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Rusty Hinge 2 wrote: Je suis que Je suis, mai Je ne suis pas que Je suis. Je suis CE que je suis, mais je ne suis pas CE que je NE suis pas. If that's what you want to say :o)) I tend to the 'little bit of grammar and vocabulary, then throw in the deep-end' approach. By this method I learnt quickly, and at school I spoke French quite fluently, gaining 95% for GCE French Oral. I was so surprised to learn last Friday at the parents evening, that my son's French GCSE oral is basically French sentences thrown at him and he only has to say *in English* what it means. He, like his father, his dyslexic, and cannot write to save his life, but mumbles behind his long hair some French 'deep-end approach a la Rusty' I'd imagine, and get away with it anywhere in France with the other teens he encounters. My other son is different. He is very like me, wants to know it all, well, the way it should be, properly, entirely, clearly, in your face and right now. Good lad :o) J'ai forgottenai most de it maintenant innit. Never mind. If we happen to descend to Jenny's house one of these days, I'll hold your hand across the channel, don't worry. |
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"Janet Baraclough" wrote in message ... The message from "JennyC" contains these words: Warning OT :~) I (almost) had an argument with one of our prospective new neighbours (Dordogne) about learning French. She was of the' "one needs to know the grammar before even stating out" whereas I am of the "parrot school of learning" :~ I'd agree with her. In the case of French, a very early basic dose of the declension of common irregular verbs makes the most basic daily understanding, reading and speaking so much easier. It enables the listener to recognise he's just hearing or seeing variations of the same frequently used verb (ai, as, avons, avez , ont, all mean "have"; they also form part of the past tense of regular verbs ). They'll be listed in the early pages of a basic grammar book. Even just recognising (by ear and in print) the forms of etre and avoir gives a massive advantage. If one has that basic grasp of the commonest verb variations, it's then quicker and easier to pick up French by "total immersion" which as you say is the best way to learn a language. Can you get French TV at home? Janet. Yes, and I'm listening to it sometimes........... Jenny |
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"Janet Baraclough" wrote in message ... The message from "Rupert" contains these words: if she really says "one" as the subject then forget the wine:-) Course she does, "on" doesn't carry the same stilted connotation in French that "one" does in English. It's a also a delicate French social courtesy to frame a little correction, or assertion, in the third person, less confrontational than using the first or second. snip Mea Culpa. I just assumed that the neighbour was English and doing a "Oh darling one must get to grips with basics" act. I have been watching too many of those tele programmes with people emigrating, living in communes and running burger bars . |
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On Tue, 07 Feb 2006 14:57:55 +0000
Sacha wrote: On 7/2/06 14:24, in article , "Nick Maclaren" wrote: snip In particular, if you have not learnt to hear certain sounds by the age of 5 or so, you probably never will - even if you have an early hearing problem that is later corrected. I don't know if this is correct but I was told some years ago that the Lycée International won't accept anyone who did not start to learn French by the age of four. This was told me by someone who had been through that system and he said that this was because after that age it is 'impossible' to learn to pronounce French as the French themselves speak it. Gaah! Trying desperately to stay out of this OT stuff, this time! :) I'm not sure which lycée you're referring to, Sacha, but that is certainly not true at any of the Lycées Internationals that I've come across. My kids were at the Lycée Laperouse in San Francisco, which is one of the ecoles homologuées in the network, and they certainly would except non-French speakers up to sixieme; after that French was required but I never heard of a beginning age requirement. We have some Greek/Spanish friends whos kids were in the Lycée International in Palma, they entered later, and it seemed to be a very cosmopolitan student body. This said, I don't doubt that at least to some extent each school can set it's own rules, maybe your acquaintance's school was particular in this respect. The Lycée system is great because if you move a lot, your kids can pick up in a new city basically on the next page of the same textbook. They really do all march in lock-step. And as they are about 40% in English, they turn out perfectly bi-lingual teenagers, bless 'em. Now, off to prepare some of those strange concoctions for dinner! :) (OK, actually I'll probably take some of last years broccoli out of the freezer. There, back on topic.) -E -- Emery Davis You can reply to ecom by removing the well known companies |
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"Sacha" wrote in message id... On 7/2/06 14:24, in article , "Nick Maclaren" wrote: snip In particular, if you have not learnt to hear certain sounds by the age of 5 or so, you probably never will - even if you have an early hearing problem that is later corrected. I don't know if this is correct but I was told some years ago that the Lycée International won't accept anyone who did not start to learn French by the age of four. This was told me by someone who had been through that system and he said that this was because after that age it is 'impossible' to learn to pronounce French as the French themselves speak it. -- Sacha www.hillhousenursery.co.uk South Devon ) I am certain that I recall that or something very similar. There was that Franglais thing (again) which I think was all part of the same pantomine. I thought it was about preserving the purity of the French language but didn't realise it extended down as far as pronounciation. |
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Emery Davis wrote: Now, off to prepare some of those strange concoctions for dinner! :) (OK, actually I'll probably take some of last years broccoli out of the freezer. There, back on topic.) If in doubt saute the lot in butter and garlic - just like the kale I prepared last night. Turned out all fluffy and smooth like mashmallows. Now that's what we call concocting from where I'm from ;o) |
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Nick Maclaren writes
In particular, if you have not learnt to hear certain sounds by the age of 5 or so, you probably never will - even if you have an early hearing problem that is later corrected. That matches my experience. A relative of mine had an early hearing problem, corrected when he was four, but continues to have speech difficulties consistent with an inability to distinguish between sounds that the rest of us can differentiate with ease. -- Kay |
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Sacha wrote: When my half French nieces lived in Thailand, they went to the Ecole deux langues (if I remember that name correctly) Ecole de Langue. |
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Sacha wrote: When my half French nieces lived in Thailand, they went to the Ecole deux langues (if I remember that name correctly) Ecole de Langues. |
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On 7 Feb 2006 09:37:23 -0800
"La Puce" wrote: Sacha wrote: When my half French nieces lived in Thailand, they went to the Ecole deux langues (if I remember that name correctly) Ecole de Langue. umm, I am diffident about correcting you, but wouldn't it be "ecole bilingue?" That is, a school taught in deux langues, as it were. -E -- Emery Davis You can reply to ecom by removing the well known companies |
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On Tue, 07 Feb 2006 17:16:29 +0000
Sacha wrote: On 7/2/06 16:32, in article , "Emery Davis" wrote: [] This said, I don't doubt that at least to some extent each school can set it's own rules, maybe your acquaintance's school was particular in this respect. Could be, Emery. He was Australian but he was a bit of a conceited wind up merchant so for all I know, it was a load of codswallop. Well, sounds like he graduated from French high school! :) The Lycée system is great because if you move a lot, your kids can pick up in a new city basically on the next page of the same textbook. They really do all march in lock-step. And as they are about 40% in English, they turn out perfectly bi-lingual teenagers, bless 'em. It sounds excellent, IMO, though I have no experience of it myself. When my half French nieces lived in Thailand, they went to the Ecole deux langues (if I remember that name correctly) and were perfectly suited, being bilingual to start with. They speak both French and English so well that they can start a sentence in one language and finish it in the other and of course, their accents are perfect in both - sickening. ;-) The international system is indeed excellent, usually better than the schools here, with a few notable exceptions. I'm sad to say I've had to take my kids out of the local village school this fall, where they were 3 years together in a class (which has some advantages), due to the suicide of the headmaster. Anyway my kids now miss no opportunity to correct my accent. And speak remarkably little franglais, considering how much my wife and I do... The little, uh, darlings. :) Now, off to prepare some of those strange concoctions for dinner! :) (OK, actually I'll probably take some of last years broccoli out of the freezer. There, back on topic.) -E Bravo! ;-) I did get to make it a little concocting, by retrieving a bag of frozen cepes from this fall too. It was an incredible mushroom bounty this year, no one had ever seen the like of it. We were cutting 5 kilos of cepes (boletus ed.) in 20 minutes, all within 200 yards of the house! Went on like that for weeks. -E -- Emery Davis You can reply to ecom by removing the well known companies |
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Emery Davis wrote: umm, I am diffident about correcting you, but wouldn't it be "ecole bilingue?" That is, a school taught in deux langues, as it were. Ecole de langues (avec un 's' as my other post - had forgotten to add ;) But no, it's either 'Ecole bilingue' indeed or 'Ecole de Langues', shool of languages. Ecole deux langues doesn't exist in Thailand. |
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On Tue, 07 Feb 2006 17:27:25 +0100
Martin wrote: On Tue, 7 Feb 2006 16:47:35 +0100, "JennyC" wrote: [] Yes, and I'm listening to it sometimes........... ... watch it with the French subtitles on. Easy with France 2, more difficult with TV5. At least you will improve your reading ability. :-) Television is a good way, although, better without subtitles. When I first moved to France in '90 I determined that I should watch a show that was so plotless that I would be able to follow even with my quite limited French. Starsky and Hutch was on daily -- Starzky et Ootch -- so after several weeks I was equipped to commit a hold-up: "Haut les mains!" Or to do police work, I suppose. :) On the subject of silly mistakes made in a second language, I have two stories that are a bit ribald. The first from my french cousin, who emigrated to the States after the war having married a GI. They were at a "dry" dance, that is, no alcohol. She asked her new husband when they could get a drink, he told her "at intermission." Later she was dancing with another fellow, and becoming overheated came out with this broken gem: "When we do intercourse?" The gentleman replied, "I think we'll find your husband now..." My own experience was equally embarrassing. Newly arrived, we needed a whisk. Determined to exploit Paris to the fullest, off we went to the fine kitchen supply store Delerhin for the purchase. Making the effort, I consulted the dictionary, and armed (so I thought) with the local jargon for whisk, we sallied forth. Faced with the helpful salesman inside the door of the place, I stammered my much rehearsed sentence, "Bonjour Monsieur, j'ai besoin d'une verge." The fellow glanced over at my wife, then regarded me without expression. I had just literally said "Hello, I need a penis." Honest to God. His response, deadpan, was "You'll have to see my colleague for that item." All of which shows, television is bad for you. :) And dictionaries, too. Hmm, off to watch Eastenders... -E -- Emery Davis You can reply to ecom by removing the well known companies |
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