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Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
Thanks so much to all for your help - we've found a house with an acre
of land.... but I'm not saying any more in case one of you gazumps me! . Thing is, said acre is currently rather exposed to wind and traffic noise, so dh and I are eager to make a walled garden by building brick walls around at least part of it. Are we mad? I've looked at several websites and the art of bricklaying seems very jargon laden. Does anyone know of a site in plain English? And has anyone ever done one of those night-school bricklaying courses? -- Jane Lumley |
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Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
"Jane Lumley" wrote in message ... Thanks so much to all for your help - we've found a house with an acre of land.... but I'm not saying any more in case one of you gazumps me! . Thing is, said acre is currently rather exposed to wind and traffic noise, so dh and I are eager to make a walled garden by building brick walls around at least part of it. Are we mad? I've looked at several websites and the art of bricklaying seems very jargon laden. Does anyone know of a site in plain English? And has anyone ever done one of those night-school bricklaying courses? -- Jane Lumley I am not quite replying to your exact question but hopefully, I will add something of use here. You mentioned that the site was exposed to wind, and you were proposing to build a wall. Well its just that walls are not that good a acting as wind breaks. The problem is that the wind hits your wall and is diverted up and over. The results is lots of eddys and a more buffetting effect on the leeward side of the wall. A tall hedge on the other hand filters the wind. The wind hits your hedge and is slowed down by the branches twigs and leaves. In these circumstancs the leeward side of the hedge would be a more peaceful place than the leeward side of a wall. |
#3
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Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
The message
from Jane Lumley contains these words: Thanks so much to all for your help - we've found a house with an acre of land.... but I'm not saying any more in case one of you gazumps me! . Thing is, said acre is currently rather exposed to wind and traffic noise, so dh and I are eager to make a walled garden by building brick walls around at least part of it. Are we mad? I've looked at several websites and the art of bricklaying seems very jargon laden. Does anyone know of a site in plain English? And has anyone ever done one of those night-school bricklaying courses? Try ex-urgler cormaic's site, www.pavingexpert. We moved (from a rural garden well over 3 acres) partly because of rapidly increasing traffic noise and nuisance. In our situation, it was mostly tourist traffic; IOW, it was at its worst at exactly the times we wanted to be outside enjoying the garden, in good weather and all holiday periods. Is this industrial traffic (might be quieter at weekends)? Sports or tourist-attraction traffic, could be worse at weekends? You're seeing it in winter; is it likely to be quieter now than in summer? Visit the area during rush hours. Do people chug past in a slow tail of traffic at 30 mph, or race past at 70? Can you get in and out of the gate safely at busy times? Is the traffic mostly cars, or huge reverberating trucks? Shut yourself in the bedrooms, listen to the noise, and ask yourself if you'll be able to sleep with a window open. I'd think very, very hard if I were you, about what you want from your garden and what you can tolerate. IMHO you won't shut out traffic noise or fumes from one acre, with a wall (or anything else). Janet. |
#4
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Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
The message
from Jane Lumley contains these words: Thanks so much to all for your help - we've found a house with an acre of land.... but I'm not saying any more in case one of you gazumps me! . Well, really! If you're that suspicious of us..... ......you can tell us when it's yours. Thing is, said acre is currently rather exposed to wind and traffic noise, so dh and I are eager to make a walled garden by building brick walls around at least part of it. Are we mad? Maybe. You'd be surprised just how much noise a good dense hedge will absorb. Walls are expensive things to build, though in the right position can be used to grow fruit against. You will need to get planning permission probably. If it's windy and really exposed, lengths of wall tend to come down. Think 'crinkly-crankly': you use more bricks, but it is not likely to be blown over. Best to attend an evening class in bricklaying: it's not really difficult. I was taught by Old Bob, [1] a brickie's labourer - he was in his nineties and still labouring. (It got a bit much for him when he was ninety eight (IIRC) and he got a job cleaning Mr. Whippy vans.) I've looked at several websites and the art of bricklaying seems very jargon laden. Does anyone know of a site in plain English? And has anyone ever done one of those night-school bricklaying courses? Oops! Got a bit ahead of myself there! Old Bob taught me properly, using matured lime mortar and having the frogs in the bricks on the underside so water doesn't seep into them and freeze during the winter. Nowadays, because it's easier and quicker, brickies tend to lay courses with the frogs upwards. "Oh, that's all right as long as you point them well....." Pah! -- Rusty Hinge http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/tqt.htm Dark thoughts about the Wumpus concerto played with piano, iron bar and two sledge hammers. (Wumpus, 15/11/03) |
#5
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Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
The message
from Jane Lumley contains these words: Thanks so much to all for your help - we've found a house with an acre of land.... but I'm not saying any more in case one of you gazumps me! . Well, really! If you're that suspicious of us..... ......you can tell us when it's yours. Thing is, said acre is currently rather exposed to wind and traffic noise, so dh and I are eager to make a walled garden by building brick walls around at least part of it. Are we mad? Maybe. You'd be surprised just how much noise a good dense hedge will absorb. Walls are expensive things to build, though in the right position can be used to grow fruit against. You will need to get planning permission probably. If it's windy and really exposed, lengths of wall tend to come down. Think 'crinkly-crankly': you use more bricks, but it is not likely to be blown over. Best to attend an evening class in bricklaying: it's not really difficult. I was taught by Old Bob, [1] a brickie's labourer - he was in his nineties and still labouring. (It got a bit much for him when he was ninety eight (IIRC) and he got a job cleaning Mr. Whippy vans.) I've looked at several websites and the art of bricklaying seems very jargon laden. Does anyone know of a site in plain English? And has anyone ever done one of those night-school bricklaying courses? Oops! Got a bit ahead of myself there! Old Bob taught me properly, using matured lime mortar and having the frogs in the bricks on the underside so water doesn't seep into them and freeze during the winter. Nowadays, because it's easier and quicker, brickies tend to lay courses with the frogs upwards. "Oh, that's all right as long as you point them well....." Pah! -- Rusty Hinge http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/tqt.htm Dark thoughts about the Wumpus concerto played with piano, iron bar and two sledge hammers. (Wumpus, 15/11/03) |
#6
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Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
"Philip" wrote in message .. . "Jane Lumley" wrote in message ... Thanks so much to all for your help - we've found a house with an acre of land.... but I'm not saying any more in case one of you gazumps me! . Thing is, said acre is currently rather exposed to wind and traffic noise, so dh and I are eager to make a walled garden by building brick walls around at least part of it. Are we mad? I've looked at several websites and the art of bricklaying seems very jargon laden. Does anyone know of a site in plain English? And has anyone ever done one of those night-school bricklaying courses? -- Jane Lumley I am not quite replying to your exact question but hopefully, I will add something of use here. You mentioned that the site was exposed to wind, and you were proposing to build a wall. Well its just that walls are not that good a acting as wind breaks. The problem is that the wind hits your wall and is diverted up and over. The results is lots of eddys and a more buffetting effect on the leeward side of the wall. A tall hedge on the other hand filters the wind. The wind hits your hedge and is slowed down by the branches twigs and leaves. In these circumstancs the leeward side of the hedge would be a more peaceful place than the leeward side of a wall. And that is not just a legend. I had a book (where is the damn thing?) with test results from research on hedges and walls as windbreaks. A hedge provides wind shelter for more than twice as far downwind than a wall of the same height. Franz |
#7
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Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
On Sun, 30 Nov 2003 09:24:01 +0000 (UTC), "Franz Heymann"
wrote: "Philip" wrote in message . .. "Jane Lumley" wrote in message ... Thanks so much to all for your help - we've found a house with an acre of land.... but I'm not saying any more in case one of you gazumps me! . Thing is, said acre is currently rather exposed to wind and traffic noise, so dh and I are eager to make a walled garden by building brick walls around at least part of it. Are we mad? I've looked at several websites and the art of bricklaying seems very jargon laden. Does anyone know of a site in plain English? And has anyone ever done one of those night-school bricklaying courses? -- Jane Lumley I am not quite replying to your exact question but hopefully, I will add something of use here. You mentioned that the site was exposed to wind, and you were proposing to build a wall. Well its just that walls are not that good a acting as wind breaks. The problem is that the wind hits your wall and is diverted up and over. The results is lots of eddys and a more buffetting effect on the leeward side of the wall. A tall hedge on the other hand filters the wind. The wind hits your hedge and is slowed down by the branches twigs and leaves. In these circumstancs the leeward side of the hedge would be a more peaceful place than the leeward side of a wall. And that is not just a legend. I had a book (where is the damn thing?) with test results from research on hedges and walls as windbreaks. A hedge provides wind shelter for more than twice as far downwind than a wall of the same height. It's a bit like the difference between a solid break water/sea walls and barriers of large loose rocks, now so popular in North East England's sea defences. The first diverts waves and the second absorbs waves. -- Martin |
#8
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Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
"Janet Baraclough" wrote in message ... : The message : from Jane Lumley contains these words: : : Thanks so much to all for your help - we've found a house with an acre : of land.... but I'm not saying any more in case one of you gazumps me! : . : : Thing is, said acre is currently rather exposed to wind and traffic : noise, so dh and I are eager to make a walled garden by building brick : walls around at least part of it. Are we mad? : : I've looked at several : websites and the art of bricklaying seems very jargon laden. Does : anyone know of a site in plain English? And has anyone ever done one of : those night-school bricklaying courses? : : Try ex-urgler cormaic's site, www.pavingexpert. : : We moved (from a rural garden well over 3 acres) partly because of : rapidly increasing traffic noise and nuisance. In our situation, it was : mostly tourist traffic; IOW, it was at its worst at exactly the times we : wanted to be outside enjoying the garden, in good weather and all : holiday periods. : : Is this industrial traffic (might be quieter at weekends)? Sports or : tourist-attraction traffic, could be worse at weekends? You're seeing it : in winter; is it likely to be quieter now than in summer? Visit the area : during rush hours. Do people chug past in a slow tail of traffic at 30 : mph, or race past at 70? Can you get in and out of the gate safely at : busy times? Is the traffic mostly cars, or huge reverberating trucks? : Shut yourself in the bedrooms, listen to the noise, and ask yourself if : you'll be able to sleep with a window open. : : I'd think very, very hard if I were you, about what you want from your : garden and what you can tolerate. IMHO you won't shut out traffic noise : or fumes from one acre, with a wall (or anything else). : : Janet. : I would agree with Janet. We live in a suburban cul-de-sac approx 5 miles from Heathrow. We obviously get a certain amount of aircraft noise and if the wind is in a certain direction and they are using a certain runway, the planes take off overhead which can be unbearable - but better now that Concorde is no longer with us - but does not happen too often. However, my point is that we always say we prefer to live here than on a road that has constant traffic noise day and night. Mind you, we may feel differently when we get the 5th terminal, 3rd runway, etc etc....... K |
#9
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Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
"martin" wrote in message news On Sun, 30 Nov 2003 09:24:01 +0000 (UTC), "Franz Heymann" wrote: "Philip" wrote in message . .. "Jane Lumley" wrote in message ... Thanks so much to all for your help - we've found a house with an acre of land.... but I'm not saying any more in case one of you gazumps me! . Thing is, said acre is currently rather exposed to wind and traffic noise, so dh and I are eager to make a walled garden by building brick walls around at least part of it. Are we mad? I've looked at several websites and the art of bricklaying seems very jargon laden. Does anyone know of a site in plain English? And has anyone ever done one of those night-school bricklaying courses? -- Jane Lumley I am not quite replying to your exact question but hopefully, I will add something of use here. You mentioned that the site was exposed to wind, and you were proposing to build a wall. Well its just that walls are not that good a acting as wind breaks. The problem is that the wind hits your wall and is diverted up and over. The results is lots of eddys and a more buffetting effect on the leeward side of the wall. A tall hedge on the other hand filters the wind. The wind hits your hedge and is slowed down by the branches twigs and leaves. In these circumstancs the leeward side of the hedge would be a more peaceful place than the leeward side of a wall. And that is not just a legend. I had a book (where is the damn thing?) with test results from research on hedges and walls as windbreaks. A hedge provides wind shelter for more than twice as far downwind than a wall of the same height. It's a bit like the difference between a solid break water/sea walls and barriers of large loose rocks, now so popular in North East England's sea defences. The first diverts waves and the second absorbs waves. Yes. Identical principles. The principle of least efficient fluid flow - to - mechanical energy conversion. Franz |
#10
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Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
"Jane Lumley" wrote in message ... Thanks so much to all for your help - we've found a house with an acre of land.... but I'm not saying any more in case one of you gazumps me! . Thing is, said acre is currently rather exposed to wind and traffic noise, so dh and I are eager to make a walled garden by building brick walls around at least part of it. Are we mad? I've looked at several websites and the art of bricklaying seems very jargon laden. Does anyone know of a site in plain English? And has anyone ever done one of those night-school bricklaying courses? -- Jane Lumley Search out from yellow pages a company that simply does bricklaying you will find they should only charge per 1000 bricks and the cost will be much cheaper than you think However you do need to use good bricks .,,......as many ordinary faced ones like LBC are unsuitable because wet and frost blows face off the bricks |
#11
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Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
The message
from Jaques d'Alltrades contains these words: Best to attend an evening class in bricklaying: it's not really difficult. I was taught by Old Bob, [1] a brickie's labourer - he was in his nineties and still labouring. (It got a bit much for him when he was ninety eight (IIRC) and he got a job cleaning Mr. Whippy vans.) Missing footnote: [1] Not as brewed by Ridleys, but quite as good. -- Rusty Hinge http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/tqt.htm Dark thoughts about the Wumpus concerto played with piano, iron bar and two sledge hammers. (Wumpus, 15/11/03) |
#12
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Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
In article , Janet Baraclough
writes The message from Jane Lumley contains these words: Thanks so much to all for your help - we've found a house with an acre of land.... but I'm not saying any more in case one of you gazumps me! . Thing is, said acre is currently rather exposed to wind and traffic noise, so dh and I are eager to make a walled garden by building brick walls around at least part of it. Are we mad? I'd think very, very hard if I were you, about what you want from your garden and what you can tolerate. IMHO you won't shut out traffic noise or fumes from one acre, with a wall (or anything else). Secondary double glazing does a better job of shutting out traffic noise than the all in one stuff - you need a larger air gap for sound insulation than you do for heat insulation. We have double glazed units plus secondary double glazing on the front of the house, and that cuts out noise quite effectively. A house is quite good at blocking out noise, so if you can arrange it so you do most of your living the side away from the road it will be more tolerable. -- Kay Easton Edward's earthworm page: http://www.scarboro.demon.co.uk/edward/index.htm |
#13
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Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
In article , Philip
writes I am not quite replying to your exact question but hopefully, I will add something of use here. You mentioned that the site was exposed to wind, and you were proposing to build a wall. Well its just that walls are not that good a acting as wind breaks. The problem is that the wind hits your wall and is diverted up and over. The results is lots of eddys and a more buffetting effect on the leeward side of the wall. A tall hedge on the other hand filters the wind. The wind hits your hedge and is slowed down by the branches twigs and leaves. In these circumstancs the leeward side of the hedge would be a more peaceful place than the leeward side of a wall. But a hedge is fairly rubbish at cutting out noise. Though you'll need a very tall wall to cut out the traffic sound. A bank with a hedge on top might do quite well if you have the room - no experience of that, but it's what they seem to be doing alongside new bypasses nowadays. -- Kay Easton Edward's earthworm page: http://www.scarboro.demon.co.uk/edward/index.htm |
#14
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Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
On Sun, 30 Nov 2003 15:55:51 +0000, Kay Easton
wrote: In article , Janet Baraclough writes The message from Jane Lumley contains these words: Thanks so much to all for your help - we've found a house with an acre of land.... but I'm not saying any more in case one of you gazumps me! . Thing is, said acre is currently rather exposed to wind and traffic noise, so dh and I are eager to make a walled garden by building brick walls around at least part of it. Are we mad? I'd think very, very hard if I were you, about what you want from your garden and what you can tolerate. IMHO you won't shut out traffic noise or fumes from one acre, with a wall (or anything else). Secondary double glazing does a better job of shutting out traffic noise than the all in one stuff - you need a larger air gap for sound insulation than you do for heat insulation. We have double glazed units plus secondary double glazing on the front of the house, and that cuts out noise quite effectively. A house is quite good at blocking out noise, so if you can arrange it so you do most of your living the side away from the road it will be more tolerable. It enabled us to hear the planes passing a 1000 feet above our heads more clearly :-) -- Martin |
#15
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Jane finds her garden:brick wall question
On Sun, 30 Nov 2003 15:58:18 +0000, Kay Easton
wrote: But a hedge is fairly rubbish at cutting out noise. Though you'll need a very tall wall to cut out the traffic sound. A bank with a hedge on top might do quite well if you have the room - no experience of that, but it's what they seem to be doing alongside new bypasses nowadays. It doesn't mean that it is effective. The Dutch installed hundreds of kilometers of sound barriers along urban parts of their motorways, before somebody made some independent sound measurements and proved that the stuff was not effective. Locally somebody did some tests that demonstrated that in a gale the whole lot my blow over, so they made lots of really big holes in it. -- Martin |
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