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Old 05-08-2003, 01:22 PM
Franz Heymann
 
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Default Shrub roses

I have a few shrub roses of the Rugosa type. They are all throwng up
suckers by the dozen.
My question is whether such roses are customarily grown as cuttings, or
are they grafted?
The reason I ask is to help me decide whether to remove the suckers
and/or to replant them, or whether I just leave them on the parent bushes.
The latter will lead to trouble sooner rather than later, as my plants are
spreading in width at about 2 ft per year.

[Franz Heymann]



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Old 05-08-2003, 07:12 PM
Kay Easton
 
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Default Shrub roses

In article , Franz Heymann
writes
I have a few shrub roses of the Rugosa type. They are all throwng up
suckers by the dozen.
My question is whether such roses are customarily grown as cuttings, or
are they grafted?
The reason I ask is to help me decide whether to remove the suckers
and/or to replant them, or whether I just leave them on the parent bushes.
The latter will lead to trouble sooner rather than later, as my plants are
spreading in width at about 2 ft per year.


Mine are on their own roots, and they do sucker pretty freely.

Can you not tell from the foliage? Is it rugosa type or dog rose type?

--
Kay Easton

Edward's earthworm page:
http://www.scarboro.demon.co.uk/edward/index.htm
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Old 05-08-2003, 08:02 PM
Rod
 
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Default Shrub roses

"Franz Heymann" wrote in message ...
I have a few shrub roses of the Rugosa type. They are all throwng up
suckers by the dozen.
My question is whether such roses are customarily grown as cuttings, or
are they grafted?
The reason I ask is to help me decide whether to remove the suckers
and/or to replant them, or whether I just leave them on the parent bushes.
The latter will lead to trouble sooner rather than later, as my plants are
spreading in width at about 2 ft per year.

[Franz Heymann]

The nursery trade usually grow them as budded(grafted) plants - it's reliable, cheap and economical with the
propagation material. Unfortunately with plants like R. rugosa varieties you lose the natural thicket forming habit of
the plant and run the risk of getting suckers. If they are planted deeply then the scion (cultivated variety) will root
and form a thicket as it would naturally but you will still have a risk of suckers growing from the understock. If you
are sure that what you're seeing are suckers and not the natural habit of the plant asserting itself then you should
remove them - and it won't be easy ;~((( I've got a couple like this, took us a a while to notice the suckers towering
over them, then guess who had to crawl underneath to the middle to get them out. Look for distinctly different stems,
prickles and leaves. Young rugosa stems are lightish green densly populated with *lots* of tiny prickles. Common
understocks will be much more sparsely populated with larger slightly hooked prickles.

Rod



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Old 05-08-2003, 08:32 PM
David Hill
 
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Default Shrub roses

"............ I have a few shrub roses of the Rugosa type. They are all
throwing up suckers by the dozen.

My question is whether such roses are customarily grown as cuttings, or are
they grafted? ........"

If the roses are rugosa then they are on their own roots so the suckers will
be the same as the top growth.

Many shrub roses are good growers on their own roots, and again suckers come
true.
A quick look at the wood of the top growth should tell you if the top are
rugosa.(The Thorns)


--
David Hill
Abacus nurseries
www.abacus-nurseries.co.uk



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Old 05-08-2003, 09:33 PM
Franz Heymann
 
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Default Shrub roses


"Kay Easton" wrote in message
...
In article , Franz Heymann
writes
I have a few shrub roses of the Rugosa type. They are all throwng up
suckers by the dozen.
My question is whether such roses are customarily grown as cuttings,

or
are they grafted?
The reason I ask is to help me decide whether to remove the suckers
and/or to replant them, or whether I just leave them on the parent

bushes.
The latter will lead to trouble sooner rather than later, as my plants

are
spreading in width at about 2 ft per year.


Mine are on their own roots, and they do sucker pretty freely.

Can you not tell from the foliage? Is it rugosa type or dog rose type?


The growth is clearly rugosa type. But being a suspicious sort of a bloke,
I had wondered whether my roses were perhaps grafted on to wild rugosa
stock. I have a vague memory that rugosa is used for stock for grafting and
budding, but I may be wrong.

[Franz Heymann]




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Old 05-08-2003, 10:02 PM
Franz Heymann
 
Posts: n/a
Default Shrub roses


"David Hill" wrote in message
...
"............ I have a few shrub roses of the Rugosa type. They are all
throwing up suckers by the dozen.

My question is whether such roses are customarily grown as cuttings, or

are
they grafted? ........"

If the roses are rugosa then they are on their own roots so the suckers

will
be the same as the top growth.

Many shrub roses are good growers on their own roots, and again suckers

come
true.


I have a few hybrid teas which I grew as cuttings. They are thriving better
than their parents.

A quick look at the wood of the top growth should tell you if the top are
rugosa.(The Thorns)


They are definitely rugosa growth, but see my reply to Kay Easton.

I think I will just spade out some of the suckers and plant them out to see
what gives.
It looks to me as if my soil, even though it is only a few inches above
bedrock, is a perfect home for rugosas.

[Franz Heymann]



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Old 05-08-2003, 10:02 PM
Franz Heymann
 
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Default Shrub roses


"Rod" wrote in message
...
"Franz Heymann" wrote in message

...
I have a few shrub roses of the Rugosa type. They are all throwng up
suckers by the dozen.
My question is whether such roses are customarily grown as cuttings,

or
are they grafted?
The reason I ask is to help me decide whether to remove the suckers
and/or to replant them, or whether I just leave them on the parent

bushes.
The latter will lead to trouble sooner rather than later, as my plants

are
spreading in width at about 2 ft per year.

[Franz Heymann]

The nursery trade usually grow them as budded(grafted) plants - it's

reliable, cheap and economical with the
propagation material. Unfortunately with plants like R. rugosa varieties

you lose the natural thicket forming habit of
the plant and run the risk of getting suckers. If they are planted deeply

then the scion (cultivated variety) will root
and form a thicket as it would naturally but you will still have a risk

of suckers growing from the understock. If you
are sure that what you're seeing are suckers and not the natural habit of

the plant asserting itself then you should
remove them - and it won't be easy ;~((( I've got a couple like this,

took us a a while to notice the suckers towering
over them, then guess who had to crawl underneath to the middle to get

them out. Look for distinctly different stems,
prickles and leaves. Young rugosa stems are lightish green densly

populated with *lots* of tiny prickles. Common
understocks will be much more sparsely populated with larger slightly

hooked prickles.

Thanks, Rod. See my other replies in this thread.

[Franz Heymann]


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Old 05-08-2003, 10:42 PM
Rod
 
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Default Shrub roses


"Franz Heymann" wrote in message ...

Thanks, Rod. See my other replies in this thread.

R. rugosa isn't normally used as an understock for bush or shrub roses (imagine the suckering problems!). It is widely used to
produce stems for standard roses so my guess is that what you have is R. rugosa varieties on their own roots doing just what rugosa
does best.
We tried some rugosa cuttings for cheap rootstocks once but they weren't that cheap to produce and they didn't take buds very well.

Rod


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Old 06-08-2003, 10:02 AM
Franz Heymann
 
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Default Shrub roses


"Rod" wrote in message
...

[snip]

R. rugosa isn't normally used as an understock for bush or shrub roses

(imagine the suckering problems!). It is widely used to
produce stems for standard roses


How is the suckering problem avoided in the case of rugosa stems for
standard roses?

[snip]

[Franz Heymann]


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Old 06-08-2003, 08:03 PM
Rod
 
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Default Shrub roses


"Franz Heymann" wrote in message ...
How is the suckering problem avoided in the case of rugosa stems for
standard roses?

It tends not to be so much of a problem with standards and any suckers that do appear are easily seen and easy to get
to - not like in a thicket of shrub roses. Hopefully you have this great vigorous head on the standard asserting apical
dominance - ie hogging all the auxins (growth hormones) and inhibiting growth of buds lower down.

Rod




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