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#1
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Identify a thistle?
In the grounds of my office is a thistle I couldn't recognise from a
quick hunt online. It is tall (at least 5 ft) and some points I noted were that it has some short sharp barbs on the flats of the leaves, and also on the stem- the ones on the stem start out sparse and get closer/smaller the nearer to the next section where branches come out, then the process repeats. It also had spiky green balls on the tops. I found images of the bull, musk, spear and canada thistles online but none looked entirely right... I understand that a picture would probably be helpful, but I didn't get one. Not sure if the above is really enough to go on though! |
#2
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Identify a thistle?
In message
, jmbillings writes In the grounds of my office is a thistle I couldn't recognise from a quick hunt online. It is tall (at least 5 ft) and some points I noted were that it has some short sharp barbs on the flats of the leaves, and also on the stem- the ones on the stem start out sparse and get closer/smaller the nearer to the next section where branches come out, then the process repeats. It also had spiky green balls on the tops. I found images of the bull, musk, spear and canada thistles online but none looked entirely right... I understand that a picture would probably be helpful, but I didn't get one. Not sure if the above is really enough to go on though! This is a UK (United Kingdom) newsgroup. However your selection of species names suggests that you are somewhere else - or did you just pick up the vernacular names during your search?. We may not be able to help you, but we would have a better chance if we knew where you are. (For UK readers Canada thistle is, fide Wikipedia, the plant we know as field or creeping thistle - Cirsium arvense. To add to the confusion, fide Wikipedia again, both bull and spear thistle are Cirsium vulgare. The third common species in the UK (I've only ever once seen musk thistle) is marsh thistle - Cirsium palustre. It seems as good a match as anything. -- Stewart Robert Hinsley |
#3
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Identify a thistle?
On Jul 1, 11:44*pm, Stewart Robert Hinsley
wrote: In message , jmbillings writes In the grounds of my office is a thistle I couldn't recognise from a quick hunt online. It is tall (at least 5 ft) and some points I noted were that it has some short sharp barbs on the flats of the leaves, and also on the stem- the ones on the stem start out sparse and get closer/smaller the nearer to the next section where branches come out, then the process repeats. It also had spiky green balls on the tops. I found images of the bull, musk, spear and canada thistles online but none looked entirely right... I understand that a picture would probably be helpful, but I didn't get one. Not sure if the above is really enough to go on though! This is a UK (United Kingdom) newsgroup. However your selection of species names suggests that you are somewhere else - or did you just pick up the vernacular names during your search?. We may not be able to help you, but we would have a better chance if we knew where you are. (For UK readers Canada thistle is, fide Wikipedia, the plant we know as field or creeping thistle - Cirsium arvense. To add to the confusion, fide Wikipedia again, both bull and spear thistle are Cirsium vulgare. The third common species in the UK (I've only ever once seen musk thistle) is marsh thistle - Cirsium palustre. It seems as good a match as anything. -- Stewart Robert Hinsley Hello there- I should have clarified, I am indeed in the UK. The names I mentioned were what came up on various sites I found; however I can understand the confusion as many of the sites seemed to be American. I've just looked up Cirsium palustre and it has some similarities to what I saw, but the site he http://www.dgsgardening.btinternet.co.uk/marshthis.htm says it doesn't have spines on the surface of the leaves, which I'm sure the one I saw did. In addition, the photo doesn't quite compare as the one I saw was more of one tall stem with the leaves coming off on shorter "branches" rather than the one there. I'll have to take a look at it again tomorrow and upload a photo somewhere! |
#4
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Identify a thistle?
"jmbillings" wrote I should have clarified, I am indeed in the UK. The names I mentioned were what came up on various sites I found; however I can understand the confusion as many of the sites seemed to be American. I've just looked up Cirsium palustre and it has some similarities to what I saw, but the site he http://www.dgsgardening.btinternet.co.uk/marshthis.htm says it doesn't have spines on the surface of the leaves, which I'm sure the one I saw did. In addition, the photo doesn't quite compare as the one I saw was more of one tall stem with the leaves coming off on shorter "branches" rather than the one there. Your description reminded me of teasels, which can grow very tall. They have quite spiky stems and leaves and look rather thistle-like. I don't suppose it could have been that? http://wildseed.co.uk/species/view/46 -- Sue |
#5
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Identify a thistle?
On Jul 2, 12:58*am, "Sue" wrote:
Your description reminded me of teasels, which can grow very tall. They have quite spiky stems and leaves and look rather thistle-like. I don't suppose it could have been that? http://wildseed.co.uk/species/view/46 Hi Sue. I think you've got it - I looked at a few other pictures too and that's definitely what I was looking at. Some nice close up pictures he http://www.microscopy-uk.org.uk/mag/.../bjteasel.html Thanks! James |
#6
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Identify a thistle?
In message
, jmbillings writes On Jul 1, 11:44*pm, Stewart Robert Hinsley wrote: In message , jmbillings writes In the grounds of my office is a thistle I couldn't recognise from a quick hunt online. It is tall (at least 5 ft) and some points I noted were that it has some short sharp barbs on the flats of the leaves, and also on the stem- the ones on the stem start out sparse and get closer/smaller the nearer to the next section where branches come out, then the process repeats. It also had spiky green balls on the tops. I found images of the bull, musk, spear and canada thistles online but none looked entirely right... I understand that a picture would probably be helpful, but I didn't get one. Not sure if the above is really enough to go on though! This is a UK (United Kingdom) newsgroup. However your selection of species names suggests that you are somewhere else - or did you just pick up the vernacular names during your search?. We may not be able to help you, but we would have a better chance if we knew where you are. (For UK readers Canada thistle is, fide Wikipedia, the plant we know as field or creeping thistle - Cirsium arvense. To add to the confusion, fide Wikipedia again, both bull and spear thistle are Cirsium vulgare. The third common species in the UK (I've only ever once seen musk thistle) is marsh thistle - Cirsium palustre. It seems as good a match as anything. -- Stewart Robert Hinsley Hello there- I should have clarified, I am indeed in the UK. The names I mentioned were what came up on various sites I found; however I can understand the confusion as many of the sites seemed to be American. I've just looked up Cirsium palustre and it has some similarities to what I saw, but the site he http://www.dgsgardening.btinternet.co.uk/marshthis.htm says it doesn't have spines on the surface of the leaves, which I'm sure the one I saw did. In addition, the photo doesn't quite compare as the one I saw was more of one tall stem with the leaves coming off on shorter "branches" rather than the one there. It's moot now, as your plant has now been identified as teasel, but Cirsium palustre, like Cirsium vulgare, can be either single-stemmed or multi-stemmed. Also, teasel doesn't (I've just looked at one a couple of hundred yards away) have spines on the surface of the leaves either - but it does have spines along the underside of the midrib. Apart from holly cultivars (e.g. 'Ferox') the only plant I know with spines on the leaf surface is bristly oxtounge (Picris echioides). Prickly lettuce (Lactuca serriola), like teasel, has spines along the midrib underside. I'll have to take a look at it again tomorrow and upload a photo somewhere! -- Stewart Robert Hinsley |
#7
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Identify a thistle?
"Stewart Robert Hinsley" wrote in message ... If we are talking thistles, what is mine? It's 8 feet high, multistemmed, normal purple flowers just coming out. It's so big and wide I might have to cut it back so I can get down the garden. My friend thinks it should be in the Guinness Book of Records. Tina |
#8
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Identify a thistle?
In message , Christina Websell
writes "Stewart Robert Hinsley" wrote in message ... If we are talking thistles, what is mine? It's 8 feet high, multistemmed, normal purple flowers just coming out. It's so big and wide I might have to cut it back so I can get down the garden. My friend thinks it should be in the Guinness Book of Records. Tina If it's normal purple flowers then I'd guess it's the normal spear thistle (Cirsium vulgare). But other big, purple-flowered thistle-like plants include cardoon, globe artichoke and cotton thistle. -- Stewart Robert Hinsley |
#9
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Identify a thistle?
On 2009-07-04 00:03:13 +0100, "Christina Websell"
said: "Stewart Robert Hinsley" wrote in message ... If we are talking thistles, what is mine? It's 8 feet high, multistemmed, normal purple flowers just coming out. It's so big and wide I might have to cut it back so I can get down the garden. My friend thinks it should be in the Guinness Book of Records. Tina Sounds like it could be a cardoon which is the cousin of an artichoke and is mainly sold now for ornamental purposes. 8' high and wide sounds just right. for Cynara cardunculus. -- Sacha www.hillhousenursery.com Shrubs & perennials. Tender & exotics. South Devon |
#10
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Identify a thistle?
"Sacha" wrote in message ... On 2009-07-04 00:03:13 +0100, "Christina Websell" said: "Stewart Robert Hinsley" wrote in message ... If we are talking thistles, what is mine? It's 8 feet high, multistemmed, normal purple flowers just coming out. It's so big and wide I might have to cut it back so I can get down the garden. My friend thinks it should be in the Guinness Book of Records. Tina Sounds like it could be a cardoon which is the cousin of an artichoke and is mainly sold now for ornamental purposes. 8' high and wide sounds just right. for Cynara cardunculus. It's not 8 foot wide! merely 3 feet or so. I had a look at some web images of cardoons and the bracts are not right, nor are the leaves. Thanks for the idea though. I think it must be a well-nourished spear thistle. I sprinkled the bed with dried chicken manure last year, not the bought stuff, from my own chickens. Tina |
#11
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Identify a thistle?
"Stewart Robert Hinsley" wrote in message ... In message , Christina Websell writes "Stewart Robert Hinsley" wrote in message ... If we are talking thistles, what is mine? It's 8 feet high, multistemmed, normal purple flowers just coming out. It's so big and wide I might have to cut it back so I can get down the garden. My friend thinks it should be in the Guinness Book of Records. Tina If it's normal purple flowers then I'd guess it's the normal spear thistle (Cirsium vulgare). But other big, purple-flowered thistle-like plants include cardoon, globe artichoke and cotton thistle. -- I think you are probably right. It's growing next to a close board fence which is 2 metres high plus gravel board and it's now 2 feet above that. All my books suggested that spear thistles are about 6 ft. Sorry to mix imperial and metric, I'm still on imperial but my neighbour - whose fence it is - told me the fence was 2 metres, and the gravel board looks to be about 10 inches. Anyway, it's one big thistle!! I shall leave it for now as the insects like it. Tina |
#12
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Identify a thistle?
In message , Christina Websell
writes "Stewart Robert Hinsley" wrote in message ... In message , Christina Websell writes "Stewart Robert Hinsley" wrote in message ... If we are talking thistles, what is mine? It's 8 feet high, multistemmed, normal purple flowers just coming out. It's so big and wide I might have to cut it back so I can get down the garden. My friend thinks it should be in the Guinness Book of Records. Tina If it's normal purple flowers then I'd guess it's the normal spear thistle (Cirsium vulgare). But other big, purple-flowered thistle-like plants include cardoon, globe artichoke and cotton thistle. -- I think you are probably right. It's growing next to a close board fence which is 2 metres high plus gravel board and it's now 2 feet above that. All my books suggested that spear thistles are about 6 ft. Sorry to mix imperial and metric, I'm still on imperial but my neighbour - whose fence it is - told me the fence was 2 metres, and the gravel board looks to be about 10 inches. Anyway, it's one big thistle!! I shall leave it for now as the insects like it. The books give the upper limit of the general run of a plant; bigger specimens turn up. For example, Stace says that Malva sylvestris grows to 1m, and Flora Europaea says 1.5m (I think that the difference is geographic variation); however there was a plant locally which reached 2.5m, or maybe even 3m. Tina -- Stewart Robert Hinsley |
#13
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Identify a thistle?
"Stewart Robert Hinsley" wrote in message ... In message , Christina Websell writes "Stewart Robert Hinsley" wrote in message ... In message , Christina Websell writes "Stewart Robert Hinsley" wrote in message ... If we are talking thistles, what is mine? It's 8 feet high, multistemmed, normal purple flowers just coming out. It's so big and wide I might have to cut it back so I can get down the garden. My friend thinks it should be in the Guinness Book of Records. Tina If it's normal purple flowers then I'd guess it's the normal spear thistle (Cirsium vulgare). But other big, purple-flowered thistle-like plants include cardoon, globe artichoke and cotton thistle. -- I think you are probably right. It's growing next to a close board fence which is 2 metres high plus gravel board and it's now 2 feet above that. All my books suggested that spear thistles are about 6 ft. Sorry to mix imperial and metric, I'm still on imperial but my neighbour - whose fence it is - told me the fence was 2 metres, and the gravel board looks to be about 10 inches. Anyway, it's one big thistle!! I shall leave it for now as the insects like it. The books give the upper limit of the general run of a plant; bigger specimens turn up. For example, Stace says that Malva sylvestris grows to 1m, and Flora Europaea says 1.5m (I think that the difference is geographic variation); however there was a plant locally which reached 2.5m, or maybe even 3m. As I said I shall keep it, the hoverflies love it. I shall tolerate being majorly pricked by it. it's 3 ft away from my path to go to my chickens. It's more than 3 feet wide. Ouch. Tina |
#14
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Identify a thistle?
"Christina Websell" wrote in message ... "Sacha" wrote in message ... On 2009-07-04 00:03:13 +0100, "Christina Websell" said: "Stewart Robert Hinsley" wrote in message ... If we are talking thistles, what is mine? It's 8 feet high, multistemmed, normal purple flowers just coming out. It's so big and wide I might have to cut it back so I can get down the garden. My friend thinks it should be in the Guinness Book of Records. Tina Sounds like it could be a cardoon which is the cousin of an artichoke and is mainly sold now for ornamental purposes. 8' high and wide sounds just right. for Cynara cardunculus. It's not 8 foot wide! merely 3 feet or so. I had a look at some web images of cardoons and the bracts are not right, nor are the leaves. Thanks for the idea though. I think it must be a well-nourished spear thistle. I sprinkled the bed with dried chicken manure last year, not the bought stuff, from my own chickens. Tina Could it be Onopardon? Spider |
#15
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Identify a thistle?
"Spider" wrote in message ... "Christina Websell" wrote in message ... "Sacha" wrote in message ... On 2009-07-04 00:03:13 +0100, "Christina Websell" said: "Stewart Robert Hinsley" wrote in message ... If we are talking thistles, what is mine? It's 8 feet high, multistemmed, normal purple flowers just coming out. It's so big and wide I might have to cut it back so I can get down the garden. My friend thinks it should be in the Guinness Book of Records. Tina Sounds like it could be a cardoon which is the cousin of an artichoke and is mainly sold now for ornamental purposes. 8' high and wide sounds just right. for Cynara cardunculus. It's not 8 foot wide! merely 3 feet or so. I had a look at some web images of cardoons and the bracts are not right, nor are the leaves. Thanks for the idea though. I think it must be a well-nourished spear thistle. I sprinkled the bed with dried chicken manure last year, not the bought stuff, from my own chickens. Tina Could it be Onopardon? No. It's not woolly. I have looked at all thistle possibilities. It has yellow spines on the end of the leaves and on the bracts. It's a huge spear thistle. Tina |
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