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Old 31-08-2019, 09:49 AM posted to uk.rec.gardening
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Default When is Autumn?

From the garden point of view? When I was young, a long time ago, it
started on the 21st Of September. Now the weather men talk of
Meteorological commencing the 1st of September. I have seeds which
require to be sown in the Autumn. When is the best time for this please?

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Old 31-08-2019, 11:32 AM posted to uk.rec.gardening
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Default When is Autumn?

On 31/08/2019 09:49, Broadback wrote:
From the garden point of view? When I was young, a long time ago, it
started on the 21st Of September. Now the weather men talk of
Meteorological commencing the 1st of September. I have seeds which
require to be sown in the Autumn. When is the best time for this please?


Astronomical autumn starts on the equinox (21 September, more or less).
Meteorological autumn starts on the 1st September. The Wikipedia article
gives some other alternatives - 1st August, 7th August, first Monday of
September.

I think of the first two or three weeks of September as transitional
from summer to autumn - in some years they are summery (an Indian
Summer); in other years they are autumnal.

The other end of autumn is also variable - in 2009 winter arrived at the
start of November, but in many years it extends well into December.

The best time would depend on the species, the area, and the weather,
but in the absence of data October seems a good compromise.

--
SRH
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Old 31-08-2019, 08:28 PM posted to uk.rec.gardening
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Default When is Autumn?

On 31/08/2019 11:32, Stewart Robert Hinsley wrote:
On 31/08/2019 09:49, Broadback wrote:
*From the garden point of view? When I was young, a long time ago, it
started on the 21st Of September. Now the weather men talk of
Meteorological commencing the 1st of September. I have seeds which
require to be sown in the Autumn. When is the best time for this please?


Seasonal sowing of seed is +/- a month or so.

Very few seeds are so timing critical apart from those which must be
sown immediately that they are ready to leave the pod. Some may have
requirements to trigger germination like fire, smoke. heat or cold.

Astronomical autumn starts on the equinox (21 September, more or less).
Meteorological autumn starts on the 1st September. The Wikipedia article
gives some other alternatives - 1st August, 7th August, first Monday of
September.

I think of the first two or three weeks of September as transitional
from summer to autumn - in some years they are summery (an Indian
Summer); in other years they are autumnal.


This year I already have some thermally sensitive plants (including
acer, fig, ginko and lilies) showing signs of autumn colour. I don't
understand how since there has not been a cold enough night to my
knowledge. More usually they do this in mid-september.

The other end of autumn is also variable - in 2009 winter arrived at the
start of November, but in many years it extends well into December.

The best time would depend on the species, the area, and the weather,
but in the absence of data October seems a good compromise.



--
Regards,
Martin Brown
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Old 31-08-2019, 08:59 PM posted to uk.rec.gardening
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Default When is Autumn?

On 31/08/2019 20:28, Martin Brown wrote:
I think of the first two or three weeks of September as transitional
from summer to autumn - in some years they are summery (an Indian
Summer); in other years they are autumnal.


This year I already have some thermally sensitive plants (including
acer, fig, ginko and lilies) showing signs of autumn colour. I don't
understand how since there has not been a cold enough night to my
knowledge. More usually they do this in mid-september.


It's been a funny old year. After a dry winter we've had a wet summer,
with periods of exceptional heat, and a remarkably chilly spell for
early August.
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Old 01-09-2019, 09:58 AM posted to uk.rec.gardening
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Default When is Autumn?

On 31/08/19 20:59, Stewart Robert Hinsley wrote:
On 31/08/2019 20:28, Martin Brown wrote:
I think of the first two or three weeks of September as transitional
from summer to autumn - in some years they are summery (an Indian
Summer); in other years they are autumnal.


This year I already have some thermally sensitive plants (including
acer, fig, ginko and lilies) showing signs of autumn colour. I don't
understand how since there has not been a cold enough night to my
knowledge. More usually they do this in mid-september.


It's been a funny old year. After a dry winter we've had a wet summer,
with periods of exceptional heat, and a remarkably chilly spell for
early August.


I can only assume you are north-west of a line from about The Wash to
Weymouth. On the other side of that line it has been incredibly dry (see
the "Mildew" thread a week or so ago).

Still, it's an ill wind, etc... our 18+ metre ash did not flower this
year - I assume the conditions were too dry - so it has not set seed.
Yay! No seedlings to pull up next spring!

--

Jeff


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Old 01-09-2019, 10:25 AM posted to uk.rec.gardening
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Default When is Autumn?

In article ,
Jeff Layman wrote:
On 31/08/19 20:59, Stewart Robert Hinsley wrote:
On 31/08/2019 20:28, Martin Brown wrote:
I think of the first two or three weeks of September as transitional
from summer to autumn - in some years they are summery (an Indian
Summer); in other years they are autumnal.

This year I already have some thermally sensitive plants (including
acer, fig, ginko and lilies) showing signs of autumn colour. I don't
understand how since there has not been a cold enough night to my
knowledge. More usually they do this in mid-september.


It's been a funny old year. After a dry winter we've had a wet summer,
with periods of exceptional heat, and a remarkably chilly spell for
early August.


I can only assume you are north-west of a line from about The Wash to
Weymouth. On the other side of that line it has been incredibly dry (see
the "Mildew" thread a week or so ago).


No, it hasn't been. It has been extremely variable, often over distances
of less than a mile. We have had a lot of hot, dry weather, but also
occasional heavy downpours, which some locations got and others didn't.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.
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Old 01-09-2019, 03:15 PM posted to uk.rec.gardening
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Default When is Autumn?

On 01/09/19 10:25, Nick Maclaren wrote:
In article ,
Jeff Layman wrote:
On 31/08/19 20:59, Stewart Robert Hinsley wrote:
On 31/08/2019 20:28, Martin Brown wrote:
I think of the first two or three weeks of September as transitional
from summer to autumn - in some years they are summery (an Indian
Summer); in other years they are autumnal.

This year I already have some thermally sensitive plants (including
acer, fig, ginko and lilies) showing signs of autumn colour. I don't
understand how since there has not been a cold enough night to my
knowledge. More usually they do this in mid-september.

It's been a funny old year. After a dry winter we've had a wet summer,
with periods of exceptional heat, and a remarkably chilly spell for
early August.


I can only assume you are north-west of a line from about The Wash to
Weymouth. On the other side of that line it has been incredibly dry (see
the "Mildew" thread a week or so ago).


No, it hasn't been. It has been extremely variable, often over distances
of less than a mile. We have had a lot of hot, dry weather, but also
occasional heavy downpours, which some locations got and others didn't.


It is variable over all areas - even the wet ones. After all, this is
the UK! I was just replying generally to SRH's generalisation at it
being a wet summer. As I pointed out in the "Mildew" thread, even around
here the rainfall for the first 6 months of the year ranged from 150 to
250 mm. But even we don't have it as bad as Southampton West, where
Southern Water have applied for a drought
orderhttps://www.southernwater.co.uk/hampshire-drought)
Fortunately, our water is supplied from aquifers under the South Downs.
It has a rather high Calcium content, but there's no water shortage at
present, and none on the horizon.

--

Jeff


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