In article ,
RJBL wrote:

wrote:
In article ,
RJBL wrote:
The various enteritis illness, some trivial some not so, have increased
in frequency by a couple of orders of magnitude since the 1960's. ...

Oh, really? Do you have any evidence that this is anything more than
a recording artifact? Back in the 1960s, most people didn't call a
doctor for mere D&V, whereas they do now. Related to this, there has
been a HUGE increase in the number of people who are seriously infirm,
because modern medical aid prevents them dying from other causes.

A secondary effect, which particularly affects the serious incidents,
is that the population has much less immunity now than it did then,
because it has not had the exposure. It isn't clear how much that
affects the statistics.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

Nick

Thanks for your thoughtful response.

No evidence that it is any more than a recording artifact at all, of
course.

As I infer that you know well already public health and epidemiological
data is bedevilled by recording artifacts; changes in notifiability
criteria; changes in clinical diagnostic fashions and changes in the
availability of experimental subjects to clinical examination. The
recorded data do, indeed, show a very large increase in the apparent
incidence of the minor enteric illnesses since the 1960s; as was
predicted by Betty Hobbs all those years ago when the home food freezer
first entered the consumer market in volume and home freezing
preservation became fashionable.

I guess that most patients still don't consult their GP when hit by a
simple D&V bug. Typically for the first 24hrs because they cannot,
phyically, get to the Clinic and thereafter because they feel,
obviously, sufficiently recovered not to need further treatment. I
surmise that the public records may show that the increase has been in
cases of illness perceived to be 'severe' rather than 'trivial'.

The original point was that gardeners would be prudent to be aware of
the potential bacteriological hazards of the organic gardening fashion.
It appears to be true, from the WHO published data, that those societies
which practice, per force, strictly organic animal and human faecal soil
fertilisation suffer high incidences of the enteric illnesses. The
possible exception being China - where food is invariably cooked, and at
high temperatures, and drinking water is invariably boiled - and has
been for at least the last two thousand years.

Your secondary observation re change in population immune response is
intriguing. Many allergies and allergy originated illnesses like asthma
do, indeed, appear to have become much more frequent in the last thirty
or so. Various estimates suggest that the frequency of childhood asthma
has increased between one and two orders of magnitude over that time. It
seems to have exactly paralleled the decline of tobacco smoking in the
population over the same period, although it would, of course, be
heretical to postulate any causal connection.

Returning to the exam question as originally set:-

1. Hot composting of material including horse and cow dung will probably
at least pasteurise the material and thus kill off most/all the
pathogenic bacteria. It may not destroy any Clostridial spores that have
been formed in the compost; these will remain, potentially, dangerous
for decades.

2. Cold composting will, almost certainly, not leave the compost safe in
respect to the common pathogens. These may well die out in the compost
over time.

Takeaway message, still, :-

A. Keep your AT course up to date;

B. Treat any organically raised garden produce as contaminated. Wash it
thoroughly and cook it properly.

rjbl

Just rinse my organic carrots please.

Here in the good ol' U.S.of A., we like our shit factory fresh. Whether
it be rat or bat shit in our peanuts, or collateral damage from our
CAFOs, we just suck it down. It costs money to run a clean operation.
You can't expect a company to be into social welfare. They privatize the
profits, and socialize the costs (doctor's visits).

http://www.agpolicy.org/weekcol/467.html

http://www.foodpoisonjournal.com/200...tion/usda-sees
-the-light-on-e-coli-o157h7-and-meat/

And on the humane treatment of animals front,
http://www.grist.org/article/2009-07...-e.-coli-meat/
--

- Billy

"For the first time in the history of the world, every human being is
now subjected to contact with dangerous chemicals, from the moment of
conception until death." - Rachel Carson

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/7843430.stm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WI29wVQN8Go