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-   -   Council rejects bin fine plea (https://www.gardenbanter.co.uk/united-kingdom/150531-re-council-rejects-bin-fine-plea.html)

Jim Webster 23-10-2006 01:35 PM

Council rejects bin fine plea
 

"Geoff" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 20 Oct 2006 19:28:08 +0100, Old Codger
wrote:

Sla#s wrote:
Geoff wrote:
On Thu, 19 Oct 2006 09:49:40 +0100, "Pat Gardiner"
wrote:
SNIP

What does an innocent man have to hide from ID cards?



"People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security deserve
neither and will lose both."

B Franklin

And

Als die Nazis die Kommunisten holten,
habe ich geschwiegen;
ich war ja kein Kommunist....

Indeed and, given that folk can now have their liberty restricted for
long periods 'on suspicion' with no trial, it has already started.



Good.


yes, they seem to be hitting the animal rights people pretty hard



Geoff[_5_] 23-10-2006 01:48 PM

Council rejects bin fine plea
 
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 13:35:32 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
.. .
On Fri, 20 Oct 2006 19:28:08 +0100, Old Codger
wrote:

Sla#s wrote:
Geoff wrote:
On Thu, 19 Oct 2006 09:49:40 +0100, "Pat Gardiner"
wrote:
SNIP

What does an innocent man have to hide from ID cards?



"People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security deserve
neither and will lose both."

B Franklin

And

Als die Nazis die Kommunisten holten,
habe ich geschwiegen;
ich war ja kein Kommunist....

Indeed and, given that folk can now have their liberty restricted for
long periods 'on suspicion' with no trial, it has already started.



Good.


yes, they seem to be hitting the animal rights people pretty hard


Not from where I'm standing.



Jim Webster 23-10-2006 02:24 PM

Council rejects bin fine plea
 

"Geoff" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 13:35:32 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
. ..
On Fri, 20 Oct 2006 19:28:08 +0100, Old Codger
wrote:

Sla#s wrote:
Geoff wrote:
On Thu, 19 Oct 2006 09:49:40 +0100, "Pat Gardiner"
wrote:
SNIP

What does an innocent man have to hide from ID cards?



"People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security deserve
neither and will lose both."

B Franklin

And

Als die Nazis die Kommunisten holten,
habe ich geschwiegen;
ich war ja kein Kommunist....

Indeed and, given that folk can now have their liberty restricted for
long periods 'on suspicion' with no trial, it has already started.


Good.


yes, they seem to be hitting the animal rights people pretty hard


Not from where I'm standing


corpse diggers doing time, a good start
they'll be working their way down the list
and just think, with the new laws on the statute they can pull anyone in on
suspicion of terrorism and keep them inside for quite a while
..





Geoff[_5_] 23-10-2006 02:31 PM

Council rejects bin fine plea
 
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 14:24:51 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
.. .
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 13:35:32 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 20 Oct 2006 19:28:08 +0100, Old Codger
wrote:

Sla#s wrote:
Geoff wrote:
On Thu, 19 Oct 2006 09:49:40 +0100, "Pat Gardiner"
wrote:
SNIP

What does an innocent man have to hide from ID cards?



"People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security deserve
neither and will lose both."

B Franklin

And

Als die Nazis die Kommunisten holten,
habe ich geschwiegen;
ich war ja kein Kommunist....

Indeed and, given that folk can now have their liberty restricted for
long periods 'on suspicion' with no trial, it has already started.


Good.

yes, they seem to be hitting the animal rights people pretty hard


Not from where I'm standing


corpse diggers doing time, a good start
they'll be working their way down the list
and just think, with the new laws on the statute they can pull anyone in on
suspicion of terrorism and keep them inside for quite a while


As they already have done to pro hunt nuts.

Jim Webster 23-10-2006 02:59 PM

Council rejects bin fine plea
 

"Geoff" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 14:24:51 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
. ..
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 13:35:32 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
m...
On Fri, 20 Oct 2006 19:28:08 +0100, Old Codger
wrote:

Sla#s wrote:
Geoff wrote:
On Thu, 19 Oct 2006 09:49:40 +0100, "Pat Gardiner"
wrote:
SNIP

What does an innocent man have to hide from ID cards?



"People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security
deserve
neither and will lose both."

B Franklin

And

Als die Nazis die Kommunisten holten,
habe ich geschwiegen;
ich war ja kein Kommunist....

Indeed and, given that folk can now have their liberty restricted for
long periods 'on suspicion' with no trial, it has already started.


Good.

yes, they seem to be hitting the animal rights people pretty hard


Not from where I'm standing


corpse diggers doing time, a good start
they'll be working their way down the list
and just think, with the new laws on the statute they can pull anyone in
on
suspicion of terrorism and keep them inside for quite a while


As they already have done to pro hunt nuts.


just watch for the knock on the door pete

wonder if anyone has talked. or perhaps someone has just forwarded them some
of your posts



Geoff[_5_] 23-10-2006 03:04 PM

Council rejects bin fine plea
 
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 14:59:38 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
.. .
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 14:24:51 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 13:35:32 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
om...
On Fri, 20 Oct 2006 19:28:08 +0100, Old Codger
wrote:

Sla#s wrote:
Geoff wrote:
On Thu, 19 Oct 2006 09:49:40 +0100, "Pat Gardiner"
wrote:
SNIP

What does an innocent man have to hide from ID cards?



"People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security
deserve
neither and will lose both."

B Franklin

And

Als die Nazis die Kommunisten holten,
habe ich geschwiegen;
ich war ja kein Kommunist....

Indeed and, given that folk can now have their liberty restricted for
long periods 'on suspicion' with no trial, it has already started.


Good.

yes, they seem to be hitting the animal rights people pretty hard


Not from where I'm standing

corpse diggers doing time, a good start
they'll be working their way down the list
and just think, with the new laws on the statute they can pull anyone in
on
suspicion of terrorism and keep them inside for quite a while


As they already have done to pro hunt nuts.


just watch for the knock on the door


Anytime. How long you nuts been saying that?

pete


There is no pete. Fool. I suppose you could be clinging to that fake
to avoid confronting your demons? Anytime you or your dumb buddies
fancy their chances........

wonder if anyone has talked. or perhaps someone has just forwarded them some
of your posts


Why not you? Ask yourself what you could do to save face!



Jim Webster 23-10-2006 03:07 PM

Council rejects bin fine plea
 

"Geoff" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 14:59:38 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
. ..
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 14:24:51 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
m...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 13:35:32 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
news:1ronj2hcdnjn3vi7u7bm3j0fqfrr4h0m7g@4ax. com...
On Fri, 20 Oct 2006 19:28:08 +0100, Old Codger
wrote:

Sla#s wrote:
Geoff wrote:
On Thu, 19 Oct 2006 09:49:40 +0100, "Pat Gardiner"
wrote:
SNIP

What does an innocent man have to hide from ID cards?



"People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security
deserve
neither and will lose both."

B Franklin

And

Als die Nazis die Kommunisten holten,
habe ich geschwiegen;
ich war ja kein Kommunist....

Indeed and, given that folk can now have their liberty restricted
for
long periods 'on suspicion' with no trial, it has already started.


Good.

yes, they seem to be hitting the animal rights people pretty hard


Not from where I'm standing

corpse diggers doing time, a good start
they'll be working their way down the list
and just think, with the new laws on the statute they can pull anyone in
on
suspicion of terrorism and keep them inside for quite a while

As they already have done to pro hunt nuts.


just watch for the knock on the door


Anytime. How long you nuts been saying that?

pete


There is no pete. Fool. I suppose you could be clinging to that fake
to avoid confronting your demons? Anytime you or your dumb buddies
fancy their chances........

wonder if anyone has talked. or perhaps someone has just forwarded them
some
of your posts


Why not you? Ask yourself what you could do to save face!


I hardly need to, looking at the number of people you have hacked off,
With friends like yours pete ;-))




Geoff[_5_] 23-10-2006 03:17 PM

Council rejects bin fine plea
 
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 15:07:12 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
.. .
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 14:59:38 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 14:24:51 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
om...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 13:35:32 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
news:1ronj2hcdnjn3vi7u7bm3j0fqfrr4h0m7g@4ax .com...
On Fri, 20 Oct 2006 19:28:08 +0100, Old Codger
wrote:

Sla#s wrote:
Geoff wrote:
On Thu, 19 Oct 2006 09:49:40 +0100, "Pat Gardiner"
wrote:
SNIP

What does an innocent man have to hide from ID cards?



"People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security
deserve
neither and will lose both."

B Franklin

And

Als die Nazis die Kommunisten holten,
habe ich geschwiegen;
ich war ja kein Kommunist....

Indeed and, given that folk can now have their liberty restricted
for
long periods 'on suspicion' with no trial, it has already started.


Good.

yes, they seem to be hitting the animal rights people pretty hard


Not from where I'm standing

corpse diggers doing time, a good start
they'll be working their way down the list
and just think, with the new laws on the statute they can pull anyone in
on
suspicion of terrorism and keep them inside for quite a while

As they already have done to pro hunt nuts.

just watch for the knock on the door


Anytime. How long you nuts been saying that?

pete


There is no pete. Fool. I suppose you could be clinging to that fake
to avoid confronting your demons? Anytime you or your dumb buddies
fancy their chances........

wonder if anyone has talked. or perhaps someone has just forwarded them
some
of your posts


Why not you? Ask yourself what you could do to save face!


I hardly need to, looking at the number of people you have hacked off,
With friends like yours pete ;-))


You're wise not to step forward, which is surprising, given the fact
you're a village idiot.



Jim Webster 23-10-2006 03:33 PM

Council rejects bin fine plea
 

"Geoff" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 15:07:12 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
. ..
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 14:59:38 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
m...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 14:24:51 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
news:lgepj2ph69m9m6f4v09573r2h36a6aspo9@4ax. com...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 13:35:32 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
news:1ronj2hcdnjn3vi7u7bm3j0fqfrr4h0m7g@4a x.com...
On Fri, 20 Oct 2006 19:28:08 +0100, Old Codger
wrote:

Sla#s wrote:
Geoff wrote:
On Thu, 19 Oct 2006 09:49:40 +0100, "Pat Gardiner"
wrote:
SNIP

What does an innocent man have to hide from ID cards?



"People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security
deserve
neither and will lose both."

B Franklin

And

Als die Nazis die Kommunisten holten,
habe ich geschwiegen;
ich war ja kein Kommunist....

Indeed and, given that folk can now have their liberty restricted
for
long periods 'on suspicion' with no trial, it has already started.


Good.

yes, they seem to be hitting the animal rights people pretty hard


Not from where I'm standing

corpse diggers doing time, a good start
they'll be working their way down the list
and just think, with the new laws on the statute they can pull anyone
in
on
suspicion of terrorism and keep them inside for quite a while

As they already have done to pro hunt nuts.

just watch for the knock on the door

Anytime. How long you nuts been saying that?

pete

There is no pete. Fool. I suppose you could be clinging to that fake
to avoid confronting your demons? Anytime you or your dumb buddies
fancy their chances........

wonder if anyone has talked. or perhaps someone has just forwarded them
some
of your posts

Why not you? Ask yourself what you could do to save face!


I hardly need to, looking at the number of people you have hacked off,
With friends like yours pete ;-))


You're wise not to step forward, which is surprising, given the fact
you're a village idiot.


looking over your shoulder and getting nervous pete,

certainly sounds like, the insults are coming out again



Geoff[_5_] 23-10-2006 03:40 PM

Council rejects bin fine plea
 
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 15:33:01 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
.. .
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 15:07:12 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 14:59:38 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
om...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 14:24:51 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
news:lgepj2ph69m9m6f4v09573r2h36a6aspo9@4ax .com...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 13:35:32 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
news:1ronj2hcdnjn3vi7u7bm3j0fqfrr4h0m7g@4 ax.com...
On Fri, 20 Oct 2006 19:28:08 +0100, Old Codger
wrote:

Sla#s wrote:
Geoff wrote:
On Thu, 19 Oct 2006 09:49:40 +0100, "Pat Gardiner"
wrote:
SNIP

What does an innocent man have to hide from ID cards?



"People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security
deserve
neither and will lose both."

B Franklin

And

Als die Nazis die Kommunisten holten,
habe ich geschwiegen;
ich war ja kein Kommunist....

Indeed and, given that folk can now have their liberty restricted
for
long periods 'on suspicion' with no trial, it has already started.


Good.

yes, they seem to be hitting the animal rights people pretty hard


Not from where I'm standing

corpse diggers doing time, a good start
they'll be working their way down the list
and just think, with the new laws on the statute they can pull anyone
in
on
suspicion of terrorism and keep them inside for quite a while

As they already have done to pro hunt nuts.

just watch for the knock on the door

Anytime. How long you nuts been saying that?

pete

There is no pete. Fool. I suppose you could be clinging to that fake
to avoid confronting your demons? Anytime you or your dumb buddies
fancy their chances........

wonder if anyone has talked. or perhaps someone has just forwarded them
some
of your posts

Why not you? Ask yourself what you could do to save face!


I hardly need to, looking at the number of people you have hacked off,
With friends like yours pete ;-))


You're wise not to step forward, which is surprising, given the fact
you're a village idiot.


looking over your shoulder and getting nervous pete,


Of what fatty. You abducting my kids, or hitting women?

LOL I don't think so. Feel free to try.




Jim Webster 23-10-2006 04:02 PM

Council rejects bin fine plea
 

"Geoff" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 15:33:01 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
. ..
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 15:07:12 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
m...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 14:59:38 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
news:s0hpj2ta37q789tb9t7tal2gsle2446nu6@4ax. com...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 14:24:51 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
news:lgepj2ph69m9m6f4v09573r2h36a6aspo9@4a x.com...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 13:35:32 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
news:1ronj2hcdnjn3vi7u7bm3j0fqfrr4h0m7g@ 4ax.com...
On Fri, 20 Oct 2006 19:28:08 +0100, Old Codger
wrote:

Sla#s wrote:
Geoff wrote:
On Thu, 19 Oct 2006 09:49:40 +0100, "Pat Gardiner"
wrote:
SNIP

What does an innocent man have to hide from ID cards?



"People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security
deserve
neither and will lose both."

B Franklin

And

Als die Nazis die Kommunisten holten,
habe ich geschwiegen;
ich war ja kein Kommunist....

Indeed and, given that folk can now have their liberty
restricted
for
long periods 'on suspicion' with no trial, it has already
started.


Good.

yes, they seem to be hitting the animal rights people pretty hard


Not from where I'm standing

corpse diggers doing time, a good start
they'll be working their way down the list
and just think, with the new laws on the statute they can pull
anyone
in
on
suspicion of terrorism and keep them inside for quite a while

As they already have done to pro hunt nuts.

just watch for the knock on the door

Anytime. How long you nuts been saying that?

pete

There is no pete. Fool. I suppose you could be clinging to that fake
to avoid confronting your demons? Anytime you or your dumb buddies
fancy their chances........

wonder if anyone has talked. or perhaps someone has just forwarded
them
some
of your posts

Why not you? Ask yourself what you could do to save face!


I hardly need to, looking at the number of people you have hacked off,
With friends like yours pete ;-))

You're wise not to step forward, which is surprising, given the fact
you're a village idiot.


looking over your shoulder and getting nervous pete,


Of what fatty. You abducting my kids, or hitting women?

LOL I don't think so. Feel free to try.



oh we are twitchy today aren't we
don't think you can trust your friends
worried someone might grass you up to save your skin
never mind, i'll stop rattling the bars of your cage now





Geoff[_5_] 23-10-2006 04:07 PM

Council rejects bin fine plea
 
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 16:02:54 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
.. .
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 15:33:01 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 15:07:12 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
om...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 14:59:38 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
news:s0hpj2ta37q789tb9t7tal2gsle2446nu6@4ax .com...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 14:24:51 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
news:lgepj2ph69m9m6f4v09573r2h36a6aspo9@4 ax.com...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 13:35:32 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
news:1ronj2hcdnjn3vi7u7bm3j0fqfrr4h0m7g @4ax.com...
On Fri, 20 Oct 2006 19:28:08 +0100, Old Codger
wrote:

Sla#s wrote:
Geoff wrote:
On Thu, 19 Oct 2006 09:49:40 +0100, "Pat Gardiner"
wrote:
SNIP

What does an innocent man have to hide from ID cards?



"People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security
deserve
neither and will lose both."

B Franklin

And

Als die Nazis die Kommunisten holten,
habe ich geschwiegen;
ich war ja kein Kommunist....

Indeed and, given that folk can now have their liberty
restricted
for
long periods 'on suspicion' with no trial, it has already
started.


Good.

yes, they seem to be hitting the animal rights people pretty hard


Not from where I'm standing

corpse diggers doing time, a good start
they'll be working their way down the list
and just think, with the new laws on the statute they can pull
anyone
in
on
suspicion of terrorism and keep them inside for quite a while

As they already have done to pro hunt nuts.

just watch for the knock on the door

Anytime. How long you nuts been saying that?

pete

There is no pete. Fool. I suppose you could be clinging to that fake
to avoid confronting your demons? Anytime you or your dumb buddies
fancy their chances........

wonder if anyone has talked. or perhaps someone has just forwarded
them
some
of your posts

Why not you? Ask yourself what you could do to save face!


I hardly need to, looking at the number of people you have hacked off,
With friends like yours pete ;-))

You're wise not to step forward, which is surprising, given the fact
you're a village idiot.


looking over your shoulder and getting nervous pete,


Of what fatty. You abducting my kids, or hitting women?

LOL I don't think so. Feel free to try.



oh we are twitchy today aren't we


Of what? What could a village idiot possibly do to scare me?

Perhaps you'd like to write to my employers? LOL

The good thing about being loaded, having lots of friends and bold as
brass. Is that I don't need to fear goons, even yellow ones!



Jim Webster 23-10-2006 04:51 PM

Council rejects bin fine plea
 

"Geoff" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 16:02:54 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
. ..
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 15:33:01 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
m...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 15:07:12 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
news:bripj2diur9t2lc9qirn8infofpeg42lj4@4ax. com...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 14:59:38 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
news:s0hpj2ta37q789tb9t7tal2gsle2446nu6@4a x.com...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 14:24:51 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
news:lgepj2ph69m9m6f4v09573r2h36a6aspo9@ 4ax.com...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 13:35:32 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
news:1ronj2hcdnjn3vi7u7bm3j0fqfrr4h0m7 ...
On Fri, 20 Oct 2006 19:28:08 +0100, Old Codger
wrote:

Sla#s wrote:
Geoff wrote:
On Thu, 19 Oct 2006 09:49:40 +0100, "Pat Gardiner"
wrote:
SNIP

What does an innocent man have to hide from ID cards?



"People willing to trade their freedom for temporary
security
deserve
neither and will lose both."

B Franklin

And

Als die Nazis die Kommunisten holten,
habe ich geschwiegen;
ich war ja kein Kommunist....

Indeed and, given that folk can now have their liberty
restricted
for
long periods 'on suspicion' with no trial, it has already
started.


Good.

yes, they seem to be hitting the animal rights people pretty
hard


Not from where I'm standing

corpse diggers doing time, a good start
they'll be working their way down the list
and just think, with the new laws on the statute they can pull
anyone
in
on
suspicion of terrorism and keep them inside for quite a while

As they already have done to pro hunt nuts.

just watch for the knock on the door

Anytime. How long you nuts been saying that?

pete

There is no pete. Fool. I suppose you could be clinging to that fake
to avoid confronting your demons? Anytime you or your dumb buddies
fancy their chances........

wonder if anyone has talked. or perhaps someone has just forwarded
them
some
of your posts

Why not you? Ask yourself what you could do to save face!


I hardly need to, looking at the number of people you have hacked off,
With friends like yours pete ;-))

You're wise not to step forward, which is surprising, given the fact
you're a village idiot.


looking over your shoulder and getting nervous pete,

Of what fatty. You abducting my kids, or hitting women?

LOL I don't think so. Feel free to try.



oh we are twitchy today aren't we


Of what? What could a village idiot possibly do to scare me?

Perhaps you'd like to write to my employers? LOL

The good thing about being loaded, having lots of friends and bold as
brass. Is that I don't need to fear goons, even yellow ones!


methinks she doth protest to much



Geoff[_5_] 23-10-2006 05:23 PM

Council rejects bin fine plea
 
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 16:51:23 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
.. .
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 16:02:54 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 15:33:01 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
om...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 15:07:12 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
news:bripj2diur9t2lc9qirn8infofpeg42lj4@4ax .com...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 14:59:38 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
news:s0hpj2ta37q789tb9t7tal2gsle2446nu6@4 ax.com...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 14:24:51 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
news:lgepj2ph69m9m6f4v09573r2h36a6aspo9 @4ax.com...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 13:35:32 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
news:1ronj2hcdnjn3vi7u7bm3j0fqfrr4h0m ...
On Fri, 20 Oct 2006 19:28:08 +0100, Old Codger
wrote:

Sla#s wrote:
Geoff wrote:
On Thu, 19 Oct 2006 09:49:40 +0100, "Pat Gardiner"
wrote:
SNIP

What does an innocent man have to hide from ID cards?



"People willing to trade their freedom for temporary
security
deserve
neither and will lose both."

B Franklin

And

Als die Nazis die Kommunisten holten,
habe ich geschwiegen;
ich war ja kein Kommunist....

Indeed and, given that folk can now have their liberty
restricted
for
long periods 'on suspicion' with no trial, it has already
started.


Good.

yes, they seem to be hitting the animal rights people pretty
hard


Not from where I'm standing

corpse diggers doing time, a good start
they'll be working their way down the list
and just think, with the new laws on the statute they can pull
anyone
in
on
suspicion of terrorism and keep them inside for quite a while

As they already have done to pro hunt nuts.

just watch for the knock on the door

Anytime. How long you nuts been saying that?

pete

There is no pete. Fool. I suppose you could be clinging to that fake
to avoid confronting your demons? Anytime you or your dumb buddies
fancy their chances........

wonder if anyone has talked. or perhaps someone has just forwarded
them
some
of your posts

Why not you? Ask yourself what you could do to save face!


I hardly need to, looking at the number of people you have hacked off,
With friends like yours pete ;-))

You're wise not to step forward, which is surprising, given the fact
you're a village idiot.


looking over your shoulder and getting nervous pete,

Of what fatty. You abducting my kids, or hitting women?

LOL I don't think so. Feel free to try.



oh we are twitchy today aren't we


Of what? What could a village idiot possibly do to scare me?

Perhaps you'd like to write to my employers? LOL

The good thing about being loaded, having lots of friends and bold as
brass. Is that I don't need to fear goons, even yellow ones!


methinks she doth protest to much


Methinks you don't like things that bite back!



Jim Webster 23-10-2006 05:28 PM

Council rejects bin fine plea
 

"Geoff" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 16:51:23 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
. ..
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 16:02:54 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
m...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 15:33:01 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
news:dljpj2hdmqt0ukqqc03bhdk9be24qd4p9i@4ax. com...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 15:07:12 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
news:bripj2diur9t2lc9qirn8infofpeg42lj4@4a x.com...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 14:59:38 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
news:s0hpj2ta37q789tb9t7tal2gsle2446nu6@ 4ax.com...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 14:24:51 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
news:lgepj2ph69m9m6f4v09573r2h36a6aspo ...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 13:35:32 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
news:1ronj2hcdnjn3vi7u7bm3j0fqfrr4h0 ...
On Fri, 20 Oct 2006 19:28:08 +0100, Old Codger
wrote:

Sla#s wrote:
Geoff wrote:
On Thu, 19 Oct 2006 09:49:40 +0100, "Pat Gardiner"
wrote:
SNIP

What does an innocent man have to hide from ID cards?



"People willing to trade their freedom for temporary
security
deserve
neither and will lose both."

B Franklin

And

Als die Nazis die Kommunisten holten,
habe ich geschwiegen;
ich war ja kein Kommunist....

Indeed and, given that folk can now have their liberty
restricted
for
long periods 'on suspicion' with no trial, it has already
started.


Good.

yes, they seem to be hitting the animal rights people pretty
hard


Not from where I'm standing

corpse diggers doing time, a good start
they'll be working their way down the list
and just think, with the new laws on the statute they can pull
anyone
in
on
suspicion of terrorism and keep them inside for quite a while

As they already have done to pro hunt nuts.

just watch for the knock on the door

Anytime. How long you nuts been saying that?

pete

There is no pete. Fool. I suppose you could be clinging to that
fake
to avoid confronting your demons? Anytime you or your dumb buddies
fancy their chances........

wonder if anyone has talked. or perhaps someone has just forwarded
them
some
of your posts

Why not you? Ask yourself what you could do to save face!


I hardly need to, looking at the number of people you have hacked
off,
With friends like yours pete ;-))

You're wise not to step forward, which is surprising, given the fact
you're a village idiot.


looking over your shoulder and getting nervous pete,

Of what fatty. You abducting my kids, or hitting women?

LOL I don't think so. Feel free to try.



oh we are twitchy today aren't we

Of what? What could a village idiot possibly do to scare me?

Perhaps you'd like to write to my employers? LOL

The good thing about being loaded, having lots of friends and bold as
brass. Is that I don't need to fear goons, even yellow ones!


methinks she doth protest to much


Methinks you don't like things that bite back!


I'm not the one looking over my shoulder worrying

don't worry, they might not grass you up




Geoff[_5_] 23-10-2006 05:34 PM

Council rejects bin fine plea
 
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 17:28:00 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
.. .
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 16:51:23 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 16:02:54 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
om...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 15:33:01 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
news:dljpj2hdmqt0ukqqc03bhdk9be24qd4p9i@4ax .com...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 15:07:12 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
news:bripj2diur9t2lc9qirn8infofpeg42lj4@4 ax.com...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 14:59:38 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
news:s0hpj2ta37q789tb9t7tal2gsle2446nu6 @4ax.com...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 14:24:51 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
news:lgepj2ph69m9m6f4v09573r2h36a6asp ...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 13:35:32 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
news:1ronj2hcdnjn3vi7u7bm3j0fqfrr4h ...
On Fri, 20 Oct 2006 19:28:08 +0100, Old Codger
wrote:

Sla#s wrote:
Geoff wrote:
On Thu, 19 Oct 2006 09:49:40 +0100, "Pat Gardiner"
wrote:
SNIP

What does an innocent man have to hide from ID cards?



"People willing to trade their freedom for temporary
security
deserve
neither and will lose both."

B Franklin

And

Als die Nazis die Kommunisten holten,
habe ich geschwiegen;
ich war ja kein Kommunist....

Indeed and, given that folk can now have their liberty
restricted
for
long periods 'on suspicion' with no trial, it has already
started.


Good.

yes, they seem to be hitting the animal rights people pretty
hard


Not from where I'm standing

corpse diggers doing time, a good start
they'll be working their way down the list
and just think, with the new laws on the statute they can pull
anyone
in
on
suspicion of terrorism and keep them inside for quite a while

As they already have done to pro hunt nuts.

just watch for the knock on the door

Anytime. How long you nuts been saying that?

pete

There is no pete. Fool. I suppose you could be clinging to that
fake
to avoid confronting your demons? Anytime you or your dumb buddies
fancy their chances........

wonder if anyone has talked. or perhaps someone has just forwarded
them
some
of your posts

Why not you? Ask yourself what you could do to save face!


I hardly need to, looking at the number of people you have hacked
off,
With friends like yours pete ;-))

You're wise not to step forward, which is surprising, given the fact
you're a village idiot.


looking over your shoulder and getting nervous pete,

Of what fatty. You abducting my kids, or hitting women?

LOL I don't think so. Feel free to try.



oh we are twitchy today aren't we

Of what? What could a village idiot possibly do to scare me?

Perhaps you'd like to write to my employers? LOL

The good thing about being loaded, having lots of friends and bold as
brass. Is that I don't need to fear goons, even yellow ones!


methinks she doth protest to much


Methinks you don't like things that bite back!


I'm not the one looking over my shoulder worrying


Something's worrying/upsetting you. I wonder what it could be!

don't worry, they might not grass you up


My local Police have had many, many anonymous letters from kooks and
other pro hunt nuts, trying to have me *done* for various offences.
Luckily, unlike you, the police don't accept hearsay/drivel/bitchiness
as evidence. In fact one unlucky obsessive actually found himself
doing 180 hours community service, not a million miles from you, for
wasting Police time.



Jim Webster 23-10-2006 06:05 PM

Council rejects bin fine plea
 

"Geoff" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 17:28:00 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
. ..
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 16:51:23 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
m...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 16:02:54 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
news:tmkpj253rsub1r2l00vder9prem232cb99@4ax. com...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 15:33:01 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
news:dljpj2hdmqt0ukqqc03bhdk9be24qd4p9i@4a x.com...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 15:07:12 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
news:bripj2diur9t2lc9qirn8infofpeg42lj4@ 4ax.com...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 14:59:38 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
news:s0hpj2ta37q789tb9t7tal2gsle2446nu ...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 14:24:51 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
news:lgepj2ph69m9m6f4v09573r2h36a6as ...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 13:35:32 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
news:1ronj2hcdnjn3vi7u7bm3j0fqfrr4 ...
On Fri, 20 Oct 2006 19:28:08 +0100, Old Codger
wrote:

Sla#s wrote:
Geoff wrote:
On Thu, 19 Oct 2006 09:49:40 +0100, "Pat Gardiner"
wrote:
SNIP

What does an innocent man have to hide from ID cards?



"People willing to trade their freedom for temporary
security
deserve
neither and will lose both."

B Franklin

And

Als die Nazis die Kommunisten holten,
habe ich geschwiegen;
ich war ja kein Kommunist....

Indeed and, given that folk can now have their liberty
restricted
for
long periods 'on suspicion' with no trial, it has already
started.


Good.

yes, they seem to be hitting the animal rights people pretty
hard


Not from where I'm standing

corpse diggers doing time, a good start
they'll be working their way down the list
and just think, with the new laws on the statute they can pull
anyone
in
on
suspicion of terrorism and keep them inside for quite a while

As they already have done to pro hunt nuts.

just watch for the knock on the door

Anytime. How long you nuts been saying that?

pete

There is no pete. Fool. I suppose you could be clinging to that
fake
to avoid confronting your demons? Anytime you or your dumb
buddies
fancy their chances........

wonder if anyone has talked. or perhaps someone has just
forwarded
them
some
of your posts

Why not you? Ask yourself what you could do to save face!


I hardly need to, looking at the number of people you have hacked
off,
With friends like yours pete ;-))

You're wise not to step forward, which is surprising, given the
fact
you're a village idiot.


looking over your shoulder and getting nervous pete,

Of what fatty. You abducting my kids, or hitting women?

LOL I don't think so. Feel free to try.



oh we are twitchy today aren't we

Of what? What could a village idiot possibly do to scare me?

Perhaps you'd like to write to my employers? LOL

The good thing about being loaded, having lots of friends and bold as
brass. Is that I don't need to fear goons, even yellow ones!


methinks she doth protest to much


Methinks you don't like things that bite back!


I'm not the one looking over my shoulder worrying


Something's worrying/upsetting you. I wonder what it could be!

don't worry, they might not grass you up


My local Police have had many, many anonymous letters from kooks and
other pro hunt nuts, trying to have me *done* for various offences.
Luckily, unlike you, the police don't accept hearsay/drivel/bitchiness
as evidence. In fact one unlucky obsessive actually found himself
doing 180 hours community service, not a million miles from you, for
wasting Police time.


aw bless

pete is harassed





[email protected] 23-10-2006 06:15 PM

Council rejects bin fine plea
 
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 18:05:13 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
.. .
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 17:28:00 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 16:51:23 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
om...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 16:02:54 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
news:tmkpj253rsub1r2l00vder9prem232cb99@4ax .com...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 15:33:01 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
news:dljpj2hdmqt0ukqqc03bhdk9be24qd4p9i@4 ax.com...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 15:07:12 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
news:bripj2diur9t2lc9qirn8infofpeg42lj4 @4ax.com...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 14:59:38 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
news:s0hpj2ta37q789tb9t7tal2gsle2446n ...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 14:24:51 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
news:lgepj2ph69m9m6f4v09573r2h36a6a ...
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 13:35:32 +0100, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


"Geoff" wrote in message
news:1ronj2hcdnjn3vi7u7bm3j0fqfrr ...
On Fri, 20 Oct 2006 19:28:08 +0100, Old Codger
wrote:

Sla#s wrote:
Geoff wrote:
On Thu, 19 Oct 2006 09:49:40 +0100, "Pat Gardiner"
wrote:
SNIP

What does an innocent man have to hide from ID cards?



"People willing to trade their freedom for temporary
security
deserve
neither and will lose both."

B Franklin

And

Als die Nazis die Kommunisten holten,
habe ich geschwiegen;
ich war ja kein Kommunist....

Indeed and, given that folk can now have their liberty
restricted
for
long periods 'on suspicion' with no trial, it has already
started.


Good.

yes, they seem to be hitting the animal rights people pretty
hard


Not from where I'm standing

corpse diggers doing time, a good start
they'll be working their way down the list
and just think, with the new laws on the statute they can pull
anyone
in
on
suspicion of terrorism and keep them inside for quite a while

As they already have done to pro hunt nuts.

just watch for the knock on the door

Anytime. How long you nuts been saying that?

pete

There is no pete. Fool. I suppose you could be clinging to that
fake
to avoid confronting your demons? Anytime you or your dumb
buddies
fancy their chances........

wonder if anyone has talked. or perhaps someone has just
forwarded
them
some
of your posts

Why not you? Ask yourself what you could do to save face!


I hardly need to, looking at the number of people you have hacked
off,
With friends like yours pete ;-))

You're wise not to step forward, which is surprising, given the
fact
you're a village idiot.


looking over your shoulder and getting nervous pete,

Of what fatty. You abducting my kids, or hitting women?

LOL I don't think so. Feel free to try.



oh we are twitchy today aren't we

Of what? What could a village idiot possibly do to scare me?

Perhaps you'd like to write to my employers? LOL

The good thing about being loaded, having lots of friends and bold as
brass. Is that I don't need to fear goons, even yellow ones!


methinks she doth protest to much


Methinks you don't like things that bite back!

I'm not the one looking over my shoulder worrying


Something's worrying/upsetting you. I wonder what it could be!

don't worry, they might not grass you up


My local Police have had many, many anonymous letters from kooks and
other pro hunt nuts, trying to have me *done* for various offences.
Luckily, unlike you, the police don't accept hearsay/drivel/bitchiness
as evidence. In fact one unlucky obsessive actually found himself
doing 180 hours community service, not a million miles from you, for
wasting Police time.


aw bless

pete is harassed





I don't see any Pete.

Who's Pete?


Angus Macmillan
www.roots-of-blood.org.uk
www.killhunting.org
www.con-servation.org.uk

All truth passes through three stages:
First, it is ridiculed;
Second, it is violently opposed; and
Third, it is accepted as self-evident.
-- Arthur Schopenhauer (1788-1860)

Jim Webster 23-10-2006 06:37 PM

Council rejects bin fine plea
 

wrote in message
...

aw bless

pete is harassed





I don't see any Pete.

Who's Pete?


someone said something about organ grinders



Mark[_4_] 23-10-2006 06:43 PM

Council rejects bin fine plea
 

wrote:

I don't see any Pete.

Who's Pete?


Oh do pay attention Angus.

To save you having to post this question yet again, let's keep this
simple (as I know you like very simple things)...

Pete is the name of the only person on any of these groups who ever
agrees with you, he may use different signatures as has been pointed
out many times, but it's always Pete.

Remember Angus - if the poster agrees with you, it's Pete. The rest of
us are normal...


[email protected] 23-10-2006 07:09 PM

Council rejects bin fine plea
 
On 23 Oct 2006 10:43:12 -0700, "Mark"
wrote:


wrote:

I don't see any Pete.

Who's Pete?


Oh do pay attention Angus.

To save you having to post this question yet again, let's keep this
simple (as I know you like very simple things)...

Pete is the name of the only person on any of these groups who ever
agrees with you, he may use different signatures as has been pointed
out many times, but it's always Pete.

Remember Angus - if the poster agrees with you, it's Pete. The rest of
us are normal...



You're confused. No-one was agreeing with me and I'm not sure you can
be classed as "normal" :-))


Angus Macmillan
www.roots-of-blood.org.uk
www.killhunting.org
www.con-servation.org.uk

All truth passes through three stages:
First, it is ridiculed;
Second, it is violently opposed; and
Third, it is accepted as self-evident.
-- Arthur Schopenhauer (1788-1860)

Geoff[_5_] 23-10-2006 07:31 PM

Council rejects bin fine plea
 
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 19:09:35 +0100, wrote:

On 23 Oct 2006 10:43:12 -0700, "Mark"
wrote:


wrote:

I don't see any Pete.

Who's Pete?


Oh do pay attention Angus.

To save you having to post this question yet again, let's keep this
simple (as I know you like very simple things)...

Pete is the name of the only person on any of these groups who ever
agrees with you, he may use different signatures as has been pointed
out many times, but it's always Pete.

Remember Angus - if the poster agrees with you, it's Pete. The rest of
us are normal...



You're confused. No-one was agreeing with me and I'm not sure you can
be classed as "normal" :-))


Thinking he could get away with such a claim is laughable in itself!



Geoff[_5_] 23-10-2006 07:32 PM

Council rejects bin fine plea
 
On 23 Oct 2006 10:43:12 -0700, "Mark"
wrote:


wrote:

I don't see any Pete.

Who's Pete?


Oh do pay attention Angus.

To save you having to post this question yet again, let's keep this
simple (as I know you like very simple things)...

Pete is the name of the only person on any of these groups who ever
agrees with you, he may use different signatures as has been pointed
out many times, but it's always Pete.

Remember Angus - if the poster agrees with you, it's Pete. The rest of
us are normal...


If you know who Pete is, could you let Dim Jim know because he is
quite upset, and looking for him. I think he'd like to hurt him.

pearl 23-10-2006 07:55 PM

Council rejects bin fine plea
 
"Mark" wrote in message ups.com...

wrote:

I don't see any Pete.

Who's Pete?


Oh do pay attention Angus.

To save you having to post this question yet again, let's keep this
simple (as I know you like very simple things)...

Pete is the name of the only person on any of these groups who ever
agrees with you, he may use different signatures as has been pointed
out many times, but it's always Pete.

Remember Angus - if the poster agrees with you, it's Pete.


Guess I'm Pete then. :)



Geoff[_5_] 23-10-2006 08:03 PM

Council rejects bin fine plea
 
On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 19:55:45 +0100, "pearl"
wrote:

"Mark" wrote in message ups.com...

wrote:

I don't see any Pete.

Who's Pete?


Oh do pay attention Angus.

To save you having to post this question yet again, let's keep this
simple (as I know you like very simple things)...

Pete is the name of the only person on any of these groups who ever
agrees with you, he may use different signatures as has been pointed
out many times, but it's always Pete.

Remember Angus - if the poster agrees with you, it's Pete.


Guess I'm Pete then. :)


Yeah. Me2.

Geoff[_5_] 24-10-2006 09:45 AM

Blight spray clouds organic claims *Another Soil Association CON?
 
It would seem the Soil Association are rapidly losing credibility
after their recent exposure that they support organic aquaculture
standards
http://tinyurl.com/y3pfh3

It would seem they also think it's OK to spray our spuds with copper!

http://tinyurl.com/y6l9sv
Blight spray clouds organic claims

By Martin Cassidy
BBC Northern Ireland's rural affairs correspondent


Questions have emerged about the marketing and labelling of organic
food after BBC research found artificial chemicals are being used to
control potato blight.

Confirmation that copper oxychloride is being used to control the
fungal disease has come from the Soil Association.

The association promotes organic farming as being free of artificial
chemicals and has admitted that the copper-based blight sprays
represent an "achilles heel".


Consumers assume sprays are not used
Organic farmers are also now asking questions about the sprays which
the Soil Association says are used as a last resort, but which potato
growers say they rely on to produce their crops.

Tom Gilbert, who runs Ballylaggan organic farm in County Antrim,
questions whether organic potato production should even be attempted
in the British isles because of a climate which almost invariably
results in blight infection.

He said: "If you have to spray things to make them succeed, it's not
really what the organic ideal is about. I do it with a heavy heart
spraying them because I don't really approve of it."

'Under review'

Mr Gilbert, who sells directly from his farm shop, makes a point of
telling customers how the produce is grown but down on the high street
shoppers seem confused.

"I just assumed that things like that were not used on organic farms,"
said one.


The BBC's investigation has also found other evidence of disquiet
within the organic sector.

The Soil Association has confirmed that the use of the greenish blue
powder-based sprays is now limited to eight kilos per hectare -
equivalent to three applications during the growing of a potato crop.

With shoppers paying as much as £3 for a small bag of spuds, they may
now be asking what exactly does the organic label stand for


An inquiry to the association's technical department has revealed that
while copper-based blight sprays are permitted for the time being, the
chemicals are now "under review".

All this may leave consumers wondering if there is any evidence of
copper residues in potatoes that reach the shops.


The results of the BBC's research though, are reassuring from a food
safety point of view. The investigation did not highlight any health
concerns.

What is now under the microscope is the definition of organic.

The Soil Association's claim that organically grown crops do not
require artificial chemicals seems somewhat blighted and seems to run
counter to what is happening down on the farm.

With shoppers paying as much as £3 for a small bag of potatoes, they
may now be asking what exactly does the organic label stand for.


also see

http://tinyurl.com/wxlya

It certainly seems as though the standards we thought we were buying
in to, are not quite the standards they would have us believe!



Geoff[_5_] 24-10-2006 10:00 AM

Blight spray clouds organic claims *Another Soil Association CON?
 
On Tue, 24 Oct 2006 09:45:28 +0100, Geoff
wrote:

It would seem the Soil Association are rapidly losing credibility
after their recent exposure that they support organic aquaculture
standards
http://tinyurl.com/y3pfh3

It would seem they also think it's OK to spray our spuds with copper!

http://tinyurl.com/y6l9sv
Blight spray clouds organic claims

By Martin Cassidy
BBC Northern Ireland's rural affairs correspondent


Questions have emerged about the marketing and labelling of organic
food after BBC research found artificial chemicals are being used to
control potato blight.

Confirmation that copper oxychloride is being used to control the
fungal disease has come from the Soil Association.

The association promotes organic farming as being free of artificial
chemicals and has admitted that the copper-based blight sprays
represent an "achilles heel".


Consumers assume sprays are not used
Organic farmers are also now asking questions about the sprays which
the Soil Association says are used as a last resort, but which potato
growers say they rely on to produce their crops.

Tom Gilbert, who runs Ballylaggan organic farm in County Antrim,
questions whether organic potato production should even be attempted
in the British isles because of a climate which almost invariably
results in blight infection.

He said: "If you have to spray things to make them succeed, it's not
really what the organic ideal is about. I do it with a heavy heart
spraying them because I don't really approve of it."

'Under review'

Mr Gilbert, who sells directly from his farm shop, makes a point of
telling customers how the produce is grown but down on the high street
shoppers seem confused.

"I just assumed that things like that were not used on organic farms,"
said one.


The BBC's investigation has also found other evidence of disquiet
within the organic sector.

The Soil Association has confirmed that the use of the greenish blue
powder-based sprays is now limited to eight kilos per hectare -
equivalent to three applications during the growing of a potato crop.

With shoppers paying as much as £3 for a small bag of spuds, they may
now be asking what exactly does the organic label stand for


An inquiry to the association's technical department has revealed that
while copper-based blight sprays are permitted for the time being, the
chemicals are now "under review".

All this may leave consumers wondering if there is any evidence of
copper residues in potatoes that reach the shops.


The results of the BBC's research though, are reassuring from a food
safety point of view. The investigation did not highlight any health
concerns.

What is now under the microscope is the definition of organic.

The Soil Association's claim that organically grown crops do not
require artificial chemicals seems somewhat blighted and seems to run
counter to what is happening down on the farm.

With shoppers paying as much as £3 for a small bag of potatoes, they
may now be asking what exactly does the organic label stand for.


also see

http://tinyurl.com/wxlya

It certainly seems as though the standards we thought we were buying
in to, are not quite the standards they would have us believe!


An example straight from the horses mouth.

***********************************
http://tinyurl.com/y4wjfp
Pest and weed control
Organic farmers use natural systems to prevent pest or disease
problems becoming serious. A range of practices prevents them from
having to resort to pesticides.

The main methods of pest control are; crop rotations, encouraging
natural predators, providing conditions that encourage plant health
and vitality, selecting suitable varieties, alongside various planting
techniques and mechanical weeding methods.

Occasionally the system is unable to cope with a particular pest
problem, this may be as a result of unusual weather conditions that
particularly favour a certain pest or disease. If this happens there
are some carefully selected pesticides that can be used. These have
all been assessed for their impact on human health, the environment
and wildlife. We do not allow the use of any herbicides, because the
other practices should always be sufficient to deal with weed
problems.

Sulphur and copper could be used as a fungicide in an organic
vineyard. Under the Soil Association's standards copper can only be
used if the farmer has got permission from Soil Association
Certification Ltd to do so, and even then no more than 8kg per hectare
can be used per year. This maximum amount of copper is being further
reduced to just 6kg per hectare per year at the beginning of 2006.

Mildew diseases can be a problem for vines, these are kept at bay by
allowing a good flow of air around the vine shoots.

****************************************

That means in a 100h field almost 1 tonne could be dumped (.8)!!!

I dread to think what *normal* farming allows per hectare, but 8kg is
a terrifying thought!

In some crops 25Kg/h is *normal*. That's 2.5tonnes per 100 acre
crop!!!

CRAZY!

No wonder we're doomed.

Nick Maclaren 24-10-2006 10:01 AM

Blight spray clouds organic claims *Another Soil Association CON?
 

In article ,
Geoff writes:
|
| All this may leave consumers wondering if there is any evidence of
| copper residues in potatoes that reach the shops.

And whether it is enough to give them their RDA of copper :-)


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

[email protected] 24-10-2006 10:03 AM

Blight spray clouds organic claims *Another Soil Association CON?
 
On Tue, 24 Oct 2006 09:45:28 +0100, Geoff
wrote:

It would seem the Soil Association are rapidly losing credibility
after their recent exposure that they support organic aquaculture
standards
http://tinyurl.com/y3pfh3

It would seem they also think it's OK to spray our spuds with copper!

http://tinyurl.com/y6l9sv
Blight spray clouds organic claims

By Martin Cassidy
BBC Northern Ireland's rural affairs correspondent


Questions have emerged about the marketing and labelling of organic
food after BBC research found artificial chemicals are being used to
control potato blight.

Confirmation that copper oxychloride is being used to control the
fungal disease has come from the Soil Association.

The association promotes organic farming as being free of artificial
chemicals and has admitted that the copper-based blight sprays
represent an "achilles heel".


Consumers assume sprays are not used
Organic farmers are also now asking questions about the sprays which
the Soil Association says are used as a last resort, but which potato
growers say they rely on to produce their crops.

Tom Gilbert, who runs Ballylaggan organic farm in County Antrim,
questions whether organic potato production should even be attempted
in the British isles because of a climate which almost invariably
results in blight infection.

He said: "If you have to spray things to make them succeed, it's not
really what the organic ideal is about. I do it with a heavy heart
spraying them because I don't really approve of it."

'Under review'

Mr Gilbert, who sells directly from his farm shop, makes a point of
telling customers how the produce is grown but down on the high street
shoppers seem confused.

"I just assumed that things like that were not used on organic farms,"
said one.


The BBC's investigation has also found other evidence of disquiet
within the organic sector.

The Soil Association has confirmed that the use of the greenish blue
powder-based sprays is now limited to eight kilos per hectare -
equivalent to three applications during the growing of a potato crop.

With shoppers paying as much as £3 for a small bag of spuds, they may
now be asking what exactly does the organic label stand for


An inquiry to the association's technical department has revealed that
while copper-based blight sprays are permitted for the time being, the
chemicals are now "under review".

All this may leave consumers wondering if there is any evidence of
copper residues in potatoes that reach the shops.


The results of the BBC's research though, are reassuring from a food
safety point of view. The investigation did not highlight any health
concerns.

What is now under the microscope is the definition of organic.

The Soil Association's claim that organically grown crops do not
require artificial chemicals seems somewhat blighted and seems to run
counter to what is happening down on the farm.

With shoppers paying as much as £3 for a small bag of potatoes, they
may now be asking what exactly does the organic label stand for.


also see

http://tinyurl.com/wxlya

It certainly seems as though the standards we thought we were buying
in to, are not quite the standards they would have us believe!


Indeed! It seems so.


Angus Macmillan
www.roots-of-blood.org.uk
www.killhunting.org
www.con-servation.org.uk

All truth passes through three stages:
First, it is ridiculed;
Second, it is violently opposed; and
Third, it is accepted as self-evident.
-- Arthur Schopenhauer (1788-1860)

Geoff[_5_] 24-10-2006 10:10 AM

Blight spray clouds organic claims *Another Soil Association CON?
 
On 24 Oct 2006 09:01:58 GMT, (Nick Maclaren) wrote:


In article ,
Geoff writes:
|
| All this may leave consumers wondering if there is any evidence of
| copper residues in potatoes that reach the shops.

And whether it is enough to give them their RDA of copper :-)


Give or take, it far, far exceeds our minimal requirements

Copper Recommended Dietary Allowance
(milligrams/day)
Adult 0.9
Pregnant woman 1.0
Nursing mother 1.3


And we get more than enough in a good diet, without adding any!

Sources of copper

The table below indicates the approximate copper content in a range
of foods:





Food Copper
(mg/100g
edible portion)
Potato 0.22 Baked, without salt, flesh only
Potato 0.17 Boiled, no skin, no salt
Mushrooms 0.24 Canned, drained
Green Peas 0.14 Frozen, cooked, drained, no salt
Banana 0.10 Raw
Raisins 0.36 Golden, seedless
Peanuts 0.67 Dry roasted, no salt
Peanuts 1.14 Raw
Brazil Nuts 1.77 Dried, unblanched
Chick Peas 0.17 Canned
Chick Peas 0.85 Raw
Sunflower Seeds 1.75 Kernels, dried
Chocolate (Dark) 0.80 Dark chocolate bar




Geoff[_5_] 24-10-2006 10:57 AM

Blight spray clouds organic claims *Another Soil Association CON?
 
On Tue, 24 Oct 2006 10:10:51 +0100, Geoff
wrote:

On 24 Oct 2006 09:01:58 GMT, (Nick Maclaren) wrote:


In article ,
Geoff writes:
|
| All this may leave consumers wondering if there is any evidence of
| copper residues in potatoes that reach the shops.

And whether it is enough to give them their RDA of copper :-)


Give or take, it far, far exceeds our minimal requirements

Copper Recommended Dietary Allowance
(milligrams/day)
Adult 0.9
Pregnant woman 1.0
Nursing mother 1.3


And we get more than enough in a good diet, without adding any!

Sources of copper

The table below indicates the approximate copper content in a range
of foods:





Food Copper
(mg/100g
edible portion)
Potato 0.22 Baked, without salt, flesh only
Potato 0.17 Boiled, no skin, no salt
Mushrooms 0.24 Canned, drained
Green Peas 0.14 Frozen, cooked, drained, no salt
Banana 0.10 Raw
Raisins 0.36 Golden, seedless
Peanuts 0.67 Dry roasted, no salt
Peanuts 1.14 Raw
Brazil Nuts 1.77 Dried, unblanched
Chick Peas 0.17 Canned
Chick Peas 0.85 Raw
Sunflower Seeds 1.75 Kernels, dried
Chocolate (Dark) 0.80 Dark chocolate bar



So. What happens if we get too much copper?

HIGH COPPER

Copper levels are more often too high rather than too low. High copper
can be toxic.

Physical Symptoms of High Copper: Headaches….Hypoglycemia….Increased
heart rate….Nausea

Copper deposits in the brain and liver….Damage to the kidneys….Inhibit
urine production….Causes anemia….Causes hair loss in women….High
copper interferes with zinc, which is needed to manufacture digestive
enzymes. Many high copper people dislike protein and are drawn to
high-carbohydrate diets because they have difficulty digesting protein
foods….Excessive copper in children is associated with hyperactive
behavior, learning disorders such as dyslexia, ADD and infections such
as ear.

Psychological Symptoms of High Copper: Autism type
symptoms….Depression….Hallucinations

Hyperactivity….Insomnia….Paranoia….Personality
changes….Psychosis….Schizophrenic type symptoms

Overstimulation….Disperception of the senses, time, body, self and
others. Produces hypomanic states

Detachment from reality.

As we can see, I would suggest many here already exhibit many of these
symptoms!



Geoff[_5_] 24-10-2006 11:06 AM

Blight spray clouds organic claims *Another Soil Association CON?
 
On Tue, 24 Oct 2006 10:57:58 +0100, Geoff
wrote:

On Tue, 24 Oct 2006 10:10:51 +0100, Geoff
wrote:

On 24 Oct 2006 09:01:58 GMT, (Nick Maclaren) wrote:


In article ,
Geoff writes:
|
| All this may leave consumers wondering if there is any evidence of
| copper residues in potatoes that reach the shops.

And whether it is enough to give them their RDA of copper :-)


Give or take, it far, far exceeds our minimal requirements

Copper Recommended Dietary Allowance
(milligrams/day)
Adult 0.9
Pregnant woman 1.0
Nursing mother 1.3


And we get more than enough in a good diet, without adding any!

Sources of copper

The table below indicates the approximate copper content in a range
of foods:





Food Copper
(mg/100g
edible portion)
Potato 0.22 Baked, without salt, flesh only
Potato 0.17 Boiled, no skin, no salt
Mushrooms 0.24 Canned, drained
Green Peas 0.14 Frozen, cooked, drained, no salt
Banana 0.10 Raw
Raisins 0.36 Golden, seedless
Peanuts 0.67 Dry roasted, no salt
Peanuts 1.14 Raw
Brazil Nuts 1.77 Dried, unblanched
Chick Peas 0.17 Canned
Chick Peas 0.85 Raw
Sunflower Seeds 1.75 Kernels, dried
Chocolate (Dark) 0.80 Dark chocolate bar



So. What happens if we get too much copper?

HIGH COPPER

Copper levels are more often too high rather than too low. High copper
can be toxic.

Physical Symptoms of High Copper: Headaches….Hypoglycemia….Increased
heart rate….Nausea

Copper deposits in the brain and liver….Damage to the kidneys….Inhibit
urine production….Causes anemia….Causes hair loss in women….High
copper interferes with zinc, which is needed to manufacture digestive
enzymes. Many high copper people dislike protein and are drawn to
high-carbohydrate diets because they have difficulty digesting protein
foods….Excessive copper in children is associated with hyperactive
behavior, learning disorders such as dyslexia, ADD and infections such
as ear.

Psychological Symptoms of High Copper: Autism type
symptoms….Depression….Hallucinations

Hyperactivity….Insomnia….Paranoia….Personality
changes….Psychosis….Schizophrenic type symptoms

Overstimulation….Disperception of the senses, time, body, self and
others. Produces hypomanic states

Detachment from reality.

As we can see, I would suggest many here already exhibit many of these
symptoms!


Further

CHEMICAL FOOD SAFETY QUARTERLY REPORT from DEFRA themselves shows
whats going into the food chain, one way or another!

POTENTIAL FOOD SAFETY INCIDENTS OCTOBER - DECEMBER 2005
SPECIES INCIDENT NO. DATE VLA LABORATORY TOXIN
Avian 2005/76 25.11.05 Bury St Edmunds Organophosphorus
Cattle 2005/66 03.10.05 Penrith Botulism
Cattle 2005/67 03.10.05 Penrith Botulism
Cattle 2005/71 18.11.05 Shrewsbury Botulism
Cattle 2005/75 24.11.05 Preston Botulism
Cattle 2005/77 08.12.05 Thirsk Botulism
Cattle 2005/79 13.12.05 Newcastle Botulism
Cattle 2005/80 13.12.05 Preston Botulism
Cattle 2005/68 18.10.05 Starcross Copper
Cattle 2005/73 28.11.05 Carmarthen Lead
Cattle 2005/78 06.12.05 Newcastle Lead
Cattle 2005/83 22.12.05 Langford Lead
Cattle 2005/74 23.11.05 Starcross Metaldehyde
Cattle 2005/81 19.12.05 Shrewsbury Mycotoxin
Cattle 2005/69 21.10.05 Aberystwyth Rodenticide
Sheep 2005/82 19.12.05 Preston Botulism
Sheep 2005/70 12.11.05 Langford Copper
Sheep 2005/72 18.11.05 Luddington Copper

LEAD POISONING IN CATTLE
2005/73 Lead poisoning was diagnosed in a 6-week-old calf, the second
to die in a group of 27 that were individually penned in an old
cowshed. Two animals at the back of the shed were adjacent to a wooden
wall that had lead paint on it. Prior to this group being housed,
pallets had prevented access to this wooden wall.

2005/78 Lead poisoning was diagnosed in a group of suckler cows and
calves when one
calf was found dead and a second showed clinical signs consistent with
lead poisoning.
Both calves had been on the same pasture since birth. There was a
small mound of earth
in the field, which appeared to be an old rubbish tip with a
significant amount of agricultural
and domestic rubbish including fencing material, glass, ceramics and
metallic waste. Only

October – December 2005
low levels of lead were found in environmental samples collected from
the site but no other
possible sources of lead could be identified.

2005/83 A raised kidney lead level was found in a 1-year old Red Devon
cow which died
from hypomagnesaemia. The elevated lead level was thought due to
geochemical
exposure from Roman and other lead mining on the Mendips.

COPPER IN CATTLE

2005/68 Investigations were carried out after a cow submitted for
post-mortem
examination was found to have a liver copper level of 536 mg/kg WM,
although the cause
of death of the cow was bronchopneumonia. The diet had included a high
level of
concentrates with copper levels of between 45-50 mg/kg. It was
calculated that an
average yielding cow would have had a copper intake of approximately
36.6 mg Cu/kg
DM, which exceeds the legal limit without a veterinary prescription of
35 mg Cu/kg DM.
The cows received no other copper supplementation. The dietary
management was
changed and a mixer wagon was put into use feeding a TMR. After the
changes a high
yielder was estimated to have a maximum copper intake of 22 mg Cu/kg
DM daily.

COPPER IN SHEEP

2005/70 Copper toxicity was diagnosed in a small flock of North
Ronaldsay ewes. Three
ewes were found dead over a period of a few days. The third animal to
die was submitted
for examination. Post-mortem findings were strongly suggestive of
copper poisoning
which was confirmed by copper analysis. The liver copper was 514 mg/kg
WM. The
history of the incident suggested that there was a strong possibility
that pig feed had been
fed to the sheep. However North Ronaldsay sheep are particularly prone
to copper
poisoning and can succumb to poisoning even when fed sheep concentrate
at only slightly
higher than recommended levels.
2005/72 Copper poisoning was diagnosed in an adult Friesland ewe that
had died
suddenly on a 750 dairy sheep farm with previous cases of copper
poisoning. The copper
level in the liver was 571 mg/kg WM. Friesland sheep are susceptible
to copper toxicity
and the need for intensive concentrate feeding predisposes the ewes to
chronic
accumulation of copper. Blood samples from 14 ewes indicated elevated
GLDH levels in
ten. Although other causes of liver damage could not be ruled out it
was thought that the
raised GLDH was a likely result of excess copper in the feed. It was
recommended to
assess the copper liver levels of fallen stock on a regular basis.

BOTULISM IN CATTLE

2005/66 and 2005/67 Botulism, caused by poultry litter from the same
chicken farm, was
suspected as the cause of deaths on two farms. A total of nine animals
died. They were
all grazing fields adjacent to where the litter had been spread and
clinical signs occurred
within a week of that event. Six carcases were received for post
mortem examination and
no alternative diagnosis could be made, suggesting that botulism was
the cause of death.
A sample of intestinal contents from one case was sent for analysis
and, although toxin
could not be detected in gut contents, Clostridium botulinum Type D
was recovered on
culture. Poultry carcases were recovered from the spread litter and
the local Trading
Standards were informed.
2005/67
2005/71 Botulism was suspected in two 8-9-month-old dairy heifers at
grass. They had
been grazing in fields adjacent to a neighbouring farm on which a
large broiler enterprise
was sited. Disease occurred approximately 7 and 12 days after
depopulation of the broiler
flock at which time the litter was removed from the houses and heaped
for 3-4 days before
collection for incineration. The dairy farmer commented that chicken
carcases had been
found on his premises in the past and the moving of broiler carcase
material by foxes from
the litter to the dairy farm was suspected to be the cause in this
case.
2005/75 A 4-year-old dry cow was submitted after being euthanased with
clinical signs of
recumbency which was unresponsive to standard milk fever therapy.
Three out of 40
animals had been affected. Botulism was suspected as the animals were
bedded on
broiler litter. Post-mortem examination identified acute abomasal
ulceration and
haemorrhage and an acute haemorrhagic enteritis but no alternative
findings were
detected to account for the clinical signs.
2005/77 Botulism was suspected in a 2-year-old pregnant dairy heifer
on a farm that had
cases of suspected botulism in September 2005 (SFS 05/65). The heifer
was one of a
group of 20 pregnant and non-pregnant heifers brought back in batches
after grazing away
from the home farm. They were initially put onto the same field where
disease had
occurred in September, for only 3-4 days, before being housed.
Although broiler litter was
not present on the farm, there was a broiler farm sited across the
road from the farm.
2005/79 Weakness, ataxia and recumbency were reported among a group of
yearling bulls
and botulism was considered as a possible differential diagnosis. The
worst affected
animal was euthanased on humane grounds and submitted for post-mortem.
No evidence
to refute the diagnosis of botulism could be found on gross
examination, histopathology,
biochemistry or haematology. The source of the toxin could not be
detected.
2005/80 Botulism was suspected when an 18-month-old beef store-heifer
on rented
grazing was found dead and two days later two further animals of the
group of 26 were
found recumbent. One died, but the other made a gradual recovery.
Clinical signs were
consistent with botulism and a haemorrhagic enteritis was found on
gross post-mortem
examination. Laboratory tests failed to identify any other cause of
disease. The group did
not have direct access to poultry litter, although there was a large
stack of the material in a
neighbour’s field adjacent to where the affected cattle were grazing.

BOTULISM IN SHEEP

2005/82 A large outbreak of botulism was
seen in pregnant ewes due to lamb in March.
A total of at least 80 were lost out of a group of
230. They had been kept for 36 hours on
pasture top dressed with broiler litter five
weeks previously, prior to being dosed and
moved to fresh pasture.

OTHER INCIDENTS

Rodenticide
2005/69 A report was received that a group of 120 housed cows have
been exposed to the
rodenticide bromadiolone. The cows had been turned out into a
collecting yard and three
cows gained access to a bucket of rodenticide in an adjacent disused
milking parlour. The
rodenticide had been placed there without the knowledge of the
stockman. The three
cows consumed most of the contents of the 3 kg bucket but none showed
any clinical
signs. The exposed animals were suckler cows not intended for the food
chain.

Metaldehyde
2005/74 Metaldehyde poisoning was diagnosed when two cows and two
yearling heifers
broke into a shed and gained access to slug pellets. The animals
developed neurological
signs soon afterwards. One cow and one heifer died, the others
recovered. The dead
heifer was submitted for post-mortem examination. Blue-green fluid
poured from the nose
when the carcase was hoisted and the mucosa of the fore-stomachs was
discoloured blue,
although no recognisable slug pellets were found. Metaldehyde was
confirmed in the
rumen contents.

Mycotoxin
2005/81 Two intensively reared bulls were submitted for post-mortem
examination within
four days of each other. A third bull had died with acute onset
gasping and collapse when
the animals were moved to be weighed. At that time the two other
animals were noticed to
be unwell, and as pneumonia was suspected, they were treated with
antibiotic. One of the
bulls died two days later, the second was found collapsed six days
later. Post-mortem
examinations revealed similar pathological features with jaundice,
swollen tan-coloured
livers and dark swollen kidneys. A large amount of bilirubin and
haemoglobin was
detected in the urine. Kidney copper concentration was significantly
elevated in the first
animal, consistent with copper poisoning. Although the liver and blood
copper
concentrations were increased in the second, the kidney copper
concentration was within
the reference range. The animals were fed good quality proprietary
concentrate and good
quality straw but were bedded on poor quality 2-year old straw on
which weed and mould
growth was reported. Histopathological examinations revealed severe
hepatopathy and a
tubulo-nephritis, lesions consistent with, although not confirmatory
of, a mycotoxic cause.
The copper toxicity in one of the animals was considered secondary to
underlying hepatic
changes. All the straw used as bedding was removed from the pens,
which were rebedded
using alternative clean straw. No further disease was reported.
2005/82
Organophosphorus
2005/76 Malicious poisoning of pheasants with an organophosphate
pesticide was
diagnosed when approximately 190 of about 500 birds released into a
wooded area were
found dead over a period of four days. A blue chemical was found in
the area and blue
crop content in one of the birds indicated exposure. Samples sent for
toxicological
investigation were shown to contain the organophosphate omephoate
(‘Folimat’: Bayer
Cropscience).

FOOD SAFETY INCIDENTS 2005

Toxin No. of Incidents Species
Lead 44 (47) Cattle 41, Sheep 2, Avian 1
Botulism 23 (22) Cattle 20, Sheep 3
Copper 7 (3) Cattle 1, Sheep 6
No Toxin 2 (0) Cattle 1, Avian 1
Organophosphorus 2 (0) Cattle 1, Avian 1
Metaldehyde 1 (2) Cattle
Mycotoxin 1 (1) Cattle
Nitrate 1 (1) Cattle
Rodenticide 1 (0) Cattle
Not Established 1 (2) Cattle
Total 83 (81) Cattle 69, Sheep 11,
Avian 3
2004 figures in brackets
“Stories in the press”


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