Green deal.
http://www.decc.gov.uk/en/content/cm...reen_deal.aspx

On Thu, 26 Jan 2012 10:56:15 -0000, harryagain wrote:

Green deal.
http://www.decc.gov.uk/en/content/cm...ng/green_deal/
green_deal.aspx

F.knows is there anything but quango speak there? I can't find
anything that says what is actually on offer, only wibble about the
administration and "safe guards".

--
Cheers
Dave.

In article o.uk,
Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Thu, 26 Jan 2012 10:56:15 -0000, harryagain wrote:

Green deal.
http://www.decc.gov.uk/en/content/cm...ng/green_deal/
green_deal.aspx

F.knows is there anything but quango speak there? I can't find
anything that says what is actually on offer, only wibble about the
administration and "safe guards".

Not that I can see. My assumption is that the 'standard methodology'
will be comparable to ISO 9000 - which is a standing joke in the
communities that have to comply with it. ALL that it requires is
that there be a procedure and that procedure is followed. Test
object. Tick. Ignore result of test. Tick. State that object
conforms to requirements. Tick. Pass conformance document to
customer. Tick. Hey presto - ISO 9000!



Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

"harryagain" wrote

Green deal.
http://www.decc.gov.uk/en/content/cm...reen_deal.aspx


Needing something done to improve my home energy wise I thought I would
wander around that site. What an appalling piece of rubbish it is. It tells
you lots about nothing, gives you no links to the information you need, in
fact it's all waffle and no substance.
Reads to me like people trying to justify their jobs.
--
Regards. Bob Hobden.
Posted to this Newsgroup from the W of London, UK

In article o.uk,
says...

On Thu, 26 Jan 2012 10:56:15 -0000, harryagain wrote:

Green deal.
http://www.decc.gov.uk/en/content/cm...ng/green_deal/
green_deal.aspx

F.knows is there anything but quango speak there? I can't find
anything that says what is actually on offer, only wibble about the
administration and "safe guards".

I don't know about England but in Scotland property owners can get a
free energy survey (building and lifestyle, energy and car use, recycling
etc) and big subsidies for insulating loft, cavity walls, doors etc. Your
local council should have details. We took the survey and advice and
upgraded our loft insulation. https://www.government-grants.co.uk/


Janet.

On Thu, 26 Jan 2012 23:18:44 -0000, Janet wrote:

I don't know about England but in Scotland property owners can get a
free energy survey (building and lifestyle, energy and car use,
recycling etc) and big subsidies for insulating loft, cavity walls,
doors etc.

Sounds like Warm Front but that is tied in with being on certain
benefits or old. The average working family doesn't qualify for any
grants, not sure if they can get an energy survey done for free. Warm
Front also only does the easy things like cavity wall and loft. It
doesn't do anyting for properties with solid walls.

I did see a few words in several pages of that quango speak that did
mention the harder to improve properties:

"The key focus of the new energy company obligation - or "ECO" will
be on those householders who cannot achieve significant energy
savings without an additional or different measure of support. For
example, this includes vulnerable and low-income households and those
living in harder to treat properties, such as solid walled
properties."

This Green Deal is also a "spread the cost" scheme rather than a
grant. The savings made by improved insulation should offset the
increase in bills, in theory. No a very big or nice looking carrot
IMHO. Why bother with it if there is no nett saving?

--
Cheers
Dave.

On Thu, 26 Jan 2012 23:18:44 -0000, Janet wrote:

In article o.uk,
says...

On Thu, 26 Jan 2012 10:56:15 -0000, harryagain wrote:

Green deal.
http://www.decc.gov.uk/en/content/cm...ng/green_deal/
green_deal.aspx

F.knows is there anything but quango speak there? I can't find
anything that says what is actually on offer, only wibble about the
administration and "safe guards".

I don't know about England but in Scotland property owners can get a
free energy survey (building and lifestyle, energy and car use, recycling
etc) and big subsidies for insulating loft, cavity walls, doors etc.


Paid for, no doubt, via the Barnett Formula.

--
Frank Erskine

As I understand it, you get "free" insulation, but all the reductions in fuel bills as a result of the insulation are channeled off to pay the for the insulation.

The loan for the insulation is against the house, not against you, so if you sell the property, then the new owner's fuel savings are still being channeled away to pay the outstanding loan on the insulation.

Presumably at some time in the future, the insulation will be paid for and some future owner of the house will start getting the benefit of the fuel savings.

You would also want to take a good look at restrictions on who can do the work. The laudable aim to make sure the work is done to good standards sometimes means that you're tied to large national firms and you can't use the local firm who you know and trust.

I've seen some suggestion that future payments for people to instal solar panels will only be given if the house has already been insulated to approved standards.

In article o.uk,
says...

On Thu, 26 Jan 2012 23:18:44 -0000, Janet wrote:

I don't know about England but in Scotland property owners can get a
free energy survey (building and lifestyle, energy and car use,
recycling etc) and big subsidies for insulating loft, cavity walls,
doors etc.

Sounds like Warm Front
Nope.

https://www.government-grants.co.uk/...-grants.shtml?
gclid=CJ230ZqD8K0CFcEntAodZTu7tA

The average working family doesn't qualify for any
grants,

wrong, see above. This covers Britain.

quote

"(The criteria for loft insulation grants also apply to cavity wall
insulation. You need make only one enquiry.)
ALL home owner/occupiers and private tenants are now eligible for grant
funding of 50% - 100% towards the cost of loft insulation."

Grants for loft insulation, of around 50% and above, are available for all
home owners and private tenants - whatever your income - and of 100% if
you satisfy the eligibility criteria."


The savings made by improved insulation should offset the
increase in bills, in theory. No a very big or nice looking carrot
IMHO. Why bother with it if there is no nett saving?

Once the householder has recouped the initial outlay (if any), their
reductions in fuel bills (personal economic benefit) continue year on
year. So does the reduction in energy wastage and environmental damage,
a national benefit.

Janet

In article ,
says...

On Thu, 26 Jan 2012 23:18:44 -0000, Janet wrote:

In article o.uk,
says...

On Thu, 26 Jan 2012 10:56:15 -0000, harryagain wrote:

Green deal.
http://www.decc.gov.uk/en/content/cm...ng/green_deal/
green_deal.aspx

F.knows is there anything but quango speak there? I can't find
anything that says what is actually on offer, only wibble about the
administration and "safe guards".

I don't know about England but in Scotland property owners can get a
free energy survey (building and lifestyle, energy and car use, recycling
etc) and big subsidies for insulating loft, cavity walls, doors etc.


Paid for, no doubt, via the Barnett Formula.

It's a nationwide scheme covering the whole of Britain.Every
householder, owner or tenenat, qualifies for at least a 50% grant.

http://www.government-grants.co.uk/b...-grants-still-
unclaimed.shtml

July 2011

"According to the New Policy Institute, there are over 5 million
households in the UK that could claim free insulation grants, saving
typically £260 a year on their energy bills, only 12% have actually
applied for grants for loft and cavity wall insulation.

As energy prices continue to rise, it's claimed that millions of UK
householders may struggle needlessly to stay warm this coming winter
despite help being offered by local government and energy companies.

47% of people asked did not think that they would qualify for insulation
grants whilst the rest did not know the grants existed or did not want
assistance.

Mark Smith from the Government Grants website said "As energy costs rise
at unprecedented rates and records are also being set for cold winters, it
seems madness that people are not taking advantage of these grants"

Currently insulation grants of between 50% and 100% are offered to ALL UK
home owners depending on their location and circumstances."

end quote

Janet.

On Fri, 27 Jan 2012 11:23:07 -0000, Janet wrote:

In article o.uk,
says...

On Thu, 26 Jan 2012 23:18:44 -0000, Janet wrote:

I don't know about England but in Scotland property owners can get a
free energy survey (building and lifestyle, energy and car use,
recycling etc) and big subsidies for insulating loft, cavity walls,
doors etc.

Sounds like Warm Front
Nope.

https://www.government-grants.co.uk/...-grants.shtml?
gclid=CJ230ZqD8K0CFcEntAodZTu7tA

The average working family doesn't qualify for any
grants,

wrong, see above. This covers Britain.

quote

"(The criteria for loft insulation grants also apply to cavity wall
insulation. You need make only one enquiry.)
ALL home owner/occupiers and private tenants are now eligible for grant
funding of 50% - 100% towards the cost of loft insulation."

Grants for loft insulation, of around 50% and above, are available for all
home owners and private tenants - whatever your income - and of 100% if
you satisfy the eligibility criteria."


Note the weasal words "satisfy the eligibility criteria". Go to the
warmfront site and you will find this:

"The scheme is now targeted at people on certain income-related
benefits and living in properties that are poorly insulated and/or do
not have a working central heating system. You must own your home or
rent it from a private landlord.
The Warm Front scheme is only available in England. Other schemes are
available in the rest of the UK (see ‘More useful links’)."

I'm more inclined to believe the government site, rather than one that
tries to pass itself off as a government site.

On Jan 26, 9:22*pm, wrote:
In article o.uk,

Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Thu, 26 Jan 2012 10:56:15 -0000, harryagain wrote:

Green *deal.
http://www.decc.gov.uk/en/content/cm...ng/green_deal/
green_deal.aspx

F.knows is there anything but quango speak there? I can't find
anything that says what is actually on offer, only wibble about the
administration and "safe guards".

Not that I can see. *My assumption is that the 'standard methodology'
will be comparable to ISO 9000 - which is a standing joke in the
communities that have to comply with it. *ALL that it requires is
that there be a procedure and that procedure is followed. *Test
object. *Tick. *Ignore result of test. *Tick. *State that object
conforms to requirements. *Tick. *Pass conformance document to
customer. *Tick. *Hey presto - ISO 9000!

Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

Does 9000 not require the procedure to be identified?

In article ,
thirty-six wrote:
On Jan 26, 9:22 pm, wrote:
In article o.uk,
Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Thu, 26 Jan 2012 10:56:15 -0000, harryagain wrote:

Green deal.
http://www.decc.gov.uk/en/content/cm...ng/green_deal/
green_deal.aspx

F.knows is there anything but quango speak there? I can't find
anything that says what is actually on offer, only wibble about the
administration and "safe guards".

Not that I can see. My assumption is that the 'standard methodology'
will be comparable to ISO 9000 - which is a standing joke in the
communities that have to comply with it. ALL that it requires is
that there be a procedure and that procedure is followed. Test
object. Tick. Ignore result of test. Tick. State that object
conforms to requirements. Tick. Pass conformance document to
customer. Tick. Hey presto - ISO 9000!

Does 9000 not require the procedure to be identified?

Yes. As in the example I gave. It does not require it to make any
sense, or even be relevant. Any competent purchaser of an ISO 9000
compliant product demands to see the procedure before taking any
notice of the claim, but you need to know quite a lot to be able to
judge a good procedure from a bad one.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

"kay" wrote in message
...

'Dave Liquorice[_3_ Wrote:
;948440']

This Green Deal is also a "spread the cost" scheme rather than a
grant. The savings made by improved insulation should offset the
increase in bills, in theory. No a very big or nice looking carrot
IMHO. Why bother with it if there is no nett saving?


As I understand it, you get "free" insulation, but all the reductions in
fuel bills as a result of the insulation are channeled off to pay the
for the insulation.

The loan for the insulation is against the house, not against you, so if
you sell the property, then the new owner's fuel savings are still being
channeled away to pay the outstanding loan on the insulation.

Presumably at some time in the future, the insulation will be paid for
and some future owner of the house will start getting the benefit of the
fuel savings.

You would also want to take a good look at restrictions on who can do
the work. The laudable aim to make sure the work is done to good
standards sometimes means that you're tied to large national firms and
you can't use the local firm who you know and trust.

I've seen some suggestion that future payments for people to instal
solar panels will only be given if the house has already been insulated
to approved standards.




--
kay

Not sure what the name of the scheme is but EDF have just installed 10" of
insulation on top of what we had for free, no strings attached, most
impressed as I didn't have to do it! and we don't even buy our electricity
from them.


--
Charlie, Gardening in Cornwall
Holders of National Collections of Clematis viticella
and Lapageria rosea cvs
http://www.roselandhouse.co.uk

"Bob Hobden" wrote in message
...
"harryagain" wrote

Green deal.
http://www.decc.gov.uk/en/content/cm...reen_deal.aspx


Needing something done to improve my home energy wise I thought I would
wander around that site. What an appalling piece of rubbish it is. It
tells you lots about nothing, gives you no links to the information you
need, in fact it's all waffle and no substance.

That'll be because it isn't actually available yet

Reads to me like people trying to justify their jobs.

Isn't that what politicians always do

tim