David Hare-Scott wrote:
songbird wrote:
David Hare-Scott wrote:
...
They may conceivable be right but I don't see this type of
presentation making too many converts. The faithful will of course
love it but that won't influence those who ought to take notice;
farmers, business leaders and legislators. Which is all rather sad.

well like i said, the two pictures were worth
thousands of words.

The comparison pics show something was different. But what exactly? They
don't say.

they say the one handful of dirt that was darker
was from the organic plot and the other handful
was from the conventional plot. and the other
picture was showing the difference between the
organic and conventional plots during a drought
with the organic plot showing taller and greener
plants.


Soil building is admirable but just because you can build soil
doesn't mean all the other requirements of a sustainable food production
system are met. Unless, like them, you carefully define sustainability in
terms of soil building.

from my continued studies i'd say it is a
good start in a world that is mostly going
the other direction (destroying topsoil faster
than making it).


I have the same problem with a local community-based horticultural trial.
They are getting good results but so far have not produced enough analysis
to show what the full costs are. If you put enough inputs (including hard
work) into a trial you can do wonders in almost any situation but can you do
it efficiently, can you keep it going on a large scale if you have to pay
full price for your labour, manures etc and can you compete, or at least get
close to it, regarding selling price with conventional systems?

you use the word "efficiently" but i think
that word is often a focus and over-simplified
into "easy". the base rate of soil production
with no inputs is the absolute minimum in terms
of energy expenditures. where there are no
other inputs or passes of machinery or anything
other than walking through and picking whatever
is desired and then putting it directly in the
mouth.

some complexities and inputs added above that
type of system can be offset by getting more
out of the garden plot. yet i don't think a
lot of people keep that close of an eye on
expenses or time spent because they get a lot
of happiness out of raising their own food or
they like the larger variety of foods they
can grow that they'll not find at the store.
it's hard to put an exact price on what is
good about being able to go out and have fresh
beans or strawberries right off the plants.

for myself, just having a good reason to
get outside and exercise in a meaningful way
is a huge benefit. i hate having to exercise
just for the sake of exercise itself, but i
can go outside and putter around in the gardens
for hours and the time goes by so quickly.


i agree with you though, that i'd like to see
the information behind the Rodale study.

I will have a look at the material Billy was sent.

they are on my reading list too.


songbird