Lemons & Oranges from Pips ?
 

I have been told by a professional citrus grower that lemon and orange
plants grown from pips seldom flower or fruit.

Is this likely to be an accurate statement ??

Lemons & Oranges from Pips ?
 

wrote:


I have been told by a professional citrus grower that lemon and orange
plants grown from pips seldom flower or fruit.

Is this likely to be an accurate statement ??

Pretty well. They might eventually flower but the fruit is unlikely to be
much cop.
The decent cultivars grown for nice edible fruit are all grafted.

Same with apples and pears you might just get lucky but the odds are
against you.

Regards,
Martin Brown

Lemons & Oranges from Pips ?
 

The message
from contains these words:


I have been told by a professional citrus grower that lemon and orange
plants grown from pips seldom flower or fruit.

Is this likely to be an accurate statement ??


I believe an article in the current issue of 'The Garden' says they take
about 20 years to fruit when grown from seed. And, of course, at the end
of that period the plant would probably turn out to be a very inferior
form.
A long time to wait for a disappointment!
Janet G

Lemons & Oranges from Pips ?
 

In article ,
Martin Brown wrote:
wrote:

I have been told by a professional citrus grower that lemon and orange
plants grown from pips seldom flower or fruit.

Is this likely to be an accurate statement ??

Pretty well. They might eventually flower but the fruit is unlikely to be
much cop.
The decent cultivars grown for nice edible fruit are all grafted.

Same with apples and pears you might just get lucky but the odds are
against you.

The difference being that the odds are against you with citrus, even
WITH a productive variety! In the UK, at best you will get fairly
mediocre citrus fruit from the more cold-tolerant species. Our
weather is just too miserable for decent ripening, and you don't
have much hope with the seriously cold intolerant species (like
limes).

This doesn't stop it being fun to try, but don't expect a real crop.
And you can get a fairly decent amount of flower and as many fruit
as the plant will bear on some varieties - just not very good ones.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren,
University of Cambridge Computing Service,
New Museums Site, Pembroke Street, Cambridge CB2 3QH, England.
Email:
Tel.: +44 1223 334761 Fax: +44 1223 334679

Lemons & Oranges from Pips ?
 

"Nick wrote in message

The difference being that the odds are against you with citrus, even
WITH a productive variety! In the UK, at best you will get fairly
mediocre citrus fruit from the more cold-tolerant species. Our
weather is just too miserable for decent ripening, and you don't
have much hope with the seriously cold intolerant species (like
limes).

This doesn't stop it being fun to try, but don't expect a real crop.
And you can get a fairly decent amount of flower and as many fruit
as the plant will bear on some varieties - just not very good ones.

Our bought grafted plants, which are outside against a S. facing wall all
summer and kept in a small greenhouse heated to min 50°F in winter, do
produce fruit.
The oranges are very small but sweet, the Lemons are a useful size and
wonderful, the (Tahiti) limes are good too if a little smaller than in the
shops. Others, we haven't had long enough to find out.
Just don't expect too many fruit on small trees, we have 7 good sized lemons
this year, a G & T with your own Lemons is something to savour as is using
the peel in your Christmas cake. :-)

--
Regards
Bob

Use a useful Screen Saver...
http://setiathome.ssl.berkeley.edu/
and find intelligent life amongst the stars, there's bugger all down here.

Lemons & Oranges from Pips ?
 

In article ,
Sue & Bob Hobden wrote:


Our bought grafted plants, which are outside against a S. facing wall all
summer and kept in a small greenhouse heated to min 50°F in winter, do
produce fruit.
The oranges are very small but sweet, the Lemons are a useful size and
wonderful, the (Tahiti) limes are good too if a little smaller than in the
shops. Others, we haven't had long enough to find out.
Just don't expect too many fruit on small trees, we have 7 good sized lemons
this year, a G & T with your own Lemons is something to savour as is using
the peel in your Christmas cake. :-)

You are doing pretty well! But don't get people's hopes up too much,
as I suspect a disinterested observer would be a little less, er,
enthusiastic :-) I did say you can get fruit (even I have done it),
just that I regard it as more fun than a crop.

Perhaps I am being a little harsh, though, as I don't regard the
citrus you can buy in the shops here as up to all that much, because
it is picked unripe and artificially 'ripened'. Oh, and the Tahiti
lime isn't the same as the highly aromatic tropical lime, which is
the one I was referring to.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren,
University of Cambridge Computing Service,
New Museums Site, Pembroke Street, Cambridge CB2 3QH, England.
Email:
Tel.: +44 1223 334761 Fax: +44 1223 334679

Lemons & Oranges from Pips ?
 

In article ,
writes

I have been told by a professional citrus grower that lemon and orange
plants grown from pips seldom flower or fruit.

Is this likely to be an accurate statement ??



In the case of citrus, there is at least some chance that seedlings will
in fact be clones of the parents. While I can't find the reference I'd
like, I believe that the term for this is adventitious embryony, and you
can get some confirmation by searching the web. For instance, at
http://thecity.sfsu.edu/~sustain/chap8.html I find

2.1 Adventitious embryony in Citrus

Citrus commonly reproduces by an asexual process called adventitious
embryony (Koltunow 1993). The offspring are genetically identical with
the maternal parent because the embryo of the seed derives exclusively
from maternal tissue. The tissue is called the nucellus, and in all
sexual plants it supplies nutrients to the unfertilized egg and then,
after fertilization, to the embryo and endosperm. The adventitious
embryo derives not from the fertilized egg cell but from a group of
cells (a proembryo) formed in the nucellus (Koltunow et al. 1995). This
asexual process in Citrus keeps the line pure and predictable in its
fruiting and other characters, but it also prevents citrus breeders from
improving their lines through sexual hybridization with a contrasting
cultivar.

Of course, this doesn't help you with the practicalities of growing the
things in the British climate.
--
A. G. McDowell

Lemons & Oranges from Pips ?
 

In article , A. G. McDowell
writes
In the case of citrus, there is at least some chance that seedlings will
in fact be clones of the parents. While I can't find the reference I'd
like,

"The Pip Book", Mossman (1973, reprinted 1975, Published by Witherby).
If you plant one pip and get more than one seedling from it then the
extras are clones of the parent. It doesn't provide any way to tell
which is which, though. It reckons 6-8 years from pip to fruiting for
oranges, and an 18-inch pot.
--
A. G. McDowell

Lemons & Oranges from Pips ?
 

On 7 Dec 2002 14:06:55 GMT, (Nick Maclaren) wrote:

In article ,
Martin Brown wrote:
wrote:

I have been told by a professional citrus grower that lemon and orange
plants grown from pips seldom flower or fruit.

Pretty well. They might eventually flower but the fruit is unlikely to be
much cop.
(snip)
This doesn't stop it being fun to try, but don't expect a real crop.
And you can get a fairly decent amount of flower and as many fruit
as the plant will bear on some varieties - just not very good ones
Regards,
Nick Maclaren,
University of Cambridge Computing Service,
New Museums Site, Pembroke Street, Cambridge CB2 3QH, England.
Email:
Tel.: +44 1223 334761 Fax: +44 1223 334679
We are currently carrying in and out of the conservatory (out in the
evening into the warm living room, back into the light conservatory
for the day) a 12inch twig. It had leaves on when we bought it in the
spring and has had lots of flowers but by November we were singing
"four leaves on my lemon" then "three leaves on my lemon". Two weeks
ago the last leaf fell off and on Monday last the pathetic little
half-inch green lemon hit the carpet. Is there any hope for it? Are
we wasting our time carrying it in and out? It's in very well
draining compost and I only water it when it's almost dry.

Joan in Bramhall (Cheshire)

Lemons & Oranges from Pips ?
 

In article ,
Ken Riley wrote:

We are currently carrying in and out of the conservatory (out in the
evening into the warm living room, back into the light conservatory
for the day) a 12inch twig. It had leaves on when we bought it in the
spring and has had lots of flowers but by November we were singing
"four leaves on my lemon" then "three leaves on my lemon". Two weeks
ago the last leaf fell off and on Monday last the pathetic little
half-inch green lemon hit the carpet. Is there any hope for it? Are
we wasting our time carrying it in and out? It's in very well
draining compost and I only water it when it's almost dry.

In my experience, no, but I am no expert!


Regards,
Nick Maclaren,
University of Cambridge Computing Service,
New Museums Site, Pembroke Street, Cambridge CB2 3QH, England.
Email:
Tel.: +44 1223 334761 Fax: +44 1223 334679

Lemons & Oranges from Pips ?
 

In article , Ken Riley
writes

We are currently carrying in and out of the conservatory (out in the
evening into the warm living room, back into the light conservatory
for the day) a 12inch twig. It had leaves on when we bought it in the
spring and has had lots of flowers but by November we were singing
"four leaves on my lemon" then "three leaves on my lemon". Two weeks
ago the last leaf fell off and on Monday last the pathetic little
half-inch green lemon hit the carpet. Is there any hope for it? Are
we wasting our time carrying it in and out?

Probably, though it may re-shoot if you are very lucky.

Two things seem to go for citrus:

scale insects - you will see round shiny brown lumps abut 1/8 inch long
on the twig which can be pushed off with a fingernail

Red spider - any fine cobwebs on what remains?

Remove anything you can see, wipe the twig with a damp tissue, and hope.

--
Kay Easton

Edward's earthworm page:
http://www.scarboro.demon.co.uk/garden/

Lemons & Oranges from Pips ?
 

Joan wrote in message
,
We are currently carrying in and out of the conservatory (out in the
evening into the warm living room, back into the light conservatory
for the day) a 12inch twig. It had leaves on when we bought it in the
spring and has had lots of flowers but by November we were singing
"four leaves on my lemon" then "three leaves on my lemon". Two weeks
ago the last leaf fell off and on Monday last the pathetic little
half-inch green lemon hit the carpet. Is there any hope for it? Are
we wasting our time carrying it in and out? It's in very well
draining compost and I only water it when it's almost dry.


Sounds a bit like bad news Joan, especially considering the time it's taken
to slowly die off.
Might be the right time to remove it from the pot to take a look at the
roots which will either confirm death or otherwise.
Lemons require a more acid compost than other citrus so I would always
recommend ericaceous compost and rainwater with an occasional water with
hard tapwater to provide the minerals needed. Feeding is important to.

We did bring our Tahiti lime back from an almost no leaf situation.
When we bought it we were on holiday in Cornwall and it suffered total
dryout due to my stupidity. It was in full growth and leaf within a couple
of months.
Just bought a Kumquat for £10, reduced as it's badly in need of some TLC.

--
Bob

www.pooleygreengrowers.org.uk/ about an Allotment site in
Runnymede fighting for it's existence.

Lemons & Oranges from Pips ?
 

Lemons & Oranges from Pips ?
 

Kay Easton wrote:

In article , Ken Riley
writes

We are currently carrying in and out of the conservatory (out in the
evening into the warm living room, back into the light conservatory
for the day) a 12inch twig. It had leaves on when we bought it in the
spring and has had lots of flowers but by November we were singing
"four leaves on my lemon" then "three leaves on my lemon". Two weeks
ago the last leaf fell off and on Monday last the pathetic little
half-inch green lemon hit the carpet. Is there any hope for it? Are
we wasting our time carrying it in and out?

Probably, though it may re-shoot if you are very lucky.

Don't throw it out until is is warm enough for it to live outside. I have
had "dead" plants recover from apparently lifeless sticks before. As long as
it is green there is still some hope for next year.

Two things seem to go for citrus:

scale insects - you will see round shiny brown lumps abut 1/8 inch long
on the twig which can be pushed off with a fingernail

Red spider - any fine cobwebs on what remains?

Probably the latter. They seem to be martyrs to it and attract them from
everywhere.
I have even had to spray mine with soft soap in late autumn to keep control
of rsm.

The main symptoms are that all the leaves will drop off if left untreated.

Remove anything you can see, wipe the twig with a damp tissue, and hope.

I also suspect it doesn't much like being moved in and out of warmth.
Thermal shock is bad.

Provided it is kept frost free it may be better off being left somewhere out
of drafts and slightly on the dry side. Not likely to lose much water if it
is entirely without leaves. Mine still has plenty of flowers even now but is
kept in the main living room against a south facing floor to ceiling picture
window.

I am still a bit vague on the correct feeding regime for citrus plants. Any
recommendations ?

Regards,
Martin Brown

Lemons & Oranges from Pips ?
 

In article ,
Martin Brown wrote:



Provided it is kept frost free it may be better off being left somewhere out
of drafts and slightly on the dry side. Not likely to lose much water if it
is entirely without leaves. Mine still has plenty of flowers even now but is
kept in the main living room against a south facing floor to ceiling picture
window.

Most common citrus can take some frost if fairly dry at the root,
and it is merely overnight.

I am still a bit vague on the correct feeding regime for citrus plants. Any
recommendations ?

The usual one is never to feed a plant in its dormant or inactive
seasons. The agrochemical companies sell expensive "winter feed"
but my guess is that it is pretty pointless.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren,
University of Cambridge Computing Service,
New Museums Site, Pembroke Street, Cambridge CB2 3QH, England.
Email:
Tel.: +44 1223 334761 Fax: +44 1223 334679