Hi,

Oh I agree complete that my African Queen vs. Lee Koi Choon example does
not give you plants with identical genes, no cross does. This is why I
did not say identical, I said equivalent. There is a lot of variation,
but based on the parentage, it is *theoretically* possible that you
could have one plant of African Queen that is exactly identical to Lee
Koi Choon, although this is not the case in the vast majority of the
time. I mean, no two Violet Charms are the same unless they are clones,
and yet this entire genetic spectrum of plants are all called that
simply because they have the same parentage, and contain half and half
of their genes. I mean, if I gave you an African Queen and a Lee Koi
Choon, without telling you which was which and said here's a DNA
sequencer that can tell you what genes came from which species, but not
the exact root it took to get there, one would most likely conclude that
the two specimens should be of the same grex. I guess once again it is
just a convention I'll have to accept. You raised the point of
different genes coming from pollen vs. seed, which is definitely true
much like how mitochondrial DNA is only inherited from the mother in the
human. However, BxC = CxB in terms of naming with the RHS.....

Cheers,
Xi

Ray wrote:

As to your first point about selfing, you are absolutely correct that the
genetic percentages could be redistributed differently, but remember that
the hybridization of orchids has been going on a lot longer than we have
even known about genetics, so Violet Charm x Violet Charm = Violet Charm, by
convention.

On your second point, I think you're really oversimplifying the genetics, as
it's not just percentage contributions from parent that make the difference.

Based upon my readings and discussions with folks who really do know this
stuff, (A x B) x (C x D) is very likely not at all equivalent to (A x C) x
(B x D) due to the dominant/recessive issue among others. Look at the
simple A x B cross - offspring can show AB, Ab, aB, and ab gene pairs. Are
they the same hybrid? Yes, Are they "equivalent?" No. Now multiply that
single gene by the total number and the combinations get far more diverse.

That is also why your African Queen vs. Lee Koi Choon example fails. Going
back to your (A x B) x (C x D) versus (A x C) x (B x D) example, it is
highly unlikely, but entirely possible that the first cross ends up with
genes entirely from A & C, while the second is B & D, which nobody would
argue to be the same. That, however, lends total validity to your Violet
Charm point!

Then there's pollen versus pod parent issues, in which - apparently (so I've
heard) - some genes come almost exclusively from the pod parent...