Sue wrote:
There are no host(esse)s, since this is an unmoderated newsgroup, available
to all equally. But I do agree with that last sentence. Perhaps if you
would also 'do as you would be done by' things wouldn't get so fraught.
Personal insults are inflammatory and juvenile, no?

Takes two to tango. Yes, you are right. But one finds it very difficult
to keep the fire within. Calling someone a stupid cow is frankly very
juvenile but if one has nothing better to throw back when hurt, why
not?! )

In article , Mike
wrote:
Never feel afraid
to ask anything, even if you think it is trivial.

...but whatever you do don't post via Garden Banter 'cos they'll be
after you... (I'm not entirely sure why as the 'interference' is
minimal AFAICS but what do I know).

Kevin

In article , Kay Easton wrote:
OK, it's
giving in to the bullies who are trying to disrupt the group and drive
away long-term posters

I really don't understand why anyone should feel driven away. If you
don't like what someone posts you have two options - ignore it or
respond, the choice is entirely yours. If particular people annoy you
killfile them; you only have to read what you want to read.

I may be new in this particular group but I've been using forums since
before there was a 'net' and if you think the conversation can be robust
here you may like to look at some of the diving or motorcycling forums.
(Er, on the other hand if you are at all delicate you probably
shouldn't!)

Kevin

In article , Kevin Weller
writes

I really don't understand why anyone should feel driven away. If you
don't like what someone posts you have two options - ignore it or
respond, the choice is entirely yours. If particular people annoy you
killfile them; you only have to read what you want to read.

Kay, I agree with Kevin, I have met you and I am shocked that recent
postings have got to you; as you are one of the most well balanced
people I know! Don't go, you would be an enormous loss - remember, I
ducked out of urg for a long time because I didn't like nasty postings
but I have now learned a new skill; the PLONK button. I do not download
poster(s) who I have applied this rule to and therefore I cannot read
their posts - solution, I don't have to get annoyed. Anyway, as we
know, troublemakers get sussed out and ignored and they go away - so
just hang on.

Arrange another urg meet Kay, your last one was brilliant.

--
Judith Lea

In message , Kay Easton
writes
I have been pondering over the last couple of weeks whether it's time
to just duck out of urg. No loss to urg - other people here know more
about every one of the topics I post on. The only loss is to me, in
terms of the sheer amount that I learn from here, but I am beginning to
wonder whether the price is worth it. I shall continue for a while, but
I can't see myself being here much longer. OK, it's giving in to the
bullies who are trying to disrupt the group and drive away long-term
posters, but I don't have to take on every battle that the world offers me.

That would be a shame. I read here daily but post very infrequently
these days, which is a huge contrast to several years ago, when I was a
regular contributor. I have become accustomed to ignoring people and
threads likely to cause trouble for me to the extent of kill-filing
them. Cowardly perhaps - but it makes life a damned site easier. There
are enough battles in real life without having more here.

Having said all that, we always used to bicker in winter in the old
days
--
June Hughes

--
..
"La puce" wrote in message
oups.com...

Mike wrote:

(snip)

Unfortunatly this post will now attract 'poison arrows' because I am
going
on a cruise :-(( Just watch

Mike, this is my second post to you and I have mixed feelings about
this. Please understand what I am trying to say here for the first time
and the last.

snip your lecture :-))

Had I NOT concluded with that comment, Her Ladyship would have had another
go at me. However, to prove me wrong ................

Know what I mean ;-) ;-) ??

Mike

Mike wrote:
Know what I mean ;-) ;-) ??

Well no I don't Mike. In all honesty I think my support to you has
brought me into a few killfile without even responding to you, but
supporting you as an individual with a problem with Sacha and Janet and
my standing up to Sacha as made me realise that a few people in here
are hypocrites. So no, I don't know what you mean and furthermore I
don't want to know.

In article , Kay Easton wrote:
You have to read at least one obnoxious post in
order to make the decision to kf.

Dear God, I'm beginning to believe some of these posters may have a
point. I'll happily concede you may have to read one obnoxious post and
you may have to read something that is quoted. Is that better?

I'm sorry perhaps you were right after all, perhaps you are too
delicate to be on a newsgroup.

You are not the only long term user of newsgroups.

Newgroups? We were using BBS systems long before newsgroups but so
what? Having said I was 'new' I needed to say that I was only new here
to make my point. Someone implied it was bad here and it really isn't,
it's a lot 'worse' elsewhere ('worse' if you let it bother you).

We now have posters who have no interest in gardening

Then how about posting about gardening rather than nitpicking?

Kevin

On 16/12/05 11:32 am, in article , "Kay
Easton" wrote:

In message , Sacha
writes

I think most people here think as I do - that *everyone*, including total
novice gardeners has something to contribute to this group.
snip

I agree with all of that. I have been pondering over the last couple of
weeks whether it's time to just duck out of urg. No loss to urg - other
people here know more about every one of the topics I post on. The only
loss is to me, in terms of the sheer amount that I learn from here, but
I am beginning to wonder whether the price is worth it. I shall continue
for a while, but I can't see myself being here much longer. OK, it's
giving in to the bullies who are trying to disrupt the group and drive
away long-term posters, but I don't have to take on every battle that
the world offers me.

I do so much hope you won't go Kay. You have an enormous amount to give
this group in terms of experience and knowledge and we've lost too many good
people already. You may have noticed that the ruder and more unpleasant
posters are, mostly, being ignored by the rest and I think that's the best
way to play it. Read those you enjoy, or the threads that interest you and
blank out the rest - cyberswat them like mozzies! I'm very disturbed that
I've had one or two or three or four 'chats' with some of the best people
here who are getting very close to leaving for good. Some have already
taken long breaks. If that does happen, urg will have nobody left who can
be of genuine help to new gardeners, or indeed, to each other! I don't think
one boring troll or other or a couple of over-inflated egos should be
allowed to drown out all those who really do make urg what it was and can be
again, I hope.
--
Sacha
www.hillhousenursery.co.uk
South Devon
(remove the weeds to email me)

On 16/12/05 5:21 pm, in article , "Kevin
Weller" wrote:

In article , Kay Easton wrote
snip

We now have posters who have no interest in gardening

Then how about posting about gardening rather than nitpicking?


Kay is talking about good manners on a newsgroup - specifically this one.
She is absolutely correct (IMO) that each group has its own dynamics and
those of this group were good manners, consideration for others, sensible
discussion of each question or point and very little personal animosity. We
exchanged gardening information, tips, news and sometimes, plants and
real-life encounters that were great fun.
That said, what is really ridiculous now is that two persistent offenders
have brought the group to this level and one of those knows nothing about
gardening and is less than interested. The other occasional transgressors
are of no account, IMO. COMPLETELY ignoring such people is the only way to
deal with them when they try to start fights, cat threads, personal insults
and abuse etc. And I do mean COMPLETELY.

--
Sacha
www.hillhousenursery.co.uk
South Devon
(remove the weeds to email me)

Janet Baraclough wrote:
There's another issue, which is that while old hands to a group have
seen plenty of evidence of a troll's true character, and have them
killfiled, new arrivals do not. Newbies are then at the mercy of the
endless lies and misrepresentations about the group, and other posters,
fed to them by the troll. They see few or no denials by the group , but
fail to realise this is because their new friend and adviser is widely
killfiled.

You are again displaying serious need for control. Newbies are not
idiots, queries are not necessarily from trolls, and there's lots of
people here who can respond and enjoy sharing their knowledge without
your constant rude interuptions and more to the point your permission.
Stop trying to control everything and just enjoy what is written by
others. Some of you are using this forum as a diary and start thread as
soon as they've got a thought coming to their mind. Sometimes it's
charming, other time it's like Mother calling you downstairs to watch
Blanketyblank. Honestly ...

Kay Easton wrote:

That's the bit I don't understand. Why should newsgroups be suitable
places only for those of 'robust' constitution? Why not have a newsgroup
where the same standards of courtesy apply as one would expect in real
life?

This is not real life. Robustness doesn't mean rudeness. Here, have a
biscuit.

In article , Janet Baraclough
wrote:
Newbies are then at the mercy of the
endless lies and misrepresentations about the group, and other posters,
fed to them by the troll

If they can only form their opinions based on what they're told to think
rather than making up their own minds there's not a lot of hope for them
'out here' is there so I wouldn't waste your energy.

Kevin

In article , Sacha wrote:
COMPLETELY ignoring such people is the only way to
deal with them when they try to start fights, cat threads, personal insults
and abuse etc. And I do mean COMPLETELY.

I agree but, and I hate to point this out, you don't seem to be following your
own advice. If there are egos to be fed you just fed them.

I've probably been here for a couple of months and, AFAICS, there's a group of
people over 'there' who don't like the group of people (which includes you)
over 'here'. So what? That's life. Everyone should get over it. When it starts
I hit the ignore key for that thread branch. The worst that happens is that I
might miss a nugget of information but I'm sure life will go on.

I confess I'm wondering how I got sucked into this so I'll probably shut up
now. I suspect that I saw people taking this newsgroup thing far too seriously
(I mean, it's not as if it's real life like Star Trek is it?) and didn't
resist the urge to comment.

Kevin

In article , Kay Easton wrote:
Why not have a newsgroup
where the same standards of courtesy apply as one would expect in real
life?

I'm sorry Kay, and please don't think I'm trying to patronise you, real
life may not be like that where you live but out in the wider world I'm
afraid that's exactly how it is.

Kevin