"Sheldon" wrote in message
...
On Aug 24, 4:58?pm, "Ted Mittelstaedt" wrote:
As I mentioned, I have an Indian Summer crabapple tree that
is it's pollenator, and that tree produced a large number of
crabapples. ?As you said, all apple trees need a pollenator -
where did that crabapple tree get it's pollen from if not
from this tree? ?And if it got it from some 3rd tree in the area,
then why didn't this tree get it from that tree also?

Not all crabapple pollenates dessert apple well.

Yellow Transparent is a cooking apple.

Your crab apple
produces fruit because some crabapple are self pollenating. Your tree
produced some apples because most likely there is another apple tree
not too distant and one that's in blossom during the same period as
yours, but probably too distant to be an efficient pollenator, and
probably the wrong type of tree for your fruit to set well, so it will
drop. Check with a nurseryman to find out which type of apple tree is
recommended as a pollenator for yours, not all are compatible so don't
run out and buy just any old apple tree.

There are no real nurserymen left in my city - none that is who are
available to any customer, that is. I already tried that route a couple
years ago. As I mentioned, none had heard of the particular cultivar.
Everyone I talked to only wanted to sell me a Gala apple tree or some
such variety that I can buy from the supermarket - why even bother
planting one of those when every corner market that sells apples
already has tons of those apples.

My read of the local retail nurseries is that they follow fads and fashions,
and know nothing about plants anymore. Half the retail nurseries are
owned by chains in the first place. And all of them carry the same
varieties. Right now the native plants are a big fad so they carry
those. But I could go from nursery to nursery writing down varieties
and I would end up with a list of perhaps a grand total of 15 different
apple varieties. And every one of those 15 would be of an apple
available in the supermarket. Most people buy fruit trees that produce
fruits they are already used to buying and eating from the supermarket.
So that avenue is as they say a dry hole. There is more info online
such as the link you posted below.

You need to do some research:
http://www.dpi.nsw.gov.au/agricultur...es/crabapple-p
ollinators

I did already. In fact I emailed several professional apple experts years
ago before getting the tree, including the local extension agent - who had
never heard of that cultivar and he e-mailed yet another apple expert in the
business, and I talked with him on the phone as well. The only thing useful
that this turned up was that I should try to get a pollenator because the
most
common apple varieties bloom later and bear fruit later. However nobody
could give me a variety of pollenator. So I did the only logical thing
possible,
which was to wait until the tree bloomed, then go around to all the
nurseries
looking for an apple tree variety that was blooming at the same time. I
needed a crabapple because that is the only type of apple tree I can plant
on
my property in the space I have available (ie: the front street strip
between
the road and the sidewalk) and the city will not allow true apple trees in
that strip, only crabapples - and even then I had to get a variance on the
permit for the Indian Summer crabapple since it wasn't on the city's list of
allowable trees. No doubt in another 5 years the eco-freaks will have
succeeded in exorcising even the few crabapples from the list of allowable
street trees and there will only be native trees allowed.

Incidentally, Indian Summer came from the "misc tree" area of Home
Depot. Home Depot, unlike the retail nurseries, does not stock regular
varieties of trees. Instead they call up the tree growers who supply
the retail nurseries and buy up whatever the growers happen to have
left that the retail nurseries didn't buy, then they sell them cheap to
people who just want "a pretty tree". None of the retail nurseries in
the area had crabapples in bloom when I wanted them. I basically
just went around to every place that sold trees until I found that one.

I contacted several dozen "grower" nurseries nationally, looking for this
cultivar.
None carried it. One nursery back east claimed to carry it in a non-grafted
native root tree. Good luck with that. A few wholesale nurseries in Canada
also claimed to carry it. Do you want a description of all the crap you
have to go through to take a tree across the border from Canada
to the US and how expensive it is? And this isn't even beginning to
touch the nonsense with minimum orders and all of that which the
wholesale nurseries have.

This isn't a cultivar that is an espically significant historical cultivar,
so
the various societies that care about saving "heirloom" cultivars are no
help either. Yellow Transparent is equivalent to a 1984 Chevy Celebrity.
During their day millions were made. But they were always a workhorse
and at this time they have not been gone for long enough for anyone to
notice. No doubt in 50 years there will be "heirloom apple tree preservers"
out there tearing their hair out wondering why nobody bothered saving
a specimen of yellow transparent, just as there will be old car buffs
tearing their hair out wondering why nobody bothered saving 1984
Chevy Celebrities. But right now there are not - because most are like
you who seem to think that it's an ordinary enough tree that info should
be readily available.

30 years ago this cultivar had a limited success as a commercial apple.
What I need to find is some old retired geezer farmer who at that time
had an orchard with some of these in it, and who remembers all about
their habits and how to make them happy and how to get them to
yield well. I've had no luck with that and in fact I've only come across
one orchard within a 50 mile radius that has a few of these trees, and
it's a hobby orchard and the guy that owns it just did the old trick of
40 years ago he planted 20 apple trees, and all 20 are completely different
cultivars, and all planted in the same orchard within 25 feet of each
other - so of course, he has no clue what is pollenating what.

The entire thing is an experiment. It may not work. But the alternative
is sitting on my butt doing nothing, being ****ed at the dumb supermarkets
who only want to carry something like 5 apple varieties, all of which
have only been bred to have 10 month shelf lives and skins made out
of what appears to be red stainless steel - so they can be shipped
on the cheapest freight carrier from Mexico and still be salable.

And your tree is
diseased because it's living in a garbage dump... sheesh, what a slob!

It IS diseased? That is what I was asking. ?If your sure it is,
then what disease does it have?


Mold/fungus/mildew... even though visible manifesting itself in the
leaves still the entire tree is affected because it's in the soil
too. Clean up all that rotting stuff on the ground at the base of
your tree, that entire area looks very shabby

There is no rotting stuff because I mow that area a couple times
a year. There is a compost pile in the background that is mostly
layers of grass clippings and pulled weeds. I do not mow weekly
or even monthly. Often the grass goes to seed. I also do not
water the lawn, once the spring rains stop the lawn goes brown.

We have several bad vine type weeds that every fall I pull as
much as I can out. But they are in the fence and in the neighbors
yard and come through the fence and it is pointless to try to
eradicate it as long as the neighbor on the other side of the fence
does nothing.

... and it's plain to see
that your soil is very poor, looks like mostly sand and yellow clay

It is mostly clay.

plus who knows what toxins were previously dumped there, especilaly so
near a property line, certain pinhead neighbors are apt to toss
whatever over the fence (you might want to have your soil tested).

The house was built in 1911 and before that the entire area was a
brickyard. It is what it is.

And why are all those weeds growing at the base of that poor tree,
they're stealing water and robbing what little nutrients are
present...

It is only grass growing within a 2 foot radius of the tree base. And
of course it likes to grow there since I water the tree there. I could
pull it but the tree is in a lawn and the grass would just come back in.
I do not let the weed from the fence encroach on the tree.

In the wild I have observed trees in the forest having no problems
growing in a meadow of grass. I thus am unlikely to be convinced
that grass at the base is a problem.

I can tell your soil is poor/toxic because even those weeds
are struggling.

The lawn beyond the tree area, which is a mix of grass and
weeds, is struggling because I don't water it.

You have a lot of housekeeping to do and at least
apply a goodly amount of fungicide to the entire area, drench the
soil... then keep that area clean and tidy.

Thanks. I don't mind the delivery if you can give me something useful.

Ted