Jim Webster wrote:

wrote in message
....
In conventional seed production
there is variety. Genes that dictate the use of one chemical (a chemical
that by the way is not friendly to certain organisms of the soil, and a
chemical that stays for very long in the soil clay structure and a
chemical that is difficult to analyze and detect). Conventional crops
require different practices (chemical or mechanical) to maintain a reduced
pest and weed populations.
The use of that one chemical implies a series of cultural practices that
affect the soil fauna and flora. Multiple pesticides implies that at least
some area is not affected by unintended chemical effects.

total gibberish. Multiple pesticide use will hit a far wider variety of
pests

Maybe. But pesticide residue and decomposition, metabolite life and their
toxicity for living organisms other than mammals is scarce or non existent.
And even mamalian studies do not cover endocrine disruptor effects, or
many of the metabolites produced under different soil environments.

I rather have a little of a bunch of chemicals than a lot of one (as a
general rule). Of course some chemicals are worse at some low level than
some other chemical at a higher level.


I know, it all sounds gibberish. But try.

Atrazine for example has trouble being degrated:
http://www.engg.ksu.edu/HSRC/formation.html

Similar studies for Roundup are rare, non
existant or only for the eyes of company executives.

I also suggest you read more gibberish:
http://216.239.39.100/search?q=cache...t-science.org/
pwq_ip.htm+atrazine+accumulation+%22ground+water%2 2&hl=en&ie=UTF-8
(cut and paste in one line for URL)

....
Fourteen pesticides and metabolites were found and the percentage of
contaminated wells, when extrapolated to the country as a whole,
indicated that between 0 and 750 community systems (0-0.8%) and
between 9,000 and 200,000 rural household wells (0.1-1.9%) will
have at least one pesticide above a human-health-based drinking
water standard, such as the maximum contaminant level (MCL) set
by the EPA. As many as 14% of all wells may have detectable
residues, generally in the range 0.1 to 0.2 part per billion
(one millionth of a gram per liter of water; ppb for short)
of some pesticide
....

Many pesticides accumulate in the soil. Specially roundup that needs light
for degradation. The repeated application of many other herbicides has
resulted in ground water contamination. Some midwestern states have for example
such elevated concentrations of atrazine and its metabolites that you have
to be carefull using ground water to drink or even to irrigate other crops.
....
The EPA also has data from numerous other ground water studies conducted from
1971-1991. In this database, of a total of 65,865 wells sampled, 14.4% or
9,509 had concentrations of one or more pesticides in excess of health
standards. This high percentage is a reflection of sampling bias--many of
the wells sampled were selected because they were located in areas where
pesticide leaching was known to be occurring.

More recently, the U.S. Geological Survey used the same analytical techniques
to demonstrate that surface waters, including major rivers and lakes in the
Corn Belt, also contain some of the most used pesticides in the United States:
herbicides used in corn and soybean production, including atrazine, alachlor,
and cyanazine. During the 2 to 3 months in spring and early summer immediately
after these herbicides are applied on farms, pesticide concentrations in surface
waters can be much higher than in ground water. In some instances, human health
standards are exceeded and concentrations of 1 to 10 ppb are common;
occasionally, concentrations exceeding 100 ppb are observed. Concentrations
in rivers and streams decrease to 1 ppb by mid-fall, but elevated
concentrations may persist in lakes. (2) This seasonal peak concentration of
pesticides in rivers and lakes in the period following their use on fields
indicates that runoff, the drainage of excess rainfall from the surface of
fields, is responsible for much of the pollution.
....
________

Now imagine all farmers using the same herbicide.



On top of that the use of the GM technology makes farmers financially
dependent on one or two companies. The Enron story should teach us not
to depend on one company.

total rubbish.

Read about the Indian Cotton debacle.


anyone can seed from any seedhouse. Seed is bought and sold around the
world, we have used rye seed from Poland. It is not unreasonable to use a GM
crop one year as part of a weed control programme then use a convention
variety next year to get the higher yield

and then get your crop analized for GM contamination and get sued for
some leftover seeds surviving the winter.


Jim Webster