"Stan The Man" wrote in message
...
In article , tuin man
wrote:

"Stan The Man" wrote in message
...

In related areas, if someone is fixing my gas boiler, my teeth, my new
extension, my domestic wiring, my blood pressure, etc, I'm going to
find someone who, first and foremost, is properly qualified to do the
job. If they are also experienced, so much the better.

Simon

And there's the catch; "properly qualified" and how that is to be
interpreted. Many people start off as teachers for a course on a subject
that had seemed to be waiting for them to come along and open the door,
yet
they themselves never become the course's post graduates in the real
sense.

Would that make them unqualified?
And therefore not acceptable to you?

Patrick

Probably not.

To which question? Both?
If so, what about pioneers in any field of expertise?

Perhaps one reason for our declining education standards
is that too many teachers teach without having achieved their degree
and teachers' training qualifications.

Sniped teacher bit because I am not in a position to comment on education
standards

You
seem to be arguing that there is no point to formal training at all and
I can't subscribe to that pov, whatever the field.

At no point am I saying there's no point to formal training at all. Nor can
I see it implied. I am saying it should *also not be used as a pointy stick.
What I am trying to address is your inability to trust someone you *think*
does not have such credentials, such as happened with your assesment of
Charlie D (which Martin corrected)
And your tunnel vision type trust in those who does, or you think does
posses such credentials.

I believe strongly
in a meritocracy -

I'm sure we all do, but it's little more than a myth in UK.
Take for example the fact you've outlined R d T's credentials.
When she first appeared on the TV she got what could only be desribed as a
slating here. Mostly female lead bile.
Pretty much none of the objections centred around any knowledge she had
imparted, but concentrated rather a lot on her hair style, fashion sense and
something about her finger nails which for the life of me I just couldn't
fathom.
In spite of your credentials announcement, many of those which you've
acknowledged as accreditated, remain on the not-on-my-tell-
if-you-please-lists.
Then there's the example of your own error of not realising Charlie's
credentials.
On which note, I can understand your assumption. Now I know she mucks in
well and many people like that, but I had 2 grannies who ran large farms
almost singlehandedly and I've worked alongside many such competant femal
gardeners, so that novelty holds no interest for me. But, based on a more
critical assesment of Charlie's abilities, I'd be inclined to assume that
the UK gardening industry is in big trouble, big big trouble, if she is an
example of British gardening expertise.
I have to reflect on the value of the others to hold a more positive view.

and the initial indication of a candidate's merit is
his/her formal qualifications.

I recall doing what you might call a foreign language written test. On one
segment, we were given a set of random words to utilise and incorporate into
a short story. I made mine about my dissapointment on being woken from a
nice dream. I dreamt I was on an isolated beach. Saw something in the water.
It turned out to be another swimmer. As the swimmer approached and stood up,
it was a she and such a pretty face. Then as she emerged she revealed a lack
of upper costume, then a lack of any costume as she walked over to me.
Confident, sexy (I'll stop right there) I utilised what ever words could be
intrepreted to define beauty, longing, excitment, interest, need... you get
the drift.
I got an A+.... and for both the first and last time in my life.
Exams are often won on providing what the examiner wants and not
neccessarily true knowledge.

Without these diplomas and certificates,
we may have no reliable way to whittle 1000 job applicants down to a
manageable shortlist.

That's the way of the world. But it does not mean we should unwarily embrace
such credentials whilst demeaning those without it. And presenting a garden
show (after all how many womwen need a phd in shopping to be 'allowed' out
of the house/) should not require a degree in horticulture. Prehaps it's
needing a degree in meeja studies that is the cause of much of the
irritation witnessed here... or else it's just lain jeolosy. Surely not (-;

Patrick

Simon