On Wed, 27 Nov 2002 18:27:05 +0000, HaaRoy wrote:

I have some seeds from globe thistles and a few others and was
wondering when i need to get them under way, what type of soil and
temperatures.
anyone know?

I won't hit it with you right away but I have, at the bottom of this
message, given you a list of 37 plants which have the word "thistle"
in their common name.

Not only that, although most of them are from the family Compositae, a
couple of them are even from different families (Labiatae and
Chenopodiaceae).

Does it make a difference?

Well you are talking to a newbie seed sower here who has just taken
delivery of a clutch of packets from Chiltern Seeds.

A select few of these packets had very specific instructions stuck to
them. It seems that the seeds of certain plants will not germinate
unless their biological processes are activated with moisture and
moderate warmth and then they are banished into near freezing
temperatures for a goodly while. This period of cold is apparently
essential to their metabolism and it is only after they have endured
this that they can gird their loins for their final Oom Pah Pah in
conditions resembling the coming of Spring with its warmth.

Looking it up, I can deduce that Echinops ritro (Globe thistle - the
one you identified) is one such plant and should be sown in a cold
frame. Whether or not it first of all needs a wake up call with the
damp and not quite so cold (Lets pretend it's Autumn?) I have no idea.

I have a little text file which I transcribed from the label on
Chilterns seeds which I have dubbed "Chiltern's cold seeds"

I think if you want to start them off immediately I would recommend
you follow it.

Chiltern cold seeds:

1. 64 - 72 F 2/4 wks
17 - 22 C


2. 25 - 40 F 4/6 wks
-4 - 4 C


3. Return to to more than
65 F
19 C

Indeed, if the seeds don't sprout the first season you are strongly
advised to leave them to experience the full cycle of temperature
environments and expect them to emerge the following year.

To avoid stress for myself and thereby probably the plants too, each
of my 3.5" pots is enclosed in its little greenhouse consisting of a
clear polythene sandwich bag tied tight closed with a wire tie (often
supplied with the bags) but leaving a fair amount of air inside the
bubble. In this way I can be sure that they will never (or scarcely
ever) need watering. However, because this is an ideal environment
for fungii and other pathogens I also intend giving them a treatment
of Cheshunts Compound as recommended.

Which medium to use seems controversial. Chiltern seeds say that the
success rate with Levington's Peat based compost far exceeds John
Innes loam based. Maybe the objection to Levington's is based on
environmental principles (the ransacking of peat bogs).

My kitchen table seems to have been transformed to a potting bench!

As for the "few other thistles" - well maybe one of them is the Scotch
Thistle (Onopordum acanthium) (which, in cultivation, I would regard
as more exotic than the Echinops). It seems that can be sown in Spring
and do without the near freeze.

Please remember that I said I'm a newbie and you should take the
advice of any of the seasoned gardeners who respond to you if their
advice is contrary to that I have given you.

Respect

Hussein - the list follows!

Carduus crispus Welted thistle
Carduus nutans Musk thistle
Carlina acaulis Stemless carline thistle
Carlina vulgaris Carline thistle
Carthamnus lanatus Distaff thistle
Centaurea calcitrapa Common star thistle
Centaurea iberica Iberian star thistle
Centaurea melitensis Maltese star thistle
Centaurea solstitialis St. Barnaby's/Yellow Star thistle
Cicerbita alpina Blue sow thistle
Cirsium acaulon Stemless thistle
Cirsium arvense Creeping thistle
Cirsium brevistylum Indian thistle
Cirsium eatoni Eaton's thistle
Cirsium edule Edible thistle
Cirsium eriophorum Wooly thistle
Cirsium hookerianum White thistle
Cirsium occidentale Cobwebby thistle
Cirsium ochrocentrum Yellow spined thistle
Cirsium oleraceum Cabbage thistle
Cirsium pallidum Pale thistle
Cirsium palustre Marsh thistle
Cirsium tuberosum Tuberous thistle
Cirsium undulatum Wavy-leaved thistle
Cirsium vulgare Common thistle
Cnicus benedictus Blessed thistle
Echinops ritro Globe thistle
Onopordum acanthium Scotch thistle
Onopordum illyricum Cotton thistle
Salsola kali ruthenica Prickly Russian thistle
Salvia carduacea Thistle sage
Scolymus maculatus Spotted golden thistle
Silybum marianum Milk thistle
Sonchus arvensis Field milk thistle
Sonchus asper Prickly sow thistle
Sonchus oleraceus Sow thistle