Sacha wrote:
On 2011-06-03 10:55:57 +0100, Martin said:

On Fri, 3 Jun 2011 10:52:39 +0100, Sacha wrote:

On 2011-06-03 10:46:03 +0100, Martin said:

On Fri, 3 Jun 2011 10:20:49 +0100, "Ian B"
snip
The fact that a guy wants with all his heart to be a dairy
farmer, because his dad was, and his grandad, that just doesn't
matter to the ultimate end buyer in Sainsburys. As the market
seeks out the cheapest suppliers, Sainsburys woman gets cheaper
milk, and that's all she's going to care about. If these people
go out of business, we're all long-term winners, not long-term
losers. It's why economic growth happens, and we can all afford
to spend money on fripperies like our gardens; because over the
centuries, millions of people lost their businesses and jobs.
It's harsh, but better than the alternatives by far.

Report back after your job has been transferred to a third world
country.

Oh dear, how very true. ;-(

In this case, hopefully :-)

Ugh - I don't want to see anyone lose their job! But if we don't
support our small businesses, we know what the outcome will be. How
often do I hear or read of people who can only buy supplies easily if
they buy from supermarkets. We're so lucky here in having many small
shops still popular and doing well, a milkman who delivers and brings
the papers, too. Long may it last. I really don't want all my choice
of meat or veg dictated by a supermarket's pricing and buying regime.

Well, after Martin's devastating smackdown there I'm truly devastated.

Really, this conversation is utterly depressing. It's not so much that
people don't know about economics- that's fair enough, they have lots of
other things to do. It's the dogged, pig-headed refusal to both understand,
but to hold opinions anyway. It's like somebody who's never studied physics,
saying, "time runs at different speeds, don't be silly!"

Try this. I live in Northampton. Let's say there's this guy Bob, and he
lives in Cardiff. And we both sell roses. And Bob's roses are cheaper than
mine. So, Northampton Town Council get together and they say, "Ian's
business is being transferred to Wales! Let's protect Ian and ban all rose
imports from outside Northamptonshire! That'll work!".

So, that's good for me. Now I can sell expensive roses. But what about
everybody else? They are being denied Bob's cheaper roses. The result is
*fewer roses in Northampton*. It's not a net benefit. It's a net loss. Now
try doing that to every part of the economy; milk, motor cars, lawnmowers,
meat, fish... do you see what happens? The people of Northampton just get
poorer and poorer. You are inducing scarcity, not wealth. Do you see?


Ian