Tue, 4 May 2004 09:56:13 +0200 P van Rijckevorsel wrote:


Archimedes Plutonium schreef
I wonder if the difference of a species of trees can come so close as to
be a small visual difference of between whether a leaf has convex shape or
concave shape.

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You are confusing identification with species delimitation.
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Not really. I was leading into the concept of linking A,C,T,G with form and
function and body morphology.


What I am getting at is whether scientists have yet quantified as to how
much at minimum must the A,C,T,G vary in order for there to be 2 different
species.

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Easy: 1. Theoretically a single base pair should do it.
On the other hand hundreds of base pairs could vary without any effect
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That is false. False as per the recent Neanderthal DNA comparison to humans.
Under that rigor it took at least 3 base pair differences to demarkate species.

This ties in nicely with my theory that Stonethrowing created humans out of
apelike creatures. The first apes to throw rocks and stones some 10 million
years ago would have been able to breed with non-stonethrowers. But as
selection for stonethrowers increase to the point where the DNA of A,C,T,G
changed in at least 3 base pairs (Neanderthal example) that would create a
better Rotator Cuff so that the individual could throw better. That this
morphology change would eventually lead to a different species.

I have another theory about the Quantum Duality of the plant kingdom to the
animal kingdom. If that theory has a band of truth to it, then the species
separation for plants should be different than for animals. In other words,
like the Neanderthal case where it takes at least 3 base pair differences for
animals. Then perhaps for plants it may take only 1 base pair difference.

And perhaps a hidden surprize in that no animal species exists that can have
less than 3 base pair differences but that plants can have 1 or 2 or 3 or more
base pair differences and be different species.

So the whole question of Speciation is a quantum question. And that Plants can
be quantified at 1 base pair difference but that animals require at least 3
base pair differences.

Archimedes Plutonium
whole entire Universe is just one big atom where dots
of the electron-dot-cloud are galaxies
www.archimedesplutonium.com
www.iw.net/~a_plutonium






If Ash trees were intelligent life and went around inspecting humans, it
would be puzzling that ash of pennsyl and americ are different species yet
virtually identical in shape form and physical attributes, yet humans come
in a huge range of physical attributes yet all one species.

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Probably the other way about. Any species is most alive to their own
species. If Ash trees were intelligent, they would wonder why humans are all
so alike (driving cars, cutting down trees, etc) and that Ash trees are so
wonderfully recognisable. Intelligence is relative, anyway.
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Instead of leaf scars, I wonder if green ash and white ash can be
discerned from the leaf tip itself.

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For starters leaf scars can be observed year round, while leafs are
available only part of the year. Also there are lots of species known for a
wide variety of leaf shape, sometimes within a single tree.
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I wonder if that tip inspection is a true rule to follow.

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This would only be relevant if you want to start a church.
Do you know the Church of the Living Tree? [www.tree.org]
or this church http://www.therowantreechurch.org/
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I would have to
inspect alot of mature green and white ash but I encounter mostly only
green ash in the wild.

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Perhaps you should start with the difference between green and red ash?
PvR