what whitebeam is this? (is this a whitebeam?)
 

I came across this whitebeam sapling yesterday, but on second thoughts
I'm not sure what it is. Any ideas?

http://florulaurbana.blogspot.com/20...m-is-this.html
--
Stewart Robert Hinsley

what whitebeam is this? (is this a whitebeam?)
 

"Stewart Robert Hinsley" wrote in message
...
I came across this whitebeam sapling yesterday, but on second thoughts I'm
not sure what it is. Any ideas?

http://florulaurbana.blogspot.com/20...m-is-this.html
--


I think it could be ******* service tree.

what whitebeam is this? (is this a whitebeam?)
 

In sci.bio.botany Stewart Robert Hinsley wrote:
: I came across this whitebeam sapling yesterday, but on second thoughts
: I'm not sure what it is. Any ideas?

: http://florulaurbana.blogspot.com/20...m-is-this.html
: --
: Stewart Robert Hinsley

It is certainly not Sorbus intermedia. It looks very much like Sorbus
hybrida. If it were in Finland, it would certainly be hybrida, but there
are other similar species elsewhere in Europe.

--
Erkki 'Örkki' Aalto "Life is divided up into
Internet: the horrible and the miserable"
Snail: Tietotekniikkaosasto, P.O. Box 64
FI-00014 University of Helsinki, Finland

what whitebeam is this? (is this a whitebeam?)
 

On Thu, 12 Jun 2008 15:39:46 +0100, Stewart Robert Hinsley
wrote:

I came across this whitebeam sapling yesterday, but on second thoughts
I'm not sure what it is. Any ideas?

http://florulaurbana.blogspot.com/20...m-is-this.html

Whitebeam doesn't have cut leaves like on the photo. I'd go with
Christina's Service Tree suggestion but I'm not sure which variety it
could be.

Chris R.

what whitebeam is this? (is this a whitebeam?)
 

Stewart Robert Hinsley wrote:

http://florulaurbana.blogspot.com/20...m-is-this.html

Where geographically are you? There are a number (15 - 20 ?) of sorbus
microspecies around the UK (S. bristoliensis, S. Willmotiana, S.
Devoniensis .....), with a variety of leaf shapes. Your locality might
be as good an indicator as anything else ....
--
Larry Stoter

what whitebeam is this? (is this a whitebeam?)
 

Cheb wrote:
On Thu, 12 Jun 2008 15:39:46 +0100, Stewart Robert Hinsley
wrote:

I came across this whitebeam sapling yesterday, but on second
thoughts I'm not sure what it is. Any ideas?

http://florulaurbana.blogspot.com/20...m-is-this.html

Whitebeam doesn't have cut leaves like on the photo. I'd go with
Christina's Service Tree suggestion but I'm not sure which variety it
could be.

I am reasonably sure it's ******* Service Tree. Everything about the leaf
fits and the colour of the shoot is right.
I'm not an expert, though, could easily be wrong ;-)

what whitebeam is this? (is this a whitebeam?)
 

In message , Stewart Robert Hinsley
writes
I came across this whitebeam sapling yesterday, but on second thoughts
I'm not sure what it is. Any ideas?

http://florulaurbana.blogspot.com/20...m-is-this.html

Thanks everyone for your suggestions.

My newsfeed was down most of today, but in the interim I've added some
more observations and photographs to the blog. Same URL.

http://florulaurbana.blogspot.com/20...m-is-this.html

There are 4 Sorbus found in the UK which have free basal leaflets -
Sorbus x thuringiaca (******* service tree = aucuparia x aria), Sorbus x
liljeforsii (aucuparia x intermedia), Sorbus hybrida (Swedish service
tree) and Sorbus pseudofennica (Arran service tree). (Note: these plants
may be service trees, but they're still whitebeams in my idiolect.) None
of the other British endemics have, fide Stace, free basal leaflets, nor
are they known to occur in this area; the only Sorbus recorded wild from
the hectad (up to 2000) are aucuparia, aria (agg.) and latifolia. (So
confirmation that I also ran across torminalis today would be nice.)

The first three taxa have scattered records over the British Isles.
(Sorbus x thuringica is about twice as common as the other two.)

Sorbus x thuringiaca and Sorbus x liljeforsii would be expected to have
more free basal leaflets and more lateral veins that the plant I
encounted; hence my second thoughts that it was Sorbus hybrida, rather
than my original misidentification on cursory examination as Sorbus
intermedia. The number of basal leaflets is low even for Sorbus hybrida,
so I was concerned about the possibility of some other taxon irregularly
producing leaves with free basal leaflets, perhaps especially when
young. As today I encountered additional plants with (0)-1-2 basal
leaflets my concerns are somewhat alleviated.
--
Stewart Robert Hinsley

what whitebeam is this? (is this a whitebeam?)
 

Stewart Robert Hinsley wrote:
In message , Stewart Robert Hinsley
writes
I came across this whitebeam sapling yesterday, but on second thoughts
I'm not sure what it is. Any ideas?

http://florulaurbana.blogspot.com/20...m-is-this.html

Thanks everyone for your suggestions.

My newsfeed was down most of today, but in the interim I've added some
more observations and photographs to the blog. Same URL.

http://florulaurbana.blogspot.com/20...m-is-this.html

There are 4 Sorbus found in the UK which have free basal leaflets -
Sorbus x thuringiaca (******* service tree = aucuparia x aria), Sorbus x
liljeforsii (aucuparia x intermedia), Sorbus hybrida (Swedish service
tree) and Sorbus pseudofennica (Arran service tree). (Note: these plants
may be service trees, but they're still whitebeams in my idiolect.) None
of the other British endemics have, fide Stace, free basal leaflets, nor
are they known to occur in this area; the only Sorbus recorded wild from
the hectad (up to 2000) are aucuparia, aria (agg.) and latifolia. (So
confirmation that I also ran across torminalis today would be nice.)

The first three taxa have scattered records over the British Isles.
(Sorbus x thuringica is about twice as common as the other two.)

Sorbus x thuringiaca and Sorbus x liljeforsii would be expected to have
more free basal leaflets and more lateral veins that the plant I
encounted; hence my second thoughts that it was Sorbus hybrida, rather
than my original misidentification on cursory examination as Sorbus
intermedia. The number of basal leaflets is low even for Sorbus hybrida,
so I was concerned about the possibility of some other taxon irregularly
producing leaves with free basal leaflets, perhaps especially when
young. As today I encountered additional plants with (0)-1-2 basal
leaflets my concerns are somewhat alleviated.

If I am reading correctly Hugh McAllister in _The Genus Sorbus_ has S.
hybrida
found in Britain.

I'm certainly no expert on identifying within the genus, though. It's
extremely
complicated taxonomically.

We should note however that McAllister (Kew, 2005) separates the whitebeams,
previously Sorbus Aria etc, into a species distinct from the other
Sorbus, calling it
Aria. I'm not sure whether this distinction has been accepted
internationally or not.
The Sorbus all have pinnate leaves, the Aria entire leaves.

-E