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Old 26-08-2003, 05:42 PM
Mark. Gooley
 
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Default Another happy rugosa in zone 8b, and other drivel

It's in a pot, mind you: Sarah van Fleet. I'm reluctant
to put any more roses in the ground so long as the rains
go on (seem to have slackened a bit in the past few days).
Anyhow, Sarah is growing like mad and putting out a fair
number of blooms. Maybe Hansa is just a freak that genuinely
hates heat: mine is now dead. I bouught it potted from a local
nursery that ships in all of its roses: it was compact but just
brimming with that rude Rugosa health when I got it, but soon
languished; transplanting it into the dirt seemed merely to hasten
its slow decline.

Austin's The Dark Lady, not own-root, bought on sale as
a bare-root in late May and potted up (convert your bare-root
plants to "containerized": pot them up when you get them!),
has about a dozen blossoms on it. This reminds me of an
Austin I gave my Mom maybe 20 years ago, a Gertrude Jekyll
that in Illinois (5a) would have repeated spells of heavy bloom
all summer: clearly what Austin has been trying for. If I can get
it into rich dirt that's not too wet or dry...and I wish it were on
its own roots.

Frederic Mistral, a Meilland Romantica-series hybrid tea I
bought at the same time, is putting out a lot of fine blooms,
not too obnoxious in form for a hybrid tea. Small bush,
not really my style, reputedly cold-tender, but I find myself
liking it.

Mark.




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Old 26-08-2003, 11:12 PM
Mark. Gooley
 
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Default Another happy rugosa in zone 8b, and other drivel


I wrote:
It's in a pot, mind you: Sarah van Fleet. I'm reluctant
to put any more roses in the ground so long as the rains
go on (seem to have slackened a bit in the past few days).
Anyhow, Sarah is growing like mad and putting out a fair
number of blooms. Maybe Hansa is just a freak that genuinely
hates heat: mine is now dead. I bouught it potted from a local
nursery that ships in all of its roses: it was compact but just
brimming with that rude Rugosa health when I got it, but soon
languished; transplanting it into the dirt seemed merely to hasten
its slow decline.


And one more rugosa that doesn't seem to like the heat, or
something here, even though it's still in a pot: Roseraie de l'Hay.
It has some leaves that have turned brown and curly, and
it's not blooming. It's far from moribund, but it's not exactly
thriving

However, my Pink Grootendoorst is doing very nicely.

Go figure. Clearly some rugosa hybrids don't like something
about the climate I'm in, whereas other seem to have no
problems with it. Ancestry?

For instance, Pink Grootendoorst is a sport of F. J.
Grootendoorst, which is a cross of Mme. Nobert Levavassur
with R. rugosa rubra. Mme. Nobert is a cross of a polyantha
with a hybrid multiflora. Maybe those genes give it some
heat tolerance.

Sarah van Fleet is a cross of R. rugosa with a hybrid tea
(My Maryland) with a lot of Teas and Chinas in its family
tree. Certainly the old tea roses like the heat.

Hansa's ancestry seems to be unknown. Same with Roserie
de l'Hay's. No way to tell.

Sir Thomas Lipton I'm not sure about: it seemed to be doing
okay until I transplanted it into the wet. Polyantha and some
Tea ancestry the my guess is that if I got another and treated
it better, it would do just fine rather than dying on me. I need
to try it again.

Maybe one can guess at heat tolerance of a particular rugosa
based on its forebears. (Well, DUH-UH.) I wonder how
R. rugosa and its subspecies would fare he badly, I suspect.

Mark., probably re-discovering something well-known, and
thereby sounding like a halfwit to anyone with real knowledge



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Old 27-08-2003, 07:02 AM
Bob Bauer
 
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Default Another happy rugosa in zone 8b, and other drivel

On Tue, 26 Aug 2003 15:34:50 GMT, "Mark. Gooley"
wrote:

Frederic Mistral, a Meilland Romantica-series hybrid tea I
bought at the same time, is putting out a lot of fine blooms,
not too obnoxious in form for a hybrid tea. Small bush,
not really my style,


Small bush for you now, but this rose gets big. I mean really really
big and is a fast grower. 7 feet tall and wide in 2 to 3 years.
Needs a hard spring pruning to keep it under control after that.

reputedly cold-tender,


Survives fine in my Zone 6 climate. Hot and dry summer cold winter.

but I find myself liking it.


You should like it, because it is one of the truly great roses. It is
consistently the best smelling modern rose I know of. It is also
vigorous to the point of almost being everblooming.

Have a good one,

Bob Bauer
http://www.rose-roses.com/







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Old 27-08-2003, 08:42 AM
Cass
 
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Default Another happy rugosa in zone 8b, and other drivel

In article , Bob Bauer
wrote:

On Tue, 26 Aug 2003 15:34:50 GMT, "Mark. Gooley"
wrote:

Frederic Mistral, a Meilland Romantica-series hybrid tea I
bought at the same time, is putting out a lot of fine blooms,
not too obnoxious in form for a hybrid tea. Small bush,
not really my style,


Small bush for you now, but this rose gets big. I mean really really
big and is a fast grower. 7 feet tall and wide in 2 to 3 years.
Needs a hard spring pruning to keep it under control after that.

reputedly cold-tender,


Survives fine in my Zone 6 climate. Hot and dry summer cold winter.

but I find myself liking it.


You should like it, because it is one of the truly great roses. It is
consistently the best smelling modern rose I know of. It is also
vigorous to the point of almost being everblooming.


Bob, how is Looping growing for you?
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Old 27-08-2003, 03:12 PM
Mark. Gooley
 
Posts: n/a
Default Another happy rugosa in zone 8b, and other drivel


"Bob Bauer" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 26 Aug 2003 15:34:50 GMT, "Mark. Gooley"
wrote:

Frederic Mistral, a Meilland Romantica-series hybrid tea I
bought at the same time, is putting out a lot of fine blooms,
not too obnoxious in form for a hybrid tea. Small bush,
not really my style,


Small bush for you now, but this rose gets big. I mean really really
big and is a fast grower. 7 feet tall and wide in 2 to 3 years.
Needs a hard spring pruning to keep it under control after that.


Wow. And I was kvetching about how small the Romanticas are.
I hope mine grows that well. I have the room.

reputedly cold-tender,


Survives fine in my Zone 6 climate. Hot and dry summer cold winter.


Shows that I can't trust everything that I read. Anyway, cold isn't
really a problem here in 8b. (Just have to have drip irrigation ready
because you never know when the rains will fail; until a couple days
ago everything was flooded, and some roses in the ground were suffering;
now I have to start watering again.)

but I find myself liking it.


You should like it, because it is one of the truly great roses. It is
consistently the best smelling modern rose I know of. It is also
vigorous to the point of almost being everblooming.


It does smell great. I need to get over my prejudices about roses,
namely against hybrid teas. (The Austin roses have pretty much
conquered my prejudice against modern cultivars, to the point of
my wanting modern everblooming ramblers.) True, I still dislike
the stereotypical hybrid-tea form, but not all of them have it, and
more and more recent cultivars have strong and attractive scent.
And many of them are also remarkably tough and vigorous.

It never pays to get hidebound. Thanks for helping me get away
from that.

Mark.





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Old 28-08-2003, 12:02 AM
Bob Bauer
 
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Default Another happy rugosa in zone 8b, and other drivel

Cass asked:

Bob, how is Looping growing for you?


Hi Cass! All of the roses that you nursed for me are doing well.

Looping and Compassion are about 3 feet tall each, in larger pots,
have bloomed a couple of times and are about to go into the ground in
early September. ( I never plant anything in the blast furnace of
summer around these parts).

I haven't been much of a cyber rose guy for the last couple of months
because I'm out in the garden in all of my spare time . ....(or
sleeping..... heh ) I've noticed that my internet rose activity
really picks up steam after the killing frosts hit me. After that it
is all about rose fantasy for about 5 months.

Mary and I really enjoyed visiting your garden this spring. AND Mary
took one of your suggestions and settled a case with it. (nail them
with interoggatories.) Does that mean you get a commission?

...........Or at least a rose?

Oh, by the way, Phyllis Bide is "The Rose That Ate Cleveland"!
That thing grows like it's on fire, and is NEVER out of bloom. You
told me that a couple of years ago, but would I listen?...... well
actually I did, but I am still amazed.

Anything amazed you this year?

Have a good one,

Bob Bauer
http://www.rose-roses.com/




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Old 28-08-2003, 05:42 PM
Cass
 
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Default Another happy rugosa in zone 8b, and other drivel

In article , Bob Bauer
wrote:

Cass asked:

Bob, how is Looping growing for you?


Hi Cass! All of the roses that you nursed for me are doing well.

Looping and Compassion are about 3 feet tall each, in larger pots,
have bloomed a couple of times and are about to go into the ground in
early September. ( I never plant anything in the blast furnace of
summer around these parts).


Yeah, Compassion thus far has been beautiful.....when it blooms. Not
tons of them, that's for sure.

I haven't been much of a cyber rose guy for the last couple of months
because I'm out in the garden in all of my spare time . ....(or
sleeping..... heh ) I've noticed that my internet rose activity
really picks up steam after the killing frosts hit me. After that it
is all about rose fantasy for about 5 months.


Why wait? This time of year is rose ordering season for next year. I
just bought my first batch of OR's to work on this fall. The only
thing missing is William Baffin. I must have it.

Mary and I really enjoyed visiting your garden this spring. AND Mary
took one of your suggestions and settled a case with it. (nail them
with interoggatories.) Does that mean you get a commission?

..........Or at least a rose?


No, but a visit the next time you're in the Bay Area would be good.
Bring your car. You can take home Minuette and Dr. Brownell, which
didn't die after all. Dr. B. has nice amber blooms, but so far, they
open and blow in a day....here, where it's 68 degrees on a good day. It
also seems to not want to grow roots. Minuette it opening its first
blooms slowly, ever so slowly. Must love the heat. It wants SLC.

Oh, by the way, Phyllis Bide is "The Rose That Ate Cleveland"!
That thing grows like it's on fire, and is NEVER out of bloom. You
told me that a couple of years ago, but would I listen?...... well
actually I did, but I am still amazed.


It must still be small enough for you to deadhead. It sets a billion
hips, so I see bloom reduction from that. My next will be espaliered so
that I can reach the top.

Anything amazed you this year?


Yes, Belinda's Dream. I bought 2 from ARE this spring, and the plants
are fantastic, the blooms are big, many petalled affairs, and the scent
is decent.

Eden ((1950?) That is one I couldn't get for you. On its own roots, it
is vigorous, clean, and floriferous here. Mine is in bloom as we speak.
I never thought I'd like a traditional HT, but this I enjoy immensely.
If Peace used to look like Eden in size, vigor and repeat, no wonder
people love(d) it.

New to me also is Mr. Moore's Shadow Dancer. Love it, but then I like
anything striped and any Kordesii. Clean, blooms constantly, vigorous.

Illusion? Another Kordesii that has been fabulous. Alice gave me a
small plant last year, and like my other Kordesiis, all it did the
first year was things I couldn't see. This year it has bloomed
non-stop, scarlet like Altissimo, that clean scent like Rosarium
Uetersen, perfect foliage.

The rest of the standouts are found roses or teas, chinas and noisettes.

Nice seeing you post here, Bob.
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Old 29-08-2003, 08:12 PM
Bob Bauer
 
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Default Another happy rugosa in zone 8b, and other drivel

Cass said:

... After that (Frost time) it
is all about rose fantasy for about 5 months.

Why wait? This time of year is rose ordering season for next year. I
just bought my first batch of OR's to work on this fall.


I wish it were true in my climate. Killing frost is about October
15th, and if I plant now it would get hit as soon as it bloomed and
probably wouldn't survive the winter. I just have to settle for rose
buying season being March 15th to April 30th for me.

The only
thing missing is William Baffin. I must have it.


Why? Must have must mean something great.

... a visit the next time you're in the Bay Area would be good.
Bring your car. You can take home Minuette and Dr. Brownell, which
didn't die after all.


I bought another Dr. Brownell, and it loves the heat here. Funny, the
blooms seem to last a bit longer here, go figure.

...Minuette is opening its first
blooms slowly, ever so slowly. Must love the heat. It wants SLC.


Hey I'd love to take it off your hands. I first saw it and wanted it
at Greg Lowery and Philip Robinson's garden in your neck of the woods
3 years ago. So it will work for you as well, I am sure. I think
you should keep it if you like the blooms. I think the blooms are
unique and beautiful.

...Phyllis Bide is That thing grows like it's on fire...

It must still be small enough for you to deadhead. It sets a billion
hips, so I see bloom reduction from that.


I don't deadhead at all, it just keeps shooting out new 8 foot canes
in all directions.... continuously. Maybe it has a hormone
problem.... heh heh

Anything amazed you this year?

Yes, Belinda's Dream. I bought 2 from ARE this spring, and the plants
are fantastic, the blooms are big, many petalled affairs, and the scent
is decent.


EVERYbody has been saying this. I had better take it all seriously.
OK, here is my 2004 want list:

1) - Belinda's Dream

You gotta start somewhere...... grin


Eden ((1950?) That is one I couldn't get for you. On its own roots, it
is vigorous, clean, and floriferous here. Mine is in bloom as we speak.
I never thought I'd like a traditional HT, but this I enjoy immensely.
If Peace used to look like Eden in size, vigor and repeat, no wonder
people love(d) it.


2) Eden (The old HT not the Pierre de Ronsard one)

New to me also is Mr. Moore's Shadow Dancer. Love it, but then I like
anything striped and any Kordesii. Clean, blooms constantly, vigorous.


Got it, love it too. The other two full sized Moore roses that I got
this year are 'Renae' and 'Linda Campbell'. Both are on the list of
truly all time great roses. " Which list is that?", you ask? The one
in my head of course.... heh

Illusion? Another Kordesii that has been fabulous. Alice gave me a
small plant last year, and like my other Kordesiis, all it did the
first year was things I couldn't see. This year it has bloomed
non-stop, scarlet like Altissimo, that clean scent like Rosarium
Uetersen, perfect foliage.


Never hoid of it, will have to check it out further.

The rest of the standouts are found roses or teas, chinas and noisettes.


Which Noisette's? I can grow those here in Zone 6 I have found.
Their lack of winter hardiness is highly over stated I think.

Nice seeing you post here, Bob.


Hey, thanks. seeyalata,

Bob Bauer
http://www.rose-roses.com/




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Old 30-08-2003, 02:22 AM
Cass
 
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Default Another happy rugosa in zone 8b, and other drivel

Bob Bauer wrote:

Cass said:

The only thing missing is William Baffin. I must have it.


Why? Must have must mean something great.


I've seen awesome spring bloom....in pictures.

Hey, what are the standouts new to you this year? Obviously we all have
Outta The Blue.

... a visit the next time you're in the Bay Area would be good.
Bring your car. You can take home Minuette and Dr. Brownell, which
didn't die after all.


I bought another Dr. Brownell, and it loves the heat here. Funny, the
blooms seem to last a bit longer here, go figure.


That's encouraging. The plant has really struggled. Maybe it'll get
better here too.

...Minuette is opening its first
blooms slowly, ever so slowly. Must love the heat. It wants SLC.


Hey I'd love to take it off your hands. ... I think the blooms are
unique and beautiful.


Yes, they're pretty. And it wants to grow clean. I'll hold on to it
(what else am I going to do?)

Anything amazed you this year?

Yes, Belinda's Dream. I bought 2 from ARE this spring


EVERYbody has been saying this. I had better take it all seriously.
OK, here is my 2004 want list:

1) - Belinda's Dream

You gotta start somewhere...... grin


Start he http://www.rosefog.us/imagesAtoI/BelindasDreamPot.jpg

Eden ((1950?)


2) Eden (The old HT not the Pierre de Ronsard one)

New to me also is Mr. Moore's Shadow Dancer. Love it, but then I like
anything striped and any Kordesii. Clean, blooms constantly, vigorous.


Got it, love it too. The other two full sized Moore roses that I got
this year are 'Renae' and 'Linda Campbell'.


I bought three of his shrubs this spring: Sunshine Sally, which is a
cutie but doesn't photograph well. It's got polyantha/mini shiny
foliage and butter yellow little semi-double blooms. Background
material.

Also: Out of Yesteryear.
http://home.earthlink.net/~cbernstei...yesteryear.jpg

I just bought Pink Powderpuff. It hasn't even bloomed yet.

Which Noisette's? I can grow those here in Zone 6 I have found.
Their lack of winter hardiness is highly over stated I think.


Lamarque from ARE (accept no substitutes)- here, much better than
so-called Sombreuil, tho the blooms aren't as big

Okay, now not as a recommendation but as a curiosity: E. Veyrat
Hermanos:

http://www.rosefog.us/imagesAtoI/EVeyratHermanos2.jpg

I can't speak to the floriferousness of that one yet--same with Elie
Beauvilain (this is Gregg and Phillip's plant:
http://home.earthlink.net/~cbernstei...vilainHuh.jpg/

and Souv. de Mme. Leonie Vienot. EVH has the best foliage here, Leonie
Viennot grows the biggest the fastest. None of them blooms worth a damn
as a small plant, but I learned with Crepuscule not to hold that
against them.

Now the real standout we all want is Jaune Desprez:
http://home.earthlink.net/~cbernstei...mages/Lots.jpg

I am waiting to take cuttings from that plant. The [email protected] who owns it
cut it back to 18 inches in July. Believe it or not, it's growing back.
So I will take plenty of cuttings this fall. It is just too rank and
new now.

Oh oh oh I remember one you have to get but won't be able to (heh heh):
Plaisanterie available when they get around to it from Errloom.

http://home.earthlink.net/~cbernstei...aisanterie.jpg


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