On 10/31/04 11:42 AM, in article ,
"Alan Gould" wrote:

In article , Bob Hobden
writes

That's not my understanding Alan, I understood some chemicals and "natural"
plant extract chemicals are allowed, and as some plant extract chemicals
will kill I don't see they are any more valid in an organic garden than man
made ones.

All substances living or inert have elements in them which can be
expressed in chemical terms. Whether they are benign or malign depends
on how they are used. For example, a cup of water can kill if it is
consumed wrongly, whereas Joan takes Warfarin daily as a medicine.

As with the word organic, the word chemical has several definitions. In
the context of organic horticulture, chemical refers to manufactured
chemical poisons such as herbicides, insecticides, fungicides, etc.
These are often (wrongly IMHO) all expressed as pesticides. Along with
chemical fertilisers and lethal home-made potions none of them are
acceptable in commercial organic horticulture. Non-commercial
recreational gardeners can do as they please, but those who wish to eat
properly safe organic food need to keep to commercial standards.

There may be different arrangements for so called 'Organic (TM)'
produce, but I have never discovered any food on sale under that name.
Could you detail where you have seen it?

What I meant by that is, the organic stuff sold in supermarkets and similar
which is produced on factory type farms like the other non-organic produce,
i.e. highly commercial, millions of £'s involved.......

No food can legally be sold for public consumption as organic unless it
carries an authorised symbol of organic quality. That guarantees it to
be in compliance with the regulations. There are cheats and tricksters
in any aspect of business, but anyone who tries to defraud organic
consumers risks losing their livelihood. If you know it to be happening,
report them, the bigger they are, the heavier they fall.
Hi Alan
I appreciate the information you have provided and I try to follow the
'organic' philosophy. I do have a question regarding the term organic.
Although I use organic methods and can therefore call my vegetables organic,
I cannot call them 'Certified Organic". My point being that certified means
just that. Farmers who are Certified Organic are inspected by the governing
body to ensure they are following the rules. As you say, should it be
discovered they are not, then they would instantly lose the right to use the
term Certified Organic.
I have worked on two different Certified Organic farms here in BC and
both farmers are organic...nuts...certified even! Even under dire insect
attacks on their crops they absolutely refuse to use any pesticide that will
kill the pests...
Gary
Fort Langley, BC
Canada