GardenBanter.co.uk - View Single Post

08-06-2004, 04:28 PM

In article , wrote:
Years ago, neighbors then had a black lab that they kept in a dog run
most of the time. She was getting old, overweight, and the owners
were older. They fed and watered her ok, but they only took her out
now and then, and the fellow would toss a retrieval "thingie" (like
that technical term?) that they make for training retrievers... either
canvas or plastic with bumps on it.. about 12 -16 long, a roll with a

Bumper or dummy, depending on the speaker's whim. Glad to see I'm not
the only one who makes up words... frex, one signs checks with an
"onscribble-wither"

loop on the end.. into the canal that ran through their yard, and
she'd go get it and bring it back and the fellow would do that for 10
or 15 minutes, then back into the run she'd go.

Well, speaking from 35 years as a pro trainer, they were doing the
right thing insofar as giving her a retriever's job as exercise.

The dog was bored, and she would bark at night ..but eventually she'd
stop if we yelled at her once we learned her name, and she got used to

I have dogs who bark at the moon. Makes you wonder.

us. BUT.. she was the first dog I'd ever seen that would shit and
turn around and eat it again. GAG and ..I guess the last one I'd

That's pretty common among low-end betas (one of the distinct social
types, which BTW are inherited, NOT made).

seen do so. I've seen plenty of dogs that will clean out the cat pan
and do so with great gusto and glee... happy as could be to find such
stuff even if it had kitty litter on it!! I had to put a child

Oh yes, it's their idea of candy!

security gate up that was stretched wide enough to let the cats get
through them, but keep my dogs out.

Clever idea.

Anyway, as far as that poor lab, I'd always attributed her disgusting
habit to some sort of mental health issue from being locked up in that
dog run with no contact with people or other dogs except for feeding
and those few minutes of fetch now and then.

Nope. Combination of diet, social status (as genetically hardwired),
or at ANY point in her life being exposed to a multi-dog environment.
Also, some bitches clean up after their pups with excessive zeal which
continues after weaning, then translates to any tasty pile they find.
And some dogs have higher protein needs than others, and are more
likely to make up the difference by stool consumption, especially when
fed soy-based diets.

It makes me crazy when people get a dog, then lock it up out in a run

Altho that is less frustrating to the dog than being allowed to behave
like a wild delinquent, and it's better than letting it run loose
(ie. giving no boundaries at all). At least the kennel dog knows ONE
thing that's expected of it (ie. where it is supposed to be) and
that's better than the absolute zilch training some people now do,
then wonder why the dog "acts out". Dogs have a need for consistency
in their lives; they LIKE the world to be set in stone, with definite
boundaries.

and basically ignore it. My sister ended up with a german shorthair
because it and a black lab had been locked in a garage with a rotting
deer carcass and abandoned. The shorthair apparently was gun shy, and

Yuck.

that made the owner angry.. silly that the dog would misbehave after
being locked up all year then taken out and expected to "perform" ..

Gunshyness is inherited; essentially it's OH MY GOD! behaviour that's
triggered by noise. A lot of 'em are fear-aggressive too, or
dog-aggressive, or generally spooky, and in Aussies it goes as far as
outright autism.

probably with little or no initial training, but I suspect that he'd
been shot at .... but dogs do end up more than a little "disturbed" by
poor treatment, and that can cause the poop and scoop her own feces in

Well, no. You can't make a *normal* dog gunshy by shooting at it. You
can make it a little flinchy but not outright gunshy, and the
flinchiness goes away after a month or so. Same with an "abused" dog.
You can beat hell out of it every day for a year, then put it in a
normal home and within a month or so, it will revert to whatever
behaviour it naturally has (ie. inherited), good or bad. Most of these
so-called "abused" dogs fobbed off by rescue outfits were not abused
at all, they were born that way, and would have been shy, spooky,
fear-biters, or whatever unlivable behaviour, no matter how
well-treated. That's why such dogs wind up with rescues in the first
place. (And many rescues are not above lying to make you feel sorry
for the dog so you'll adopt it.) NORMAL dogs are pretty flexible, and
can cope with just about anything.

This is why ethical breeders select for sound temperaments (if
temperament weren't inherited, why not breed from spooks and
fear-biters??) Who wants to live with a psycho of any species??

the case of the lab, just like other dogs who have been abandoned
locked in a garage dog to get panicy .. as the shorthair did when my
sister had to suddenly change her routine when her husband rolled the

Nope, if the dog can't handle that, it's because it's just not got the
wiring to do so. There are obsessive-compulsive dogs (just like in
humans, where it's been found to be due to an imbalance in a
particular bit of brain chemistry), and these same dogs tend to be
noise-panicky (ie. gunshy) and completely unable to cope with any
change of routine. But this indicates that the dog is NOT normal, and
the behaviour is defintitely inherited.

truck and broke his neck ..but survived (unfortunately) .so no one was

Ugh!! That's shit luck.

home for a time at their normal times and Zeke.. the shorthair started
jumping up and tearing down the curtains, and eventually managing to
not only jump over 6 1/2 feet up to a small window, break it and catch
hold to the frame and pull himself out! That was not easy! He tried
the other windows in the house, but they were sliders, and tougher so
didn't break.

Dogs that have the "gunshy" type of spookiness do things like that --
frex, they seem fine until a thunderstorm comes along, then climb
over the fence into the next yard and beat the crap out of your
neighbour's dog that otherwise it gets along with just fine. It is NOT
caused by owner neglect, tho lack of training exacerbates the problem,
because such dogs cannot cope with *options*. If you TELL them how
they're going to behave and enforce it (so the dog never has to
choose what to do), they're fine, but if they have to make a decision
themselves, they panic and do stupid things exactly as you describe.
Such a dog is MUCH happier if confined in a crate or kennel when no
one is around, since that way they KNOW how the world works.

Such dogs can't just relax when there is nothing to do; not having
something *specific* to do is the same for them as having infinite
options.

So, in my typical long winded style .. I guess I'm just asking if the

Ha, I've barely got started

poop eating can also be emitional/mental illness on the part of the
dog due to neglect?

Nope, never. Nor is the behaviour you describe due to neglect; that
dog *inherited* its behaviour pattern (with the window-escapee, it's
essentially a form of psychosis). As noted lack of training makes it
worse. Part of what training IS, is that YOU make the decisions,
rather than putting that burden on the dog. These dogs can't cope with
having to make any decisions themselves.

~REZ~