OK, got another couple of questions for you.

About 5 years ago I planted a couple of little bushes/shrubs in one of my
borders.

I forget what sort they were, but the first one, although it was a slow
grower, seems to have not grown at all. Looks rather unhealthy and has dead
bits on.

I did pull back the gravel and put a bit of compost round the roots earlier
this year, but hasn't done much good. Heres a pic of the first...

http://tinyurl.com/l2syret

The second bush/shrub does seem to have grown. But looks rather sparse and
also has dead bits on it.

http://tinyurl.com/mmtok8t

I know its getting into autumn, but they don't look much better in the
summer.

Clearly they're not very happy, anything I can do to try and improve their
look?

Thanks in advance!


--
Best Wishes
Simon Taylor

On Thu, 2 Oct 2014 20:50:52 +0100, "Simon T"
wrote:

OK, got another couple of questions for you.

About 5 years ago I planted a couple of little bushes/shrubs in one of my
borders.

I forget what sort they were, but the first one, although it was a slow
grower, seems to have not grown at all. Looks rather unhealthy and has dead
bits on.

I did pull back the gravel and put a bit of compost round the roots earlier
this year, but hasn't done much good. Heres a pic of the first...

http://tinyurl.com/l2syret

The second bush/shrub does seem to have grown. But looks rather sparse and
also has dead bits on it.

http://tinyurl.com/mmtok8t

I know its getting into autumn, but they don't look much better in the
summer.

Clearly they're not very happy, anything I can do to try and improve their
look?

Thanks in advance!

Ji Simon
You don't say where you live but we have had a very dry summer and I
think they could just be in need of a drink. Rain is forecast but if
they were mine I'd give then a jolly good soak.
I'll leave it to those with better eyesight than mine to give you
names.
Nice Autumn colours and they don't look too bad.
Pam near Bristol

In article ,
Pam Moore wrote:
On Thu, 2 Oct 2014 20:50:52 +0100, "Simon T"
wrote:

OK, got another couple of questions for you.

About 5 years ago I planted a couple of little bushes/shrubs in one of my
borders.

I forget what sort they were, but the first one, although it was a slow
grower, seems to have not grown at all. Looks rather unhealthy and has dead
bits on.

I did pull back the gravel and put a bit of compost round the roots earlier
this year, but hasn't done much good. Heres a pic of the first...

http://tinyurl.com/l2syret

The second bush/shrub does seem to have grown. But looks rather sparse and
also has dead bits on it.

http://tinyurl.com/mmtok8t

I know its getting into autumn, but they don't look much better in the
summer.

Clearly they're not very happy, anything I can do to try and improve their
look?

You don't say where you live but we have had a very dry summer and I
think they could just be in need of a drink. Rain is forecast but if
they were mine I'd give then a jolly good soak.
I'll leave it to those with better eyesight than mine to give you
names.
Nice Autumn colours and they don't look too bad.

The first looks like a dwarf maple, and they are notoriously
sensitive to conditions (especially drought). Bluntly, it won't
ever thrive where it is. But the conditions look pretty bad
for anything except the toughest plants.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

On 02/10/2014 21:07, Nick Maclaren wrote:
In article ,
Pam Moore wrote:
On Thu, 2 Oct 2014 20:50:52 +0100, "Simon T"
wrote:

OK, got another couple of questions for you.

About 5 years ago I planted a couple of little bushes/shrubs in one of my
borders.

I forget what sort they were, but the first one, although it was a slow
grower, seems to have not grown at all. Looks rather unhealthy and has dead
bits on.

I did pull back the gravel and put a bit of compost round the roots earlier
this year, but hasn't done much good. Heres a pic of the first...

http://tinyurl.com/l2syret

The second bush/shrub does seem to have grown. But looks rather sparse and
also has dead bits on it.

http://tinyurl.com/mmtok8t

I know its getting into autumn, but they don't look much better in the
summer.

Clearly they're not very happy, anything I can do to try and improve their
look?

You don't say where you live but we have had a very dry summer and I
think they could just be in need of a drink. Rain is forecast but if
they were mine I'd give then a jolly good soak.
I'll leave it to those with better eyesight than mine to give you
names.
Nice Autumn colours and they don't look too bad.

The first looks like a dwarf maple, and they are notoriously
sensitive to conditions (especially drought). Bluntly, it won't
ever thrive where it is. But the conditions look pretty bad
for anything except the toughest plants.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

I'd dig up the first one, give it a good prune to get rid of all the
dead wood, mix in a couple of buckets of multipurpose compost into the
soil and a handful or 2 of slow release fertilizer, possibly also add
water retaining polymer crystals as well, then replant the bush, giving
it a good soak,
Next year water it well. That doesn't mean a little and often, but a
really good soak when needed with liquid feed added.
The second one, prune out all the dead wood and next spring give it a
good feed and then water well with added liquid feed.
David @ the side of Swansea Bay that is in need of rain

On 02/10/2014 20:50, Simon T wrote:
OK, got another couple of questions for you.

About 5 years ago I planted a couple of little bushes/shrubs in one of
my borders.

I forget what sort they were, but the first one, although it was a slow
grower, seems to have not grown at all. Looks rather unhealthy and has
dead bits on.

I did pull back the gravel and put a bit of compost round the roots
earlier this year, but hasn't done much good. Heres a pic of the first...

http://tinyurl.com/l2syret

The second bush/shrub does seem to have grown. But looks rather sparse
and also has dead bits on it.

http://tinyurl.com/mmtok8t

I know its getting into autumn, but they don't look much better in the
summer.

Clearly they're not very happy, anything I can do to try and improve
their look?

Thanks in advance!



A lot of shrubs are doomed from the start if the root system isn't
right. I always soak them overnight and tease the roots but, if the root
ball is too dense, they will always be rather feeble specimens. I have
learnt not to trust garden centres in this respect. You're better off
buying from a market stall where the turnover is high.

On 2014-10-03 09:40:36 +0000, stuart noble said:

On 02/10/2014 20:50, Simon T wrote:
OK, got another couple of questions for you.

About 5 years ago I planted a couple of little bushes/shrubs in one of
my borders.

I forget what sort they were, but the first one, although it was a slow
grower, seems to have not grown at all. Looks rather unhealthy and has
dead bits on.

I did pull back the gravel and put a bit of compost round the roots
earlier this year, but hasn't done much good. Heres a pic of the first...

http://tinyurl.com/l2syret

The second bush/shrub does seem to have grown. But looks rather sparse
and also has dead bits on it.

http://tinyurl.com/mmtok8t

I know its getting into autumn, but they don't look much better in the
summer.

Clearly they're not very happy, anything I can do to try and improve
their look?

Thanks in advance!



A lot of shrubs are doomed from the start if the root system isn't
right. I always soak them overnight and tease the roots but, if the
root ball is too dense, they will always be rather feeble specimens. I
have learnt not to trust garden centres in this respect. You're better
off buying from a market stall where the turnover is high.

Most nurseries and garden centres have a very rapid turnover! There
are certainly some good market stalls and bargains can be found but it
is then a case of caveat emptor all too often.

There is always the danger that if the plants die within a month or
two, the stall holder will no longer be at the market, either because
he or she is a seasonal seller only, took a stall for just a week or
two to sell off homegrown plants or excess stock, or because they no
longer have stock so there is no stall and therefore no comeback.

The answer to ALL plant buying is to use a trustworthy source,
whichever it is, listen to friends' recommendations and ask for
guidance on what will be best suited to your garden. But the best
plant seller in the world cannot be held to account for customers who
don't water their plants in one of the driest summers and autumns for a
very long time. It's possible the soil there is starved and poor but
that is difficult to judge as it's covered in gravel. The OP could get
a soil testing kit and see what kind of soil he has, clear off the
gravel and dig in some organic matter now before replacing the gravel.
He needs to know which way that bed is facing, too, so that he knows
how much sun or shade falls there.

In this instance, cut off the dead bits and give the plant a good, long
drink. Repeat every couple of days re watering if we don't get rain
and even then, check that the fence isn't preventing rain getting to
the shrubs if wind is driving the rain over the top of the fence.
--

Sacha
www.hillhousenursery.com
South Devon
www.helpforheroes.org.uk

A lot of shrubs are doomed from the start if the root system isn't
right. I always soak them overnight and tease the roots but, if the
root ball is too dense, they will always be rather feeble specimens. I
have learnt not to trust garden centres in this respect. You're better
off buying from a market stall where the turnover is high.

Most nurseries and garden centres have a very rapid turnover! There are
certainly some good market stalls and bargains can be found but it is
then a case of caveat emptor all too often.

I'm sure the family run centres are as good as they ever were :-)

Too many round here appear to be part of large groups. Shrubs that don't
sell hang around till the following year and the price increased because
they're that bit bigger.

On 2014-10-03 15:54:00 +0000, stuart noble said:


A lot of shrubs are doomed from the start if the root system isn't
right. I always soak them overnight and tease the roots but, if the
root ball is too dense, they will always be rather feeble specimens. I
have learnt not to trust garden centres in this respect. You're better
off buying from a market stall where the turnover is high.

Most nurseries and garden centres have a very rapid turnover! There are
certainly some good market stalls and bargains can be found but it is
then a case of caveat emptor all too often.

I'm sure the family run centres are as good as they ever were :-)

Too many round here appear to be part of large groups. Shrubs that
don't sell hang around till the following year and the price increased
because they're that bit bigger.

Our experience with a gc near us is that they chuck things out,
especially once they stop flowering. Only the very largest and most
expensive things are kept over. They never, ever re-pot or pot on,
which is a tragic waste of money and is of course a hidden cost passed
on to the buyer! Nurseries, by contrast, do pot on and a higher price
reflects that in terms of time, pot, compost, general nurturing. I do
wonder if the OP, being rather new to gardening, checked the root
system of his shrubs, and dug a big enough hole to let the roots spread
easily into their new home. It is just possible that, if he waits for
the plant to go dormant and then digs it up very very carefully, he'll
find the roots still need a bit of teasing out. As you say, if they
were pot-bound they won't get off to a good start.
--
Sacha
www.hillhousenursery.com
South Devon

On 04/10/2014 10:01, sacha wrote:
On 2014-10-03 15:54:00 +0000, stuart noble said:


A lot of shrubs are doomed from the start if the root system isn't
right. I always soak them overnight and tease the roots but, if the
root ball is too dense, they will always be rather feeble specimens. I
have learnt not to trust garden centres in this respect. You're better
off buying from a market stall where the turnover is high.

Most nurseries and garden centres have a very rapid turnover! There are
certainly some good market stalls and bargains can be found but it is
then a case of caveat emptor all too often.

I'm sure the family run centres are as good as they ever were :-)

Too many round here appear to be part of large groups. Shrubs that
don't sell hang around till the following year and the price increased
because they're that bit bigger.

Our experience with a gc near us is that they chuck things out,
especially once they stop flowering. Only the very largest and most
expensive things are kept over. They never, ever re-pot or pot on,
which is a tragic waste of money and is of course a hidden cost passed
on to the buyer! Nurseries, by contrast, do pot on and a higher price
reflects that in terms of time, pot, compost, general nurturing. I do
wonder if the OP, being rather new to gardening, checked the root system
of his shrubs, and dug a big enough hole to let the roots spread easily
into their new home. It is just possible that, if he waits for the
plant to go dormant and then digs it up very very carefully, he'll find
the roots still need a bit of teasing out. As you say, if they were
pot-bound they won't get off to a good start.

Teasing the roots isn't always easy IME. I've had shrubs where cutting
slits in the root ball was the only option.
My local GC has just emptied all unsold seed packets into a dustbin and
marked them down to 50p. Now that they're all jumbled up, they won't
sell any. I know because they do it every year!

"stuart noble" wrote

sacha wrote:
stuart noble said:


A lot of shrubs are doomed from the start if the root system isn't
right. I always soak them overnight and tease the roots but, if the
root ball is too dense, they will always be rather feeble specimens. I
have learnt not to trust garden centres in this respect. You're better
off buying from a market stall where the turnover is high.

Most nurseries and garden centres have a very rapid turnover! There
are
certainly some good market stalls and bargains can be found but it is
then a case of caveat emptor all too often.

I'm sure the family run centres are as good as they ever were :-)

Too many round here appear to be part of large groups. Shrubs that
don't sell hang around till the following year and the price increased
because they're that bit bigger.

Our experience with a gc near us is that they chuck things out,
especially once they stop flowering. Only the very largest and most
expensive things are kept over. They never, ever re-pot or pot on,
which is a tragic waste of money and is of course a hidden cost passed
on to the buyer! Nurseries, by contrast, do pot on and a higher price
reflects that in terms of time, pot, compost, general nurturing. I do
wonder if the OP, being rather new to gardening, checked the root system
of his shrubs, and dug a big enough hole to let the roots spread easily
into their new home. It is just possible that, if he waits for the
plant to go dormant and then digs it up very very carefully, he'll find
the roots still need a bit of teasing out. As you say, if they were
pot-bound they won't get off to a good start.

Teasing the roots isn't always easy IME. I've had shrubs where cutting
slits in the root ball was the only option.
My local GC has just emptied all unsold seed packets into a dustbin and
marked them down to 50p. Now that they're all jumbled up, they won't sell
any. I know because they do it every year!

Yes Wyvales do that presumably to save space for their Christmas display. I
have occasionally saved a lot on seeds I want and did this year, but they
hadn't jumbled them up when I looked.
--
Regards. Bob Hobden.
Posted to this Newsgroup from the W of London, UK

On 04/10/2014 10:54, Bob Hobden wrote:
"stuart noble" wrote

sacha wrote:
stuart noble said:


A lot of shrubs are doomed from the start if the root system isn't
right. I always soak them overnight and tease the roots but, if the
root ball is too dense, they will always be rather feeble
specimens. I
have learnt not to trust garden centres in this respect. You're
better
off buying from a market stall where the turnover is high.

Most nurseries and garden centres have a very rapid turnover!
There are
certainly some good market stalls and bargains can be found but it is
then a case of caveat emptor all too often.

I'm sure the family run centres are as good as they ever were :-)

Too many round here appear to be part of large groups. Shrubs that
don't sell hang around till the following year and the price increased
because they're that bit bigger.

Our experience with a gc near us is that they chuck things out,
especially once they stop flowering. Only the very largest and most
expensive things are kept over. They never, ever re-pot or pot on,
which is a tragic waste of money and is of course a hidden cost passed
on to the buyer! Nurseries, by contrast, do pot on and a higher price
reflects that in terms of time, pot, compost, general nurturing. I do
wonder if the OP, being rather new to gardening, checked the root system
of his shrubs, and dug a big enough hole to let the roots spread easily
into their new home. It is just possible that, if he waits for the
plant to go dormant and then digs it up very very carefully, he'll find
the roots still need a bit of teasing out. As you say, if they were
pot-bound they won't get off to a good start.

Teasing the roots isn't always easy IME. I've had shrubs where cutting
slits in the root ball was the only option.
My local GC has just emptied all unsold seed packets into a dustbin
and marked them down to 50p. Now that they're all jumbled up, they
won't sell any. I know because they do it every year!

Yes Wyvales do that presumably to save space for their Christmas
display. I have occasionally saved a lot on seeds I want and did this
year, but they hadn't jumbled them up when I looked.

Ah yes, Wyevales who became part of GC Group but are now apparently
taking them over! Crazy place.

stuart noble wrote:

A lot of shrubs are doomed from the start if the root system isn't
right. I always soak them overnight and tease the roots but, if the root
ball is too dense, they will always be rather feeble specimens.

I always soak new shrubs overnight, but as a complete amateur
I usually worry that if I tease out the roots
this is likely to do more harm than good.
Any advice on the best way to do this?

--
Timothy Murphy
e-mail: gayleard /at/ eircom.net
School of Mathematics, Trinity College, Dublin 2, Ireland

On 02/10/2014 20:50, Simon T wrote:
OK, got another couple of questions for you.

About 5 years ago I planted a couple of little bushes/shrubs in one of
my borders.

I forget what sort they were, but the first one, although it was a slow
grower, seems to have not grown at all. Looks rather unhealthy and has
dead bits on.

I did pull back the gravel and put a bit of compost round the roots
earlier this year, but hasn't done much good. Heres a pic of the first...

http://tinyurl.com/l2syret

The second bush/shrub does seem to have grown. But looks rather sparse
and also has dead bits on it.

http://tinyurl.com/mmtok8t

I know its getting into autumn, but they don't look much better in the
summer.

Clearly they're not very happy, anything I can do to try and improve
their look?

Thanks in advance!



Hi Simon,

To start with, both shrubs are planted too close to the fence and may
very well be in a 'rain shadow' and so are almost perpetually droughted,
this year especially.

I'm guessing that the first shrub is an acer. Acers are plants of light
woodland and do not appreciate being exposed to full sun (or wind) all
year round, especially whilst suffering drought. Their roots are fairly
shallow, so will be baked in their current situation. In woodland, or
at least in a shadier postion, the root run would be cooler and mulched
with nature's own leafmould. You cannot create this habitat against
your fence, so I suggest you wait until the shrub is dormant and lift
it. If you can't offer it woodland, consider potting it up and keeping
it in a shady place ... but then it will be even more dependent on you
for water. Whether you leave it in the ground or pot it up, you must
*must* water it.

The second shrub is probably a Spiraea, but it's not easy to see.
It can cope with more sunshine, but still needs to be kept well watered,
especially in the kind of scorching summer we've just had.
It looks as if it may be planted next to a drain cover (or perhaps a
large slab of slate) on the left hand side, and clearly next to wheelie
bins on the right. Both these will stop the shrub receiving natural
rain fall. With the fence behind also limiting rainfall, this shrub is
hopelessly dependent on you for year round watering.

Whatever else you do, you need to give these shrubs a good, solid
drenching. Even if it rains, don't rely on that reaching the roots.
Certainly cut out all the dead wood to tidy the plants up *and* to stop
them dying back further, hopefully. You really need to make a decision
about the acer, because it is suffering.

--
Spider.
On high ground in SE London
gardening on heavy clay

On 04/10/2014 13:16, Timothy Murphy wrote:
stuart noble wrote:

A lot of shrubs are doomed from the start if the root system isn't
right. I always soak them overnight and tease the roots but, if the root
ball is too dense, they will always be rather feeble specimens.

I always soak new shrubs overnight, but as a complete amateur
I usually worry that if I tease out the roots
this is likely to do more harm than good.
Any advice on the best way to do this?



There isn't one answer that suits all shrubs or trees. Most seem to
benefit from having their roots teased out, but there are exceptions.
When you get your new plant home, do some research (unless you've
already asked at the gc/nursery): if your plant is one of those which
resents root disturbance, then soak it as usual, but plant it with as
little disturbance as possible.

--
Spider.
On high ground in SE London
gardening on heavy clay

In article , says...

stuart noble wrote:

A lot of shrubs are doomed from the start if the root system isn't
right. I always soak them overnight and tease the roots but, if the root
ball is too dense, they will always be rather feeble specimens.

I always soak new shrubs overnight, but as a complete amateur
I usually worry that if I tease out the roots
this is likely to do more harm than good.
Any advice on the best way to do this?

A good rule of thumb is, try not to dislodge any of the potting
compost from the roots.

I cut off any hard dry roots coming out of the drainage holes, before
taking the pot off.

If I can see just a few fresh roots well spaced out down the sides of
the compost, no need to tease anything, I plant it as it is.

If I can see a close fibrous network of fine roots all round the
edges of the compost, I just use my finger tips or the tips of a
handfork to gently scritch/roughen them a little bit.

If I can see large fresh pale/white roots ( almost pencil thick)
spiralling round the base of the pot and the distal tip is in view, I
very gently uncurl it to ease the root loose away from the potting
fibre; when placed in the planting hole the roots might still be
rather curved but their spiral is larger and looser than before. You
can use globs of the filling-in soil to pin them in the right direction
away from the plant, and those growing tips will soon head out into
surrounding soil.

Janet