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Old 16-10-2013, 05:25 PM posted to uk.rec.gardening
Nick Maclaren[_3_] Nick Maclaren[_3_] is offline
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First recorded activity by GardenBanter: Sep 2013
Posts: 767
Default OT Grammer question

In article ,
Another John wrote:
In article ,
Martin Brown wrote:

£10,000 [of money] were stolen.


I think you will find both forms in common usage in the UK ...


Incredible. No you wouldn't, because it's purely and simply wrong! In
common usage, any British born-and-bred person when faced with the words
"ten thousand pounds" would think instantly in terms of the abstract
noun of "money", not in terms the concrete noun, "notes".


Not at all. "There was five million in the safe, of which ten
thousand were stolen."

Your point...
Although in certain Lancashire dialects
"were" is used when "was" would be grammatically correct.


That's not "grammatically correct": that's dialect. (Also common in
Yorkshire, where I come from.) And it's not the word "were" as in the
plural form of "was", but "wer'" as in the dialect way of saying "was"
(more often heard as "wo'" in the West Riding, and "wer'" elsewhere in
this belt of the country.


All forms of English are dialect or similar, despite the attempts
of some self-imposed pedants to hijack ownership of the language.
In particular, many of the 'incorrect' grammatical and spelling
forms are simply literary or old-fashioned - and, as a professional
pedant, I am referring to 18th century literary usage as merely
'old-fashioned'.

If ever you want to know "the" answer to a question about English
Grammar, refer to "Modern English Usage" by H.W. Fowler, revised by Sir
Ernest Gowers in 1965 [sic]. It's worth its weight in gold (it weighs a
modest 705g, or 1lb 9oz if you prefer).


It is, however, a simplified set of rules of the dogmatic version
of the language introduced by the Victorian pedantic establishment.
Once you learn enough, you start to break its rules more often!

Yes, the English language evolves as the decades go by, but not as fast
as some people (the illiterate masses) would have you believe. Not even
as fast as the Big Dictionaries would have you believe either: people
like Collins and the OED now make regular press releases about "new
words" not because these have "entered the language" (because they'll
have gone again in a few years) but because they want to sell more
dictionaries (or subscriptions to their effing websites).


In that paragraph, you have used one word, one meaning of an old
word, and two (unquoted) expressions that were not widespread when
I was at school.

Thank you David, for giving me that opportunity! Nah then: wheer did ah
put me pipe? It wer' round ere some wheer....


Ah! I have espied you as one of the manifolde abusers of this vile
custome of Tobacco taking, yet you preach of vertue!


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.