

There are a ton of articles on line providing the pro's and con's
for both synthetic (generally petroleum based) and organic
fertilizers, including American Rose Society.

With 3000 square feet of garden, I find granulated fertilizer an
real benefit. Its easy to apply, consistent in its composition, and
cost effective.

I think the main issues of synthetics from my experience is the salt
build-up in the soil (and run-off in the water, if you're not
careful), as well as increasing pH. Both have a tendency to
decrease the plant's ability to take up the nurturance in the soil.
(Martin and Gail, in reference to your "roses are busting out all
over" thread, this is why, so I'm told, that they recommend you
replace soil when placing a new rose in an old rose site.)


I think you've got a good point there. I try to
use a mixture of organic and non-organic
sources so I'm not quite as worried about
soil conditions, but it might be a concern for
a new rose in an old spot. There's also the
potential problem of disease. A rose that doesn't
last long after planting must have something
wrong with it. Mostly, I think in my case,
it's a matter of roses that can't deal with the
high heat. Roses used to the heat - like Teas -
do great with little effort on my part. And
yeah, I'm planting more and more Teas...

There are several products that can reduce salt buildup, including
gypsum. It has the additional benefit of clumping clay, so you get
better root aeration. In addition, I monitor my soil's pH and
adjust it to 6 to 6.5.


I add gypsum my soil because it's heavy clay
and I've read gypsum helps with drainage. We've
had floods here, and as far as I can tell I haven't
lost any roses because of too much water.

I also use horse manure based compose, but I find it is not very
high in nitrogen. The wood chips used in stalls these days are very
high in carbon, which actually leaches nitrogen out of the soil, so
I add nitrogen to the pile while I'm composting it.

And that's my main concern with most "natural" fertilizers. Its
really hard to know how much of what is in it, and it varies from
batch to batch. As a result, you can never be sure you're providing
all of the substrates the plant requires. (Well, I guess if your
plants are big, green, healthy, and full of blooms, you must be
doing something right.) Also, if you have a big area, it can get
quite costly.

Hope this helps

Jeff, Southeast Michigan, Zone 5


Gail
near San Antonio TX Zone 8




Reply
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules

Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Synthetic Adjustable Balcony Trough Brackets / Hooks - NEW! larocca Marketplace 0 08-02-2011 11:53 PM
Synthetic Oil vs. Pertolium Based Oil Ken Shelton Lawns 5 05-05-2003 10:58 PM
Synthetic Lumber. Raised beds. B.Server Texas 2 05-04-2003 11:10 AM


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 05:44 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Copyright ©2000 - 2021, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 2004-2021 GardenBanter.co.uk.
The comments are property of their posters.
 

About Us

"It's about Gardening"

 

Copyright © 2017