"0tterbot" wrote in message
"Farm1" please@askifyouwannaknow wrote in message

The ACT has ripper frosts in the more open areas but
if you were in a Canberra suburb the frosts there are much
mitigated
by the microclimate formed by the suburbs

certainly i noticed some frosts there, but it wasn't too bad (small
yard in
the burbs, yeah). and also, by the time they came it was "frost
time", so
that was all right anyway. it's really, really dry there too, which
i
suppose helps(?).

I don't think that lack of rain does help to stop frosts. That
unbelieveable frost we got in October was right in a very dry time and
I went to see some open gardens down round Nimmitabel after that frost
and they had had phenomenal damage (and as you'd know the Monaro has
been as dry as the Smiths Crisps factory for years and years).

it's barely rained all year. here, the clouds come over
the mountain from the coast so it's generally much more moist. (i
think
frost is frozen moisture from the air, is that right?)

Yes I think so but then I don't really know.

Yep, and because it has that Easterly aspect, you'll need to be
careful about the sun hitting frozen plants, but then Eastern fall
land is better overall for plant growth.

i see. should i just keep them covered until they are thawed?

Yes but yuo'll find out which ones can be uncovered earlier than
others and which ones will also be burned off by the frost right
through whatever you cover them with. I didn't plant my tomatoes till
I knew who had won the Melbourne Cup and even then we kept covering
them each night. They were planted into the triangular plastic
sleeves and covered each night with old chook food bags and they still
got bitten after one particulalry bad frost right through double
covering.

i didn't know
this. i like the eastern aspect, the veg get plenty of sun without
having to
bake & bake to a crisp all afternoon on a hot day.

Yep. Eastern fall land also gives protection from those hot westerly
winds which dry things out so quick.

A good demonstration for you about how frost drains downhill. In
future plant more frost tender things on the top of the veggie
patch
(which we both know that you won't do - none of us ever do that
given
that our space is usually limited by one factor or another:-))

you're not wrong :-)) we made so many beds that one is actually
still empty,
& i was going to be all organised in order to rotate & all that, but
the
reality is a little different ;-)

Yep. Either never enough beds ready at the right time or too many
beds ready.

the beans have just been stupid this year
& this may be why (the cold, the frost),

That could also be our fluctuating temperatures too. Hot then cold
etc and the ground temp. must fluctuate too. Bloody shit of a season.

although the slope keeps going, it
doesn't stop at the beans, but by the time it's come a way downhill
is the
frost clinging to the ground more?

Frost is such a variable thing. Although it generally seems to 'flow'
like water it can sometimes hit something and not hit another more
tender thing which you expect to find as dead as a tick right near
something that has been hit. I dunno whehter that just luck or good
management but certainly big rocksdo seem to mitigate frosts as do
well grown plants - by that I mean sturdy, healthy, well watered but
not overfed by too mush forcing on with fertiliser.

The way to go might be to make more use of rock mulches, but make
sure
the rocks are BIG rocks about the size of an adults head - not
****y
little things.

i have big rocks :-)

Good. Now you have a good use for them ;-)) Hint - buy one of those
cheap 2 wheeled high handled moving trolleys from Supercheap Auto,
(about $29 IIRC) they're invaluable for moving rocks/pot plants, but
also keep the tyres well pumped up as those cheap tyres go down real
quick.

From what you've described, I think I'd plant a hedge that has
good
growth right at the bottom of the hedge (to stop frost draing
under
it) on the top of the downhill side of your swale ie the downhill
side
of the U shape but at the top of the U - does that make sense? - I
can
see it in my head but am having trouble putting it into English.

i think that makes sense. the idea being, the frost will more likely
have to
travel along the swale & the hedge without being able to get into
the veggie
patch so much?

Yes. It will lie in the swale in a frost pocket on the uphill side of
the hedge and not continue to drain down into the veg patch.

they would be a pain in the arse to water efficiently and
effectively

do you mean because of the shape, or the rocks sticking up, or ..?

The shape. But when you mention rocks, I wonder if you're thinking of
the permie mandala beds???

The kidney shaped permie beds I thought you meant were the ones with
the taller plants on the outer edge of the curve with the lower
growing plants on the inner sider of the curves. I think they call
them sun traps?????????? And the ones I've seen pics of didn't ahve
any rocks whereas the mandala beds all did. Not that it matters
either way - I have enough problems watering with low pressure without
adding to it. BTW, do you have low pressure because Green Harvest
seel those wonderful low pressure 'rattle" top sprinklers which are
wonderful for low pressure country systems - I've got about a dozen
and swear by them..

and also there is more of a problem for plants from being
too hot than needing the protection of the higher outer growing
plants. I've stuck with the rectangular shape for maincrops and
put
other stuff under the edges of fruit trees round the edge of the
veg
area. This has worked well for things like cutting greens and
strawberrys and things that don't like our nasty scorching sun or
which wilt at the drop of a hat.

hm. i had the idea that i could make short walls around the southern
end of
each bed (or perhaps just a couple) perhaps for things which like
heat. i
take your point about heat not always being helpful :-) we are
classified as
"cool temperate" here, which means that overall it is not hot, but
of course
there are still really hot days too. it's a poser!!

But you can plant to suit the season and the position with walls or
just move the planting out from the wall as needed. I put up and take
down walls as I find they work or don't. Just watch out for Joe
Blakes - rotten sodding things, they love rocks with chinks in them.
They also love to hide down the side of old fence posts that are
loose. I've had my husband go round and fill in all the sides of the
ones round the garden this year. He has only just come back from a
neighbour's (who he respects) and tell me what a good idea it was to
fill them in. He didn't say that at the time I insisted he do it :-))