hi Joanna,
thanks very much again for the reply!
[...below...]
J Fortuna wrote:
Tanya,
When you say "i have 3 others without lights, in another area of the house
and they are not growing anything but roots however their leaves are long",
what do you mean by without lights -- do you just mean without additional
grow lights, or also without natural light coming through the window?
with no additional lights... they get indirect light from a skyLight ... and 1
has bloomed de novo (i.e. it grew the spike here where it lives now!)
Light
is one thing that's really not optional for Phals. :-) Even though among
orchids they are considered "low light" plants, compared to many other
houseplants (that can just live in the middle of a room with artificial
light only) Phals do require enough light to thrive and flower, and regular
artificial light or even light from a northern window is not enough for
them. Lack of light or insufficient might explain lack of leaf growth.
those 3 plants have normal leaf growth
How often do you water your Phals and how much water do you use at each
watering? The reason why I ask is because I recently heard from an
acquaintance who grows orchids unsuccessfully that she just gives them a
little bit of water at a time, and I wonder if that could be an explanation
for lack of growth. The best thing with Phals is to water with a lot of
water all at once and let it drip away (basically give your plant a
shower) -- do not let the roots stand in the water for a long time or it
will lead to root-rot. I noticed that your Phals are in moss, in my
experience it's easy to tell when they need water in moss, just touch the
surface and if it is at all moist, wait another day, but do not wait too
long -- the moss below the surface should still be moist when you water.
ok i have definitely been underWatering... i had thought that the bottom of the
pot should be only damp -- i water twice a week (on avg.) and let the water run
through the pot (it's distilled)
While I have never used distilled water that was only slightly fertilized,
and thus don't know whether it could be the cause of this lack of growth, I
know from my own experience that using tap-water without any fertilizer for
a long time, did not have as drastic an effect as your plants -- my plants
after this kind of treatment still had big new leaves. So I am not sure that
that's necessarily the cause. When you say that your fertilizer is high in
acid, how much do you mean?
it's mirAcid (miracle gro makes it) orchids are listed as one of the plants it's
used for (on the box)... i haven't tested the pH but it's for "acid loving
plants".
main ingredients are 30-10-10 with micronutrients:
boron, copper, iron, manganese, molybdenum, zinc, (EDTA)
i haven't used this on my orchids... i've used the schultz "expert" orchid food
(19-31-17) with the same (as above) microNutrients.
i have a hydroponic food with 10-6-16 which includes calcium and magnesium and
other micronutrients and although the box warns only for hydroponics, if they
are in sphagnum moss and get for the most part distilled water, they could
really benefit from it i think........
Can you post the ingredients with the numerical
values -- then someone in this group will be able to tell you if that is ok
to use. Right now I use a fertilizer with 7% Nitrogen, 9% Phospate, and 5%
Potash, and I use about a 1/4 of a teaspoon to a gallon of water. But I know
that there are many other formulas that are ok, too. Also the fertilizer you
use should have some additional ingredients like Calcium and Magnesium for
example. Since you use distilled water, this is actually very important --
those of us who use tap water may already have some of those minerals in the
water. I've heard that mineral deficiency for some of these other minerals
may cause serious problems too, so I wonder whether that could explain your
Phals' lack of growth.
it really could
i *do* mix their food in tap water but it WAS so infrequent that i'm sure they
are lacking in the traces especially calcium, mag, really everything.
I noticed that your Phal is very lopsided, in that the leaves on one side
are much bigger than those on the other. Is the bigger leaf the one that
grows closer to the light? That's what I would expect.
are you referring to the larger one? if so it came lopSided and i have it that
way to try to get it straighter... currently the leaves are all away from the
light...
if you are referring to the 2-leafer: no actually that one gets enough light
(i'd turned off 2 of the lights for the photos) however when i got it, it had a
short leaf on that side (also had the same long leaf) but the short leaf was
far longer / wider than the current leaf.
I wonder how young your plants are. The only Phal that I have that has a
tiny leaf like that was a keiki fairly recently and the tiny leaf is its
first or second leaf ever. Adult Phals however generally have much larger
leaves, and if they are healthy each additional generation of leaves is
bigger or same size as the previous one. At least that's true among man-made
Phal hybrids. My understanding is that this may not be the case for some
Phal species (I may be wrong about that though). For most of the Phal plants
that you can buy in your local stores though, the leaf size rule applies. If
a new generation of leaves on a Phal is smaller than the previous ones, that
generally means that the Phal is experiencing stress, and letting it flower
may not be a wise thing because flowering takes energy that the plant may
not be able to afford to spend.
yes, i have to cut off the spike and also rePot
The two-leaf plant, has it ever had more leaves? Has it lost leaves?
the little one has always had 2 leaves. (see above) but the replacement for the
lost leaf (that was shorter and wider than the long leaf) is far smaller.
If so,
has it lost the leaves from the bottom (below the ones that remain) --
that's the way it should be. Or has it lost leaves from the top -- that
would be bad.
it lost the smaller leaf from under the tiny 1/4 leaf.
How long have you had these plants? How much do you know about their
history? If you recently acquired them, it may be due to something that
happened before they came to you, or they may not be over the trauma of
changing environments yet.
these were all from the "reduced for a quick sale" area i had the larger one
almost 2 years; the 2-leafer 1.5 years
they ALL (all 5) had HORRIBLE roots (and initially a very *stupid* owner)
because the 2-leafer was "growing" in dirt and actually it really improved (was
completely wilted originally)
when i repotted it eventually there were a number of bluish black bugs and only
1 long root and 2 short ones were salvageable so it was in plastic for quite a
while.
it has a lot of roots now.
the other one had lousy roots as well but after repotting had grown 1 long leaf
and then the short one after that (it's lost a couple -- from the bottom).
Is any of this helpful to you? I hope so.
Joanna
it really is very helpful -- thank you!
diagnosis: underFed, underWatered and too little light
at least they are foregiving (or have been
thanks
sincerely
Tanya
"Tanya" wrote in message
...
hello,
thank you very much for replying and for the advice
i have both plants' photos he
http://pws.prserv.net/cainet.tjtmd/phalLeafs.html
(1 photo looks yellowish however they are not yellow the color in the
other 3 is
accurate)
there is 1 place (an orchid shop) which i can call........
my main concern is that the 2-leaved one is starting to grow a spike and i
want
it to grow leaves too.-- i.e. not sure whether flowering would be too much
for
the plant
(as i mentioned i have used VERY LITTLE food and they are in sphagnum (and
i
water w/ distilled water) so i wonder whether adding a balanced or high N
food
would encourage leaf growth?)
(i have 3 others without lights, in another area of the house and they are
not
growing anything but roots however their leaves are long (the newest
leaves))
thanks so much!
sincerely
Tanya
J Fortuna wrote:
Tanya,
I was wondering if this is a case where a picture would be helpful. If
we
saw a picture of this plant maybe we could better guess what might be
wrong
(whether it looks healthy or sickly). Could you post a picture either to
alt.binaries.pictures.orchids or if you don't have access to that, post
to a
Web site and then post a link to it here?
Also in my experience local plant nursery staff are sometimes very
knowledgeable, so if you take your plant to a plant nursery near you
that
sells orchids, they might be able to better advise you while they are
actually looking at the plant. I have not approached my local orchid
society
yet, but from what I hear that is a wonderful way to get advice about
ones
plants and growing habits.
The reason why I am advising you to take this plant to someone in your
area
is because sometimes it is much harder to tell what might be wrong with
a
plant over a newsgroup, but if only someone had a chance to look it over
carefully, they might be able to get a much better idea of what could be
going on here.
Joanna
"Tanya" wrote in message
...
Rob Halgren wrote:
Tanya wrote:
thanks, Rob
the room they are in is 70 degrees (minimum)
both have root growth (the 1.25 leaved has a lot of root growth
plus it
is
growing a spike which is IMHO is a reason for concern (i don't know
whether
the 1.25 leaves are sufficient for spiking?))
thanks,
sincerely
Tanya
Mystery to me then. It may be full size, if it is a mini. Do you
know
what the crosses are?
Rob
--
Rob's Rules: http://www.msu.edu/~halgren
1) There is always room for one more orchid
2) There is always room for two more orchids
2a. See rule 1
3) When one has insufficient credit to purchase
more orchids, obtain more credit
many thanks for the reply
i have no idea what the crosses are (they are species i.e. the ones
sold
in
grocery stores (HOWEVER they are VERY valuable to me)
the 0.25 inch leaves are abnormal for the plants unless they mutate
;-)
what about possibly food? i use the bloom food V.E.R.Y. dilute and
distilled H2O
perhaps i should give them something else -- i have miracle gro (but
it's
acidic) do you think that would be ok? -- they are in sphagnum moss...
very grateful for the response!
sincerely
Tanya