Hi Everyone
Can anyone tell me what kind of trees I should plant for regular
coppicing for burning on a woodburning stove? I want something that
will burn well, but not take donkey's years to grow (I'm a bit of an
old donkey to start with!)

Our soil is poor, acid and stony.

TIA

Joan in Ayrshire
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In article ,
Ken writes:
|
| Can anyone tell me what kind of trees I should plant for regular
| coppicing for burning on a woodburning stove? I want something that
| will burn well, but not take donkey's years to grow (I'm a bit of an
| old donkey to start with!)
|
| Our soil is poor, acid and stony.

That's your problem. Look around and see what deciduous trees grow
naturally (or well), and try them. Rowan will grow, if you are
prepared to risk the witches' wrath. But, traditionally, people
generally used gorse for fuel on that sort of land.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

"Ken" wrote in message
...
Hi Everyone
Can anyone tell me what kind of trees I should plant for regular
coppicing for burning on a woodburning stove? I want something that
will burn well, but not take donkey's years to grow (I'm a bit of an
old donkey to start with!)

Our soil is poor, acid and stony.

TIA

Joan in Ayrshire
remove 'spam' from email to reply

Hazel Birch Poplar and Willows will tolerate poor soils and were trees of
choice for the coppices of the past and the biosmass projects of today.
Derek

In article ,
"Derek" writes:
| "Ken" wrote in message
| ...
|
| Can anyone tell me what kind of trees I should plant for regular
| coppicing for burning on a woodburning stove? I want something that
| will burn well, but not take donkey's years to grow (I'm a bit of an
| old donkey to start with!)
|
| Our soil is poor, acid and stony.
|
| Hazel Birch Poplar and Willows will tolerate poor soils and were trees of
| choice for the coppices of the past and the biosmass projects of today.

Not really. My understanding is that birch is one of the few native
deciduous trees that doesn't coppice well, and poplars were not
traditionally coppiced. All of those except hazel and, to a lesser
extent, birch are 'pulpwoods' and do not burn well. Hazel will just
about tolerate poor soils, but grows well only on very rich ones.

Birch is a good bet, but might involve a different management; i.e.
growing a mixture of ages, and removing the 'mature' trees for fuel.
But even that won't grow fast on that soil.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

"Ken" wrote
Can anyone tell me what kind of trees I should plant for regular
coppicing for burning on a woodburning stove? I want something that
will burn well, but not take donkey's years to grow (I'm a bit of an
old donkey to start with!)

Our soil is poor, acid and stony.


Hardwoods are better than softwoods once a fire is going as they take longer
to burn, Hornbeam is a hard wood that takes well to Coppicing and is a UK
native. (hornbeam means horn tree, referring to its hardness)
Coppicing is, by it's nature, a long term investment and for decent firewood
I would expect a 20 to 25 (or more) year cycle to be the time you need to
think about. However with a poor soil it may take longer.

--
Regards
Bob Hobden

Hi Joan,

For what it's worth I grew up in woodland (down south).

Ash 'burns fierce when it is green' - and will readily shoot when cut from
the base. It should grow well where you are. Rowan is of course an ash...
but is not usually 'coppiced'. The Rowan's berries are very valuable for
winter feeding birds, attractive, and so best left for decorative use.

Ash, like Hazel, is also reasonably 'quick' growing, and is an extremely
useful timber to have around - ash has a strong grain and grows very
straight 'without knots'. It doesn't rot or split easily either, and so is
perfect for tool handles and fencing stakes.

Hazel is normally coppiced every 14 years ;-)

Willow is lousy for fires, much too sappy.

Keith

Ken wrote:

Hi Everyone
Can anyone tell me what kind of trees I should plant for regular
coppicing for burning on a woodburning stove? I want something that
will burn well, but not take donkey's years to grow (I'm a bit of an
old donkey to start with!)

Our soil is poor, acid and stony.

There's some information you don't give which could influence the
answer, such as how much wood you expect to use, how much land you can
put down to trees, whether you live above the tree-line or right on the
coast, and so on.

I don't think acid or stony are particularly problematic, as woodland
soils are naturally acidic, I believe, but coppicing is an intensive use
of land and a poor soil won't allow intensive production. Economics
comes into the equation here. You could improve the soil while growing
the trees but you'd have to import something --manure, compost or
topsoil-- to give the new planting a good start. If you only want the
occasional cheery fire in winter, though, you might be better off simply
buying logs.

I think the best trees for this use would be ash, sycamore (or Norway
maple), birch, and possibly sweet chestnut, if these will grow in your
area. They are all good burning wood, unlike poplar and willow. Ash and
sycamore both sprout readily from a robust root system. However, if time
is of the essence, coppicing may not be the best bet. Instead, you might
think of planting much closer, perhaps 1200 - 1500 to the acre, in order
to have more wood sooner. When coppicing for firewood the initial tree
needs to grow to more or less log-size, say 4" diameter, before cutting
to form the stool in order to have a solid root system. On good soil
that means about 10-12 years, longer on poor soil. The stool then grows
more quickly because it doesn't have to establish roots, but it's still
a longish time before you have a sustainable system. Perhaps, depending
on how much land is to be used, the plantation could be divided, with an
intial stand planted very close while you extend/improve the rest over
time.

On the actual planting I would dig trenches at the required spacing,
perhaps with the help of a local farmer and a ridging plough or
something, fill those with imported topsoil and plant cell-grown trees
in that. This would give them a decent start and allow you a year or two
during which you could get a tiller between the rows for working more
soil-improving material in. IME trees don't respond particularly well to
applied fertilisers, except that young trees will benefit a lot from a
liberal dressing of superphosphate for the first year or two while they
establish roots.

Another problem with a poor soil, especially on a slope, is poor water
retention. Trees need a lot of water. I'm growing them on a Welsh hill
and in high summer for the first 5 years or so had to water them; quite
a job when there's hundreds. Birch seem quite sensitive in this regard.

And after all that there's the matter of protection, from rabbits, deer,
gales and who knows what else. Stakes, tree guards, fencing... You don't
--or may not-- have to do any of that if you have a lot of land and a
lot of time and can let the trees fend for themselves. It may be your
grandchildren who get to burn the wood, though.

HTH

Brian Mitchell

In article ,
"Keith \(Dorset\)" writes:
|
| For what it's worth I grew up in woodland (down south).
|
| Ash 'burns fierce when it is green' - and will readily shoot when cut from
| the base. It should grow well where you are. Rowan is of course an ash...
| but is not usually 'coppiced'. The Rowan's berries are very valuable for
| winter feeding birds, attractive, and so best left for decorative use.

Ash won't like poor, acid stony soils at all - and rowan is only called
an ash (it isn't closely related).


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

In article ,
brian mitchell writes:
| Ken wrote:
|
| Can anyone tell me what kind of trees I should plant for regular
| coppicing for burning on a woodburning stove? I want something that
| will burn well, but not take donkey's years to grow (I'm a bit of an
| old donkey to start with!)
|
| Our soil is poor, acid and stony.
|
| I don't think acid or stony are particularly problematic, as woodland
| soils are naturally acidic, ....

Acidity isn't a simple on/off factor. The acidity of woodland soils
is a result of the humus; acidity in clay is also a different matter
from acidity in peat, which is different from acidity in stony soils.
Some of them cause serious problems; others don't.

| I think the best trees for this use would be ash, sycamore (or Norway
| maple), birch, and possibly sweet chestnut, if these will grow in your
| area. They are all good burning wood, unlike poplar and willow. ...

My guess is that the only one of those that would grow in that soil
is birch. But it depends on HOW poor and acid the soil is, and WHY.
He should certainly look around and see what grows in the area.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

In message , "Keith (Dorset)"
writes
Hi Joan,

For what it's worth I grew up in woodland (down south).

Ash 'burns fierce when it is green' - and will readily shoot when cut from
the base. It should grow well where you are. Rowan is of course an ash...
but is not usually 'coppiced'. The Rowan's berries are very valuable for
winter feeding birds, attractive, and so best left for decorative use.

Like the eucalyptus, botanically rowan is not an ash. An ash is a member
of genus Fraxinus in the Oleaceae (olive family); a rowan (or mountain
ash) is a member of genus Sorbus sensu strictu in the Rosaceae (rose
family). (Sorbus sensu lato includes also includes whitebeams and
service trees). There's also a prickly ash, not closely related to
either.

There is little similarity between ashes and rowans - other than the
pinnate leaves and arborescent habit.

Ash, like Hazel, is also reasonably 'quick' growing, and is an extremely
useful timber to have around - ash has a strong grain and grows very
straight 'without knots'. It doesn't rot or split easily either, and so is
perfect for tool handles and fencing stakes.

Hazel is normally coppiced every 14 years ;-)

Willow is lousy for fires, much too sappy.

Keith


--
Stewart Robert Hinsley

"Nick Maclaren" wrote in message
...

In article ,
"Derek" writes:
| "Ken" wrote in message
| ...
|
| Can anyone tell me what kind of trees I should plant for regular
| coppicing for burning on a woodburning stove? I want something that
| will burn well, but not take donkey's years to grow (I'm a bit of an
| old donkey to start with!)
|
| Our soil is poor, acid and stony.
|
| Hazel Birch Poplar and Willows will tolerate poor soils and were trees
of
| choice for the coppices of the past and the biosmass projects of today.

Not really. My understanding is that birch is one of the few native
deciduous trees that doesn't coppice well, and poplars were not
traditionally coppiced. All of those except hazel and, to a lesser
extent, birch are 'pulpwoods' and do not burn well. Hazel will just
about tolerate poor soils, but grows well only on very rich ones.

Birch is a good bet, but might involve a different management; i.e.
growing a mixture of ages, and removing the 'mature' trees for fuel.
But even that won't grow fast on that soil.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

According to the Forestry Commission poplar are now regarded as one
of the short rotation (2/3yrs) biomass candidates yields approximate to
willows http://www.forestry.gov.uk/src which I guess is pretty close to
whats required Birch has long been coppiced for the production of charcoal
as a colonising species often the first to grow successfully on burnt or
previously flooded or developed ground so could be the best bet if the
gorund is really rocky with thin sandy soils , as you say will need drying.
whatever species is planted tho' for the coppicing to persist they will
need an input of nutrients over time I'd stick my neck out and say the hazel
will largely depend on variety I have seen them growing in some very
inhospitable places though its possible they were established at a time when
the ground was more fertile. Cuttings ( or suckers if no one is looking )
don't cost much so they must be worth a try. I missed out this year when
contractors levelled the hazels at work while the nuts were just coming ripe
too :-(
Derek

In article ,
"Derek" writes:
|
| According to the Forestry Commission poplar are now regarded as one
| of the short rotation (2/3yrs) biomass candidates ...

Poplar is another pulpwood, and doesn't burn much better than willow.
It also is a tree of alluvial plains, and doesn't do well on stony,
poor hillsides.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

In message , Nick Maclaren
writes

In article ,
"Derek" writes:
|
| According to the Forestry Commission poplar are now regarded as one
| of the short rotation (2/3yrs) biomass candidates ...

Poplar is another pulpwood, and doesn't burn much better than willow.
It also is a tree of alluvial plains, and doesn't do well on stony,
poor hillsides.

What about aspen? (I don't know about the European form, but the
American species should be coppiceable.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

--
Stewart Robert Hinsley

In article ,
Stewart Robert Hinsley writes:
|
| Poplar is another pulpwood, and doesn't burn much better than willow.
| It also is a tree of alluvial plains, and doesn't do well on stony,
| poor hillsides.
|
| What about aspen? (I don't know about the European form, but the
| American species should be coppiceable.

It would definitely seem worth trying.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

On 28 Apr, 10:16, (Nick Maclaren) wrote:
In article ,
Stewart Robert Hinsley writes:
|
| Poplar is another pulpwood, and doesn't burn much better than willow.
| It also is a tree of alluvial plains, and doesn't do well on stony,
| poor hillsides.
|
| What about aspen? (I don't know about the European form, but the
| American species should be coppiceable.

It would definitely seem worth trying.

Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

WOOD HEAT


Beech wood fires are bright and clear
If the logs are kept a year.
Chestnuts only good, they say
If for long its laid away.
But ash wood new or ash wood old
Is fit for a queen with a crown of gold.
Birch and fir logs burn too fast,
Blaze up bright and do not last.
Is by the Irish said
Hawthorn bakes the sweetest bread.
Elm wood burns like churchyard mould -
Even the very flames are cold;
But ash wood green and ash wood brown
Is fit for a queen with a golden crown.
Poplar gives a bitter smoke,
Fills your eyes and makes you choke.
Apple wood will scent your room
With an incense like perfume.
Oaken logs if dry and old
Keep away the winter cold.
But ash wood wet and ash wood dry
A king shall warm his slippers by.

Oak logs will warm you well,
If they're warm and dry.
Larch logs of pine wood smell
But sparks will fly.
Beech logs for Christmas time;
Yew logs heat well.
Scotch logs its a crime
For anyone to sell.
Birch logs will burn too fast,
Chestnut scarce at all.
Hawthorn logs are good to last,
If cut in the fall.
Holly logs will burn like wax,
You should burn them green.
Elm logs like smouldering flax;
No flames to be seen.
Pear logs and apple logs,
They will scent your room.
Cherry logs across the dogs
Smell like flowers in bloom.
But ash logs all smooth and gray,
Burn them green or old,
Buy up all that come you way,
They're worth their weight in gold.


From Tree farm by John Estabrook

David Hill
Abacus Nurseries