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Old 18-04-2008, 09:25 PM posted to alt.philosophy,soc.culture.indian,sci.anthropology,sci.archaeology,sci.bio.botany
galathaea galathaea is offline
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First recorded activity by GardenBanter: Apr 2007
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Default ?? evidence for precolombian dhaturas on the indian subcontinent??

On Apr 14, 11:51 pm, galathaea wrote:
in the western group temples of khajuraho
in a corner of the grounds
sits the kandariya mahadeva temple

i came across the temple in a recent road trip across northern india
and was excited because i thought
it might hold scenes from the devi mahatmyam
my favorite part of all the puranas

this was a mysterious temple
menacing from afar but strangely attractive
inviting like a poison

outside
beneath the temple placard advertising its importance to the tourist
i saw the distinctive trumpet of a datura metel bush

http://www.galathaea.org/dhatura/kan...deva-metel.JPG

i had been noticing daturas through the road trip
and earlier had shot a strand of datura stramonium outside in orchha

http://www.galathaea.org/dhatura/str...niumOrchha.JPG

i have a deep love for the entire solanaceous family
and grow metels and stramoniums in my garden
so there were no difficulties identifying these plants
but i did not realise at first what secrets this simple fact might reveal

the kandariya mahadeva temple held more explicit and more various
the erotic tantric sculptures the khajuraho temples are famous for
and more scenes from the ancient epics seemed detailed

stepping into the inner sanctum
after paying respects to the central lingam
i followed the relief all around the pradakshinathapa until i suddenly saw

http://www.galathaea.org/dhatura/wideClearPhlash.JPG

although certainly no expert in hindu iconography
i felt certain that this was a depiction of durga slaying mahishasura
from the second or middle charita of the devi mahatmyam

http://www.galathaea.org/dhatura/clearPhlashPhoto.JPG

but if you take a look at the upper right of the pictures
(durga's left shoulder)
you will notice some kind of trumpet flower or fabric arrangement

http://www.galathaea.org/dhatura/clo...imensional.JPG

to me
this seemed a likely datura representation
but this is where i get pretty much useless

now
i can recognise many of the traditional weapons she is supposed to be holding

i see the sword in her right hand diagonal behind her back
and i see scepter down
the conch shell hiding in the betweenness of the right arms
the sudarshan-chakra discus in the uppermost right

i see her shield

others appear missing in the broken arms
but it seems likely that the datura-looking thing
corresponds to what is also common in iconography as her lotus flower
however that is certainly not a representation of a lotus flower

it is not even closely resembling
and i cannot think of any other botanical it might be

now i also know that there is a strong tradition
associating daturas with shiva and kali/durga
and i know there is some historical use by thuggees
but i also know that the thuggee are not definitively precolombian
and the "traditional" explanation for datura in india
is misassignment of other botanicals through linguistic transference

because datura
like many other solanaceous plants like tomatos and chiles
are new world plants

there were no known trade routes which could have brought it to india

precolumbus
orthodoxy claims no communication between old world and the new

a datura in a tenth century temple would indicate something quite remarkable

^..^

but of course
it would not be anything definitive

seeds can travel without human intervention

there are always other explanations

and of course i've heard of the cocaine and tobacco
the mass-spec found in egypt

what do you think?
what else could this piece of statuary represent?


after some literature research
i have found
http://ns1.ias.ac.in/jbiosci/dec2007/1227.pdf
which illustrates some other statuary evidence
so perhaps the conclusion is not half-baked

i will email the authors with my own findings
but i was curious about the scholarliness of my presentation

for those of you who may be professionals in these fields
how does the presentation of this find measure up?

are the pictures satisfactory
or should i have captured more angles?
(i did, but they ended too blurry to post)

is the identification of the representation accurate?

was my specification of it's location accurate enough?

should i have collected any other evidence?
(situational, expository, supportive, ...)

is the hypothesis of precolombian daturas
a valid hypothesis on the evidence?

now that i've seen the 2007 paper
i am more comfortable that there are
at least other kooks who think like me

that is comforting
but i'm still unsure how kooky the results really are...

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galathaea: prankster, fablist, magician, liar