The message
from "Anthony" contains
these words:

So the word allotment is NOT specified!
Have you read what you cut and pasted?
It seems to be hiden in a secret paragraph.
You see I could talk about telegraph poles, cars and cess pits, because each
of my neighbours has one or more in their garden, and still be on topic by
your argument.

Most, or all of which have been discussed in urg in the past. We also
talk about ponds, woodland, bog-gardens, and a host of other subjects
which are not specified. Unlike you, I have collected urg on and off for
about seven years, and you'd be surprised at some of the subjects
discussed.

This is what 'this is not intended to be an ehaustive list' means.

It will always be OK because somebody says it is 'not an
exhaustive list'.

It rather depends on the angle of aproach.

--
Rusty
Open the creaking gate to make a horrid.squeak, then lower the foobar.
http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/

The message
from "Anthony" contains
these words:

Of course. Why did you bother to post?

Why did you waste bandwidth replying?

Why can't you both trim your posts?

--
Rusty
Open the creaking gate to make a horrid.squeak, then lower the foobar.
http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/

On Thu, 26 Feb 2004 12:49:23 GMT, Janet Baraclough ..
wrote:

big snip
~
~If Gary's proposal doesn't meet the required standard to form a group
~within the Big 8 hierarchies, he could always go downmarket and start an
~alt.group about allotments. Oops, I'm forgetting..he already thought of
~that, and got blown out of the water then too, for equally good reasons.
~
~Google/groups search facility is such a mixed blessing, isn't it? :-)
~
~ Janet

Well well!
Thanks a lot, Janet... I'd never have noticed this otherwise...

http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=e...3D Google%2BS
earch
is the whole thread
http://tinyurl.com/385oq
if the other one doesn't work... :-)

This is the first email.
The thread is worth reading, for those of you are in two minds...

QUOTE.................................
From: Gary [Torquay] )
Subject: [Proposal] alt.uk.allotments
Newsgroups: alt.config
Date: 2004-01-22 16:57:21 PST

Here is a proposal for alt.uk.allotments on 23.1.2004

This group is designed to help other allotment holders to stay in
touch across the UK for
planting times, general planting methods and ideal pest control
ect..

Iam a allotment holder for "South Parks" here in Torquay Devon.
I have searched for a group of this kind but can not find it
available.
I feel that "alt.uk.allotments" would be popular group to discuss
allotment issues.

Many Thanks
Gary Poston

END QUOTE..............................

specifically *this* reply:

QUOTE...........................

From: BarB )
Subject: [Proposal] alt.uk.allotments
Newsgroups: alt.config
Date: 2004-01-23 14:09:18 PST

Bring up your idea in uk.rec.gardening. If there's enough interest,
you might have the votes to split off a sub group, perhaps name it
uk.rec.gardening.allotments.

Directions for that hierarchy are found at www.usenet.org.uk
The config group is uk.net.news.config.

Hierarchy: uk.*
Country: United Kingdom
Language: English
Newsgroup(s): uk.net.news.announce(m), uk.net.news.config
Email:
URL(s): www.usenet.org.uk


BarB

END QUOTE........................

Now if he'd actually done what was suggested, ie brought up the idea
and discussed it with us he may have had a lot better response... as
it was, he just sprang the idea on us with no discussion.




--
jane

Don't part with your illusions. When they are gone,
you may still exist but you have ceased to live.
Mark Twain

Please remove onmaps from replies, thanks!

On Thu, 26 Feb 2004 12:49:23 GMT, Janet Baraclough ..
wrote:

big snip
~
~If Gary's proposal doesn't meet the required standard to form a group
~within the Big 8 hierarchies, he could always go downmarket and start an
~alt.group about allotments. Oops, I'm forgetting..he already thought of
~that, and got blown out of the water then too, for equally good reasons.
~
~Google/groups search facility is such a mixed blessing, isn't it? :-)
~
~ Janet

Well well!
Thanks a lot, Janet... I'd never have noticed this otherwise...

http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=e...3D Google%2BS
earch
is the whole thread
http://tinyurl.com/385oq
if the other one doesn't work... :-)

This is the first email.
The thread is worth reading, for those of you are in two minds...

QUOTE.................................
From: Gary [Torquay] )
Subject: [Proposal] alt.uk.allotments
Newsgroups: alt.config
Date: 2004-01-22 16:57:21 PST

Here is a proposal for alt.uk.allotments on 23.1.2004

This group is designed to help other allotment holders to stay in
touch across the UK for
planting times, general planting methods and ideal pest control
ect..

Iam a allotment holder for "South Parks" here in Torquay Devon.
I have searched for a group of this kind but can not find it
available.
I feel that "alt.uk.allotments" would be popular group to discuss
allotment issues.

Many Thanks
Gary Poston

END QUOTE..............................

specifically *this* reply:

QUOTE...........................

From: BarB )
Subject: [Proposal] alt.uk.allotments
Newsgroups: alt.config
Date: 2004-01-23 14:09:18 PST

Bring up your idea in uk.rec.gardening. If there's enough interest,
you might have the votes to split off a sub group, perhaps name it
uk.rec.gardening.allotments.

Directions for that hierarchy are found at www.usenet.org.uk
The config group is uk.net.news.config.

Hierarchy: uk.*
Country: United Kingdom
Language: English
Newsgroup(s): uk.net.news.announce(m), uk.net.news.config
Email:
URL(s): www.usenet.org.uk


BarB

END QUOTE........................

Now if he'd actually done what was suggested, ie brought up the idea
and discussed it with us he may have had a lot better response... as
it was, he just sprang the idea on us with no discussion.




--
jane

Don't part with your illusions. When they are gone,
you may still exist but you have ceased to live.
Mark Twain

Please remove onmaps from replies, thanks!

On Fri, 27 Feb 2004 09:42:13 +0000 (UTC),
(jane) wrote:

On Thu, 26 Feb 2004 12:49:23 GMT, Janet Baraclough ..
wrote:

big snip
~
~If Gary's proposal doesn't meet the required standard to form a group
~within the Big 8 hierarchies, he could always go downmarket and start an
~alt.group about allotments. Oops, I'm forgetting..he already thought of
~that, and got blown out of the water then too, for equally good reasons.
~
~Google/groups search facility is such a mixed blessing, isn't it? :-)
~
~ Janet

Well well!
Thanks a lot, Janet... I'd never have noticed this otherwise...

http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=e...%3D Google%2B
Search
is the whole thread
http://tinyurl.com/385oq
if the other one doesn't work... :-)

This is the first email.
The thread is worth reading, for those of you are in two minds...

LOL very good

and a feeling of deja vu from ...

quote on
From: ratzilla )
Subject: [Proposal] alt.uk.allotments

View this article only
Newsgroups: alt.config
Date: 2004-01-22 17:25:20 PST

"Gary [Torquay]" wrote in
:

Here is a proposal for alt.uk.allotments on 23.1.2004

This group is designed to help other allotment holders to stay in
touch across the UK for planting times, general planting methods and
ideal pest control ect..

Another very specifically british topic (for an international group.)

Uk.rec.gardening is crawling with allotment-holders, posting about
their
allotments - since you don't appear to have posted on the topic,
recommend
you try it.

"To discuss gardening questions and share tips on-
Weeds, flowers, shrubs, trees, fruit and veg., lawns, beneficial
insects and animals, pests and diseases, soils, composting, design,
location, situation, seasons/times, hard structures (paths,
greenhouses, cloches, rockeries), tools and materials."

end quote
--

Knowledge is knowing a tomato is a fruit;
Wisdom is not putting it in a fruit salad

On Fri, 27 Feb 2004 09:42:13 +0000 (UTC),
(jane) wrote:

On Thu, 26 Feb 2004 12:49:23 GMT, Janet Baraclough ..
wrote:

big snip
~
~If Gary's proposal doesn't meet the required standard to form a group
~within the Big 8 hierarchies, he could always go downmarket and start an
~alt.group about allotments. Oops, I'm forgetting..he already thought of
~that, and got blown out of the water then too, for equally good reasons.
~
~Google/groups search facility is such a mixed blessing, isn't it? :-)
~
~ Janet

Well well!
Thanks a lot, Janet... I'd never have noticed this otherwise...

http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=e...%3D Google%2B
Search
is the whole thread
http://tinyurl.com/385oq
if the other one doesn't work... :-)

This is the first email.
The thread is worth reading, for those of you are in two minds...

LOL very good

and a feeling of deja vu from ...

quote on
From: ratzilla )
Subject: [Proposal] alt.uk.allotments

View this article only
Newsgroups: alt.config
Date: 2004-01-22 17:25:20 PST

"Gary [Torquay]" wrote in
:

Here is a proposal for alt.uk.allotments on 23.1.2004

This group is designed to help other allotment holders to stay in
touch across the UK for planting times, general planting methods and
ideal pest control ect..

Another very specifically british topic (for an international group.)

Uk.rec.gardening is crawling with allotment-holders, posting about
their
allotments - since you don't appear to have posted on the topic,
recommend
you try it.

"To discuss gardening questions and share tips on-
Weeds, flowers, shrubs, trees, fruit and veg., lawns, beneficial
insects and animals, pests and diseases, soils, composting, design,
location, situation, seasons/times, hard structures (paths,
greenhouses, cloches, rockeries), tools and materials."

end quote
--

Knowledge is knowing a tomato is a fruit;
Wisdom is not putting it in a fruit salad

On Thu, 26 Feb 2004 23:21:42 -0000, "Anthony"
wrote:


"Franz Heymann" wrote in message
...
Yes but it WASN'T the FULL QUOTE, which affected its meaning.

Who do you think you are bluffing? I have just looked again at the
original
and it is clear that my quotation conveys the sense of the original.

It wasn't YOUR quotation, it belonged to Janet, whom I replied to.
Having trouble following the thread Franz?
Taking credit for something written by another, theres a name for that!

Ah, so is his intent just to split urg, thereby being the opposite of
"good
for URG"

Where does he say he wants to split urg? The actual quote please.
What realistically do you think the harm would be?

Where did I say that he *said* he wants to split urg?
I *deduced* that he wants to split urg. Why else would he be proposing a
new group when in fact there are allotmenteers happily contributing to
urg?
The proposer has not once tried to raise matters of interest to
allotmenteers in urg. Indeed, it seems that he has never even lurked in
urg, otherwise he would have been aware that allotment issues *are* in
fact
discussed there.

You are making it up as you go along! How on earth can you know that someone
has not 'lurked' in a group?
That is the most stupid remark you have made so far...................

That is total rubbish. Please familiarise yourself with urg's charter
and
understand it before talking such nonsense.

Again, Quote to me where in the charter of urg. it specifies the
discussion
of allotments.

Are you really as silly as you come across? The charter does not say
anywhere that growing lavender bushes or raising half hardy seedlings are
suitable topics for discussion in urg either. So, are we supposed to
avert
our eyes when those topics crop up?

Not covered under 'flowers or shrubs' then?
Wow, no wonder you subscribe to this group, your gardening knowledge is very
poor.
Now tell me what allotments would come under the heading of?

How gripping.


If it not specified it is strictly speaking OFF topic.
I have read the charter, have you? Can you find it?

on another group, where people can talk vegetables, sheds and
planning to their
hearts content.

Urglers are in fact this very minute discussing "sheds and planning
to
their hearts content."
Please look at the list of current threads.

What? Just started one have you?

You are obviously quite unfamiliar with the contents of urg in the past
and
now. That does not put you in a good position for defending the setting
up
of a breakaway group.

Use Google, I know how long you have been posting.

I bet that scares him.

I leave it for others to decide for themselves whether that last
paragraph
spells out a case for splitting a very active group just to satisfy
the
whim
of a person, or small coterie of folk who have never tried to
participate
in
the existing group.

Its not for me to spell out the case for the formation for the new
group.

Why have you then written this particular note?

But I cannot for the life of me understand why you would want to oppose
just
because
the proposer hasn't posted enough to urg in the past, or has chosen to
remain on the sidelines.

Snip an attempted insult .

******, snip that then! lol

The bandwidth issue has been spouted but no evidence has been given to
prove
that more space
would be taken up by the new group. Time and again, you Franz, have
stated
that all posts to the
proposed group would be crossposted, again without a shread of evidence
being cited.

You are being even more silly than you are. How on earth can evidence
have
accrued for an event in the future?

It was your argument Franz, how soon you forget. Use google to check what
you have posted in the past if your memory is failing.

All that shows us is you lied about where you live and you are a
coward, what have we missed?

But for a somewhat analogous case, look at what happened in uk.rec.audio
when uk.rec.audio.vinyl and uk.rec.audio.car were spawned.

Many reasons therefore against the motion with a distinct lack of
evidence.

You are being needlessly repetitive.

The proposer has been accused of 'Empire Building', I personally think
that
some people are
frightened that their own 'little empire' may be under threat in some
way.
Still we can agree to differ can't we Franz. You vote your way, I'll
vote
mine.

Of course. Why did you bother to post?

Why did you waste bandwidth replying?


Shut the **** up you whinging troll and take your bottlejob lifestyle
elsewhere.

On Thu, 26 Feb 2004 23:21:42 -0000, "Anthony"
wrote:


"Franz Heymann" wrote in message
...
Yes but it WASN'T the FULL QUOTE, which affected its meaning.

Who do you think you are bluffing? I have just looked again at the
original
and it is clear that my quotation conveys the sense of the original.

It wasn't YOUR quotation, it belonged to Janet, whom I replied to.
Having trouble following the thread Franz?
Taking credit for something written by another, theres a name for that!

Ah, so is his intent just to split urg, thereby being the opposite of
"good
for URG"

Where does he say he wants to split urg? The actual quote please.
What realistically do you think the harm would be?

Where did I say that he *said* he wants to split urg?
I *deduced* that he wants to split urg. Why else would he be proposing a
new group when in fact there are allotmenteers happily contributing to
urg?
The proposer has not once tried to raise matters of interest to
allotmenteers in urg. Indeed, it seems that he has never even lurked in
urg, otherwise he would have been aware that allotment issues *are* in
fact
discussed there.

You are making it up as you go along! How on earth can you know that someone
has not 'lurked' in a group?
That is the most stupid remark you have made so far...................

That is total rubbish. Please familiarise yourself with urg's charter
and
understand it before talking such nonsense.

Again, Quote to me where in the charter of urg. it specifies the
discussion
of allotments.

Are you really as silly as you come across? The charter does not say
anywhere that growing lavender bushes or raising half hardy seedlings are
suitable topics for discussion in urg either. So, are we supposed to
avert
our eyes when those topics crop up?

Not covered under 'flowers or shrubs' then?
Wow, no wonder you subscribe to this group, your gardening knowledge is very
poor.
Now tell me what allotments would come under the heading of?

How gripping.


If it not specified it is strictly speaking OFF topic.
I have read the charter, have you? Can you find it?

on another group, where people can talk vegetables, sheds and
planning to their
hearts content.

Urglers are in fact this very minute discussing "sheds and planning
to
their hearts content."
Please look at the list of current threads.

What? Just started one have you?

You are obviously quite unfamiliar with the contents of urg in the past
and
now. That does not put you in a good position for defending the setting
up
of a breakaway group.

Use Google, I know how long you have been posting.

I bet that scares him.

I leave it for others to decide for themselves whether that last
paragraph
spells out a case for splitting a very active group just to satisfy
the
whim
of a person, or small coterie of folk who have never tried to
participate
in
the existing group.

Its not for me to spell out the case for the formation for the new
group.

Why have you then written this particular note?

But I cannot for the life of me understand why you would want to oppose
just
because
the proposer hasn't posted enough to urg in the past, or has chosen to
remain on the sidelines.

Snip an attempted insult .

******, snip that then! lol

The bandwidth issue has been spouted but no evidence has been given to
prove
that more space
would be taken up by the new group. Time and again, you Franz, have
stated
that all posts to the
proposed group would be crossposted, again without a shread of evidence
being cited.

You are being even more silly than you are. How on earth can evidence
have
accrued for an event in the future?

It was your argument Franz, how soon you forget. Use google to check what
you have posted in the past if your memory is failing.

All that shows us is you lied about where you live and you are a
coward, what have we missed?

But for a somewhat analogous case, look at what happened in uk.rec.audio
when uk.rec.audio.vinyl and uk.rec.audio.car were spawned.

Many reasons therefore against the motion with a distinct lack of
evidence.

You are being needlessly repetitive.

The proposer has been accused of 'Empire Building', I personally think
that
some people are
frightened that their own 'little empire' may be under threat in some
way.
Still we can agree to differ can't we Franz. You vote your way, I'll
vote
mine.

Of course. Why did you bother to post?

Why did you waste bandwidth replying?


Shut the **** up you whinging troll and take your bottlejob lifestyle
elsewhere.

On Thu, 26 Feb 2004 23:21:42 -0000, "Anthony"
wrote:


"Franz Heymann" wrote in message
...
Yes but it WASN'T the FULL QUOTE, which affected its meaning.

Who do you think you are bluffing? I have just looked again at the
original
and it is clear that my quotation conveys the sense of the original.

It wasn't YOUR quotation, it belonged to Janet, whom I replied to.
Having trouble following the thread Franz?
Taking credit for something written by another, theres a name for that!

Ah, so is his intent just to split urg, thereby being the opposite of
"good
for URG"

Where does he say he wants to split urg? The actual quote please.
What realistically do you think the harm would be?

Where did I say that he *said* he wants to split urg?
I *deduced* that he wants to split urg. Why else would he be proposing a
new group when in fact there are allotmenteers happily contributing to
urg?
The proposer has not once tried to raise matters of interest to
allotmenteers in urg. Indeed, it seems that he has never even lurked in
urg, otherwise he would have been aware that allotment issues *are* in
fact
discussed there.

You are making it up as you go along! How on earth can you know that someone
has not 'lurked' in a group?
That is the most stupid remark you have made so far...................

That is total rubbish. Please familiarise yourself with urg's charter
and
understand it before talking such nonsense.

Again, Quote to me where in the charter of urg. it specifies the
discussion
of allotments.

Are you really as silly as you come across? The charter does not say
anywhere that growing lavender bushes or raising half hardy seedlings are
suitable topics for discussion in urg either. So, are we supposed to
avert
our eyes when those topics crop up?

Not covered under 'flowers or shrubs' then?
Wow, no wonder you subscribe to this group, your gardening knowledge is very
poor.
Now tell me what allotments would come under the heading of?

How gripping.


If it not specified it is strictly speaking OFF topic.
I have read the charter, have you? Can you find it?

on another group, where people can talk vegetables, sheds and
planning to their
hearts content.

Urglers are in fact this very minute discussing "sheds and planning
to
their hearts content."
Please look at the list of current threads.

What? Just started one have you?

You are obviously quite unfamiliar with the contents of urg in the past
and
now. That does not put you in a good position for defending the setting
up
of a breakaway group.

Use Google, I know how long you have been posting.

I bet that scares him.

I leave it for others to decide for themselves whether that last
paragraph
spells out a case for splitting a very active group just to satisfy
the
whim
of a person, or small coterie of folk who have never tried to
participate
in
the existing group.

Its not for me to spell out the case for the formation for the new
group.

Why have you then written this particular note?

But I cannot for the life of me understand why you would want to oppose
just
because
the proposer hasn't posted enough to urg in the past, or has chosen to
remain on the sidelines.

Snip an attempted insult .

******, snip that then! lol

The bandwidth issue has been spouted but no evidence has been given to
prove
that more space
would be taken up by the new group. Time and again, you Franz, have
stated
that all posts to the
proposed group would be crossposted, again without a shread of evidence
being cited.

You are being even more silly than you are. How on earth can evidence
have
accrued for an event in the future?

It was your argument Franz, how soon you forget. Use google to check what
you have posted in the past if your memory is failing.

All that shows us is you lied about where you live and you are a
coward, what have we missed?

But for a somewhat analogous case, look at what happened in uk.rec.audio
when uk.rec.audio.vinyl and uk.rec.audio.car were spawned.

Many reasons therefore against the motion with a distinct lack of
evidence.

You are being needlessly repetitive.

The proposer has been accused of 'Empire Building', I personally think
that
some people are
frightened that their own 'little empire' may be under threat in some
way.
Still we can agree to differ can't we Franz. You vote your way, I'll
vote
mine.

Of course. Why did you bother to post?

Why did you waste bandwidth replying?


Shut the **** up you whinging troll and take your bottlejob lifestyle
elsewhere.

The message
from martin contains these words:

/sodding great snip/

Talking of trolls .... what are you doing in this newsgroup? You never seem
to have anything to say about gardening and your comments are usually
distasteful and inappropriate.

I totally disagree. Franz has had lots to say about gardening.
It's also clear you don't understand the meaning of troll. A troll is
not somebody, who doesn't agree with the clique all the time.

Would you like me to send you a pair of scissors?

--
Rusty
Open the creaking gate to make a horrid.squeak, then lower the foobar.
http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/

The message
from martin contains these words:

/sodding great snip/

Talking of trolls .... what are you doing in this newsgroup? You never seem
to have anything to say about gardening and your comments are usually
distasteful and inappropriate.

I totally disagree. Franz has had lots to say about gardening.
It's also clear you don't understand the meaning of troll. A troll is
not somebody, who doesn't agree with the clique all the time.

Would you like me to send you a pair of scissors?

--
Rusty
Open the creaking gate to make a horrid.squeak, then lower the foobar.
http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/

The message
from martin contains these words:

/sodding great snip/

Talking of trolls .... what are you doing in this newsgroup? You never seem
to have anything to say about gardening and your comments are usually
distasteful and inappropriate.

I totally disagree. Franz has had lots to say about gardening.
It's also clear you don't understand the meaning of troll. A troll is
not somebody, who doesn't agree with the clique all the time.

Would you like me to send you a pair of scissors?

--
Rusty
Open the creaking gate to make a horrid.squeak, then lower the foobar.
http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/

On Fri, 27 Feb 2004 08:31:37 GMT, Jaques d'Alltrades
wrote:

Would you like me to send you a pair of scissors?

and my news server, I cancelled that one.
--

Knowledge is knowing a tomato is a fruit;
Wisdom is not putting it in a fruit salad

On Fri, 27 Feb 2004 08:31:37 GMT, Jaques d'Alltrades
wrote:

Would you like me to send you a pair of scissors?

and my news server, I cancelled that one.
--

Knowledge is knowing a tomato is a fruit;
Wisdom is not putting it in a fruit salad

On Fri, 27 Feb 2004 08:31:37 GMT, Jaques d'Alltrades
wrote:

Would you like me to send you a pair of scissors?

and my news server, I cancelled that one.
--

Knowledge is knowing a tomato is a fruit;
Wisdom is not putting it in a fruit salad