"Paul Corfield" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 29 May 2004 22:18:12 +0100, "tuin man"
wrote:

"Paul Corfield" wrote in message
news
can someone tell me what a real gardener is?

You for a start!

you haven't seen the dreadful lawn and overgrown borders that I am
slowly trying to tackle.

"Slowly trying to tackle" = gardener to me

Well now, had you asked for *who* is a real gardener, then contrary to
the
awful "Mr Smugmarsh" reference I would say Alan Titchmarsh is a very real
gardener.

Well I'm glad you said that because it is really Alan Titchmarsh's books
and telly programmes that have got me interested.

Which is why he has done so much.

I get the very real sense that people on this group - who I assume are
real gardeners by their own definition - hate programmes like Ground
Force or Garden Rivals or Small Town Gardens etc. From my viewpoint I
think they help people like me understand what is possible and also help
me work out what I like and don't like about certain design aspects.
I've also learnt lots about plants too. Still can't decide quite what
I'm going to do to my garden when it's a bit tidier though!

I've noticed it too. But don't get it.


I also noted the evident dislike of Rachel de Thames vs Sarah Raven and
Chris Beardshaw seems to be on the group hitlist. Why? Aren't they
gardeners too?

1) No idea
2) I would have thought so, unless they're actually not in the least bit
interested in horticulture, but are very good at learning their line...
nah... too far fetched.


I'm still developing my interest in gardening so don't understand the
distinction that seems so apparent to the group regulars.

Standing by Diarmuids National Lottery Garden a couple were chatting next
to
me. She said something like ; oh look how the grass (lawn) sweeps under
the
concrete. That is soooo new. Must be a new idea and it looks wonderful.
Everyone else would just bring it up to the edge.. How interesting! How
new!

Now, suffice to say, there are a few here who might suggest she is not a
"real gardener". The term "Real gardener" probably refers to at least a
basic measure of knowledge that would enable an show observer to realise
the
difference between reality and fantasy. Perhaps another title might be a
"reality" gardener

Well OK I understand the issue about the grass not growing under the
concrete lip. While I don't like everything Diarmuid designs he
evidently understands plants - at least from where I sit. Does the fact
that he designs outlandish structures really make him not a gardener?

No, outlandish stuff does not mean he is not a gardener.


Many "garden designers" lack just such realism yet get tend to be vastly
more appreciated and recognised then "real gardeners" and so I tend to
dream
up various different titles for them, none of which are really repeatable
on
a newsgroup.

So you are really saying that people who design gardens on these telly
programmes don't understand plants and create designs that are
unsustainable as living gardens after the film crew leaves?

No, not at all. I was more thinking in terms of what I've personally
encountered when dealing with "garden" designers.
I've never encountered any of the telly lot but have noted from the one
year on programmes that much of what has being done has lasted, quite unlike
what would have being the case with much of what I've had to deal with and
sadly, a lot of what I saw at hampton the last time I was there. Which was 2
years ago.

watched a fair few of these programmes and I haven't seen many hopeless
designs - maybe some I don't like but that doesn't mean they won't work
as gardens.

True

One series I liked was A Garden for all Seasons because that showed
gardens belonging to "real" people. While the presenting was a bit
wooden (ms dimmock and anne marie powell] I enjoyed seeing the gardens
that people had created and watching how they developed over the year.
There was evidently both design knowledge and horticultural knowledge
being displayed by those real people - are you (the group) saying the
design bit is not important?

Silly design can get very important. Especially if you've paid a shed load
of money to the professional garden designer responsible.


I'm just trying to understand why opinions divide so sharply over things
that, to me, are not *that* important.

Understood.

Patrick