I didnt say "I believed" I said there is convincing scientific evidence. Facts +
belief systems do not "meet somewhere in the middle". They dont mix at all.

There is convincing scientific evidence that 80% or more of personality is inborn,
hardwired, not just genetically but developmentally wired, like our fingerprints
develop in utero... which is why monozygotic, AKA identical twins have different
fingerprints.

There was genetic evidence for alcoholism a long time ago. And why, in a caring
family with multiple caring loving children there appears a sociopath that doesnt
give a damn about anybody but themselves? Rather than cling to the "belief" that
alcoholics and sociopaths and narcissists "decide" to be the way they are we can fund
and encourage scientists to find the genetic basis of mental illness, the kind of
illness that either prevents the person from having loving relationships with others,
the kind of mental illness that drives people to suicide.. or homicide. The kind
that drives them deep into a bottle of alcohol or meth or cocaine to burn themselves
out. I am not talking about funding research to find out why some people prefer
pink.

It may be that you believe what you do because of what you saw first hand and the
choices you made. My mother was not addicted to anything except her belief that it
was perfectly normal to be a mean, nasty depressive with a vicious streak if crossed.
She was the giant black hole of negativity that sucked all the joy and life out of
those closest to her all the while presenting this caring loving mask to her
"friends". There was only one person she really loved and that was herself, her
house, her gardens. Did she "choose" to be a mean self centered depressive? No. And
her mother, my grandmother was the sweetest most genuinely kind and accepting person
I have ever met and thankfully the person who mostly raised me.

I dont blame my mother for who she was or how miserable she made me. It must have
been hell to have been my mother. I tried and others tried to convince her to use
anti-depressants (which everyone else in the family uses) and she would sneer and say
"so I can go around being a happy idiot"? And my mother was a social worker for
crissake. Despite the negativity I grew up into a reasonably positive person who
finds a little bliss every day, like those red tulips I planted last year are just
kick ass in the morning sun.

Ingrid

On Sun, 10 May 2009 09:41:55 -0500, Jangchub wrote:
And I do not believe we are genetically predisposed. But I believe in
a different set of concepts than you, so we'll meet in the middle.

Alcoholism is not a disease. It is a self-indulgent, selfish, care about nobody but
themselves kind of thing.
Somewhere between zone 5 and 6 tucked along the shore of Lake Michigan
on the council grounds of the Fox, Mascouten, Potawatomi, and Winnebago