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The Romans Tried Aquaducts
And they are all dead now...
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The Romans Tried Aquaducts
wrote in message ... And they are all dead now... But, some of their aqueducts are still standing and being used |
The Romans Tried Aquaducts
wrote in message
... And they are all dead now... i'm pretty sure most individuals who were walking around 2000 years ago are dead now ;-) however, if the point you're making is that empires or civilisations end because they expand too far beyond their own capacity, ability, or political acceptability to run the things they've brought into being, then you're right. all empires fail, & that is always why. i don't think australians want to **** themselves up forever making an outrageous & unsustainable aquaduct system. but also, i think it has zero chance of ever getting up. it's absurd. why are we discussing this? kylie |
The Romans Tried Aquaducts
George W. Frost wrote:
wrote in message ... And they are all dead now... But, some of their aqueducts are still standing and being used 'Aqueducts'! Yes! Aqu*e*ducts! Thank you! -- Trish {|:-} Newcastle, NSW, Australia |
The Romans Tried Aquaducts
"Trish Brown" wrote in message ... George W. Frost wrote: wrote in message ... And they are all dead now... But, some of their aqueducts are still standing and being used 'Aqueducts'! Yes! Aqu*e*ducts! Thank you! -- Trish {|:-} Newcastle, NSW, Australia Sorry Trish, wasn't trying to be facetious, I just typed it as I thought and wasn't concerned with how others spelled it |
The Romans Tried Aquaducts
George W. Frost wrote:
"Trish Brown" wrote in message ... George W. Frost wrote: wrote in message ... And they are all dead now... But, some of their aqueducts are still standing and being used 'Aqueducts'! Yes! Aqu*e*ducts! Thank you! -- Trish {|:-} Newcastle, NSW, Australia Sorry Trish, wasn't trying to be facetious, I just typed it as I thought and wasn't concerned with how others spelled it ;-D Sorry... I'm a retired school teacher and spelling is a hotspot for me. Gives me the nervous hives when I see an error. They don't let you type in red ink on the Internet, sadly. ;-D -- Trish {|:-} Newcastle, NSW, Australia |
The Romans Tried Aquaducts
"George W. Frost" wrote in message ... wrote in message ... And they are all dead now... But, some of their aqueducts are still standing and being used The teachers told us, the Romans built this place They built a wall and a temple, an edge of the empire Garrison town, They lived and they died, they prayed to their gods But the stone gods did not make a sound And their empire crumbled, 'til all that was left Were the stones the workmen found rob |
The Romans Tried Aquaducts
No, the Romans didn't "try" aquaducts - they built and used them for
centuries. http://www.inforoma.it/feature.php?lookup=aqueduct It has been calculated that in imperial times, when the city's population was well over a million, the distribution system was able to provide over one cubic meter of water per day for each inhabitant: more than we are accustomed to use nowadays. Now you realize why the Roman Empire fell didn't you? A host of barbarians, Goths, Vandals, Huns etc.. from the North and East invaded Rome and destroyed the aquaduct system - causing Rome to fall. Looking at our situation today, Indonesia's population is increasing rapidly. 200 million + at the last count. I'd suspect that in about 30 or 50 years time or so, their population will be about 500 million - and they'll come over and take this land. |
The Romans Tried Aquaducts
"Trish Brown" wrote in message
Sorry... I'm a retired school teacher and spelling is a hotspot for me. Gives me the nervous hives when I see an error. They don't let you type in red ink on the Internet, sadly. ;-D I'm not a retired teacher but I too get the collywobbles at some of the more blatant abuses we see. "To" for "too" drives me crackers and sometimes one even sees "two" for one of the others. The American habit of writing/saying "tell someone who could care less" simply astounds me. |
The Romans Tried Aquaducts
FarmI wrote:
"Trish Brown" wrote in message Sorry... I'm a retired school teacher and spelling is a hotspot for me. Gives me the nervous hives when I see an error. They don't let you type in red ink on the Internet, sadly. ;-D I'm not a retired teacher but I too get the collywobbles at some of the more blatant abuses we see. "To" for "too" drives me crackers and sometimes one even sees "two" for one of the others. The American habit of writing/saying "tell someone who could care less" simply astounds me. What about 'I'm going out. Do you want to come with?' Additionally, what about 'prolly' for 'probably' and 'congradulations' for 'congratulations' and 'walla' for 'voilą'? My absolute favourite (NOT) is when people add an apostrophe *every* time a plural is required. Hence, we get piano's, dog's, mice' and womens's!!! Oh, and 1990's instead of 1990s. I can feel my soapbox rising up beneath me... This is why spelling, grammar and punctuation matter. If done correctly, there can be no ambiguity or misunderstanding of what one is trying to say. Look at the poster from earlier in the week (forget his name - the bloke who was using a lot of phone-text forms - you know the one?) His writing was barely understandable. Of course, *he* knew perfectly well what he was trying to say, but few others did: we could only give educated guesses at his exact meaning. I think it's *grand* that grammar and punctuation are slowly being reintroduced in schools! Both my parents left school at age fifteen, yet both were excellent spellers and writers. Today's kids are every bit as smart as that older generation and they *can* learn to spell well. I think it's interesting to note that Latin names for plants are easily understood by most of us and leave no doubt as to a plant's identity when various common names might be in use... -- Trish {|:-} Newcastle, NSW, Australia |
The Romans Tried Aquaducts
"FarmI" ask@itshall be given wrote in message ... "Trish Brown" wrote in message Sorry... I'm a retired school teacher and spelling is a hotspot for me. Gives me the nervous hives when I see an error. They don't let you type in red ink on the Internet, sadly. ;-D I'm not a retired teacher but I too get the collywobbles at some of the more blatant abuses we see. "To" for "too" drives me crackers and sometimes one even sees "two" for one of the others. The American habit of writing/saying "tell someone who could care less" simply astounds me. I use "Call lifeline they care" |
The Romans Tried Aquaducts
"Blackadder XXIV" wrote in message
u... No, the Romans didn't "try" aquaducts - they built and used them for centuries. http://www.inforoma.it/feature.php?lookup=aqueduct It has been calculated that in imperial times, when the city's population was well over a million, the distribution system was able to provide over one cubic meter of water per day for each inhabitant: more than we are accustomed to use nowadays. Now you realize why the Roman Empire fell didn't you? A host of barbarians, Goths, Vandals, Huns etc.. from the North and East invaded Rome and destroyed the aquaduct system - causing Rome to fall. Looking at our situation today, Indonesia's population is increasing rapidly. 200 million + at the last count. I'd suspect that in about 30 or 50 years time or so, their population will be about 500 million - and they'll come over and take this land. everyone else got over the "yellow peril" idea decades ago. kylie |
The Romans Tried Aquaducts
"Trish Brown" wrote in message
... FarmI wrote: "Trish Brown" wrote in message (snip) I can feel my soapbox rising up beneath me... Writing properly out of respect for Trish's incipient conniption & the subject matter involved ;-) This is why spelling, grammar and punctuation matter. If done correctly, there can be no ambiguity or misunderstanding of what one is trying to say. This is what I tell my kids (particularly when double negatives are involved!!!!) - that good grammar simply means _everyone ELSE knows what you've said_. It makes sense & works for us. Look at the poster from earlier in the week (forget his name - the bloke who was using a lot of phone-text forms - you know the one?) His writing was barely understandable. Of course, *he* knew perfectly well what he was trying to say, but few others did: we could only give educated guesses at his exact meaning. I think it's *grand* that grammar and punctuation are slowly being reintroduced in schools! Both my parents left school at age fifteen, yet both were excellent spellers and writers. Today's kids are every bit as smart as that older generation and they *can* learn to spell well. I was of the generation who wasn't formally taught grammar - but mine's fine (as with most of the generation, in fact, luckily). Which doesn't mean I'm not pleased particular attention is being paid these days! Really, people who have good grammar & spelling against all odds are most likely those who read a lot - it's really the only way it happens. Well, being surrounded by people with good grammar also helps, I must say. But, it can be learned, too. DH's grammar was appalling until I insisted he work harder because the way he used to speak just made him sound like a moron, & he's not. He still can't spell to save his life, but that's not really my concern (his customers don't deal with anything he's written; that's mostly my privilege ;-) I think it's interesting to note that Latin names for plants are easily understood by most of us and leave no doubt as to a plant's identity when various common names might be in use... That's exactly right. Everyone agrees there has to be a common denominator (as it were) in language. Kylie P.S. There you go, Farmie!! I told you I know capitals bg! |
The Romans Tried Aquaducts
"0tterbot" wrote in message
... everyone else got over the "yellow peril" idea decades ago. kylie No Kylie, its not paranoia. Its just a rational suggestion. I mean, whose going to stop them? The Indonesians walked into East Timor in the 1970s. And no one stopped them. The only reason they got pushed out - was because of their economic and political problems But give them enough time, and they will have the numbers to not just walk in, but stay and create a nation of their own. Its just demographics. Sure you could put a few thousand in detention. But you can' stop 1% of Indonesia from coming over. Right now, they're population is at 200 million. In 30 years time, apparently it will reach 278 million. If you were an Indonesian, it would make sense to come over to Australia by hook or by crook. It'd be a much better life for them. http://www.iiasa.ac.at/Research/LUC/...gkh1/chap1.htm |
The Romans Tried Aquaducts
wrote in message
... And they are all dead now... No, the Romans didn't "try" aquaducts - they built and used them for centuries. http://www.inforoma.it/feature.php?lookup=aqueduct It has been calculated that in imperial times, when the city's population was well over a million, the distribution system was able to provide over one cubic meter of water per day for each inhabitant: more than we are accustomed to use nowadays. The aquaduct system was physically destroyed by barbarians who invaded the country. |
The Romans Tried Aquaducts
"Trish Brown" wrote in message
FarmI wrote: I'm not a retired teacher but I too get the collywobbles at some of the more blatant abuses we see. "To" for "too" drives me crackers and sometimes one even sees "two" for one of the others. The American habit of writing/saying "tell someone who could care less" simply astounds me. What about 'I'm going out. Do you want to come with?' haven't come across that one, but I doknow what my reaction to that would be :-)) Additionally, what about 'prolly' for 'probably' and 'congradulations' for 'congratulations' and 'walla' for 'voilą'? And 'ass' for 'arse' - I tend to ask why they are into donkey abuse. My absolute favourite (NOT) is when people add an apostrophe *every* time a plural is required. Hence, we get piano's, dog's, mice' and womens's!!! Oh, and 1990's instead of 1990s. Supermarkets seem to be good at that violation. I can feel my soapbox rising up beneath me... This is why spelling, grammar and punctuation matter. If done correctly, there can be no ambiguity or misunderstanding of what one is trying to say. Look at the poster from earlier in the week (forget his name - the bloke who was using a lot of phone-text forms - you know the one?) His writing was barely understandable. Of course, *he* knew perfectly well what he was trying to say, but few others did: we could only give educated guesses at his exact meaning. I think it's *grand* that grammar and punctuation are slowly being reintroduced in schools! Both my parents left school at age fifteen, yet both were excellent spellers and writers. Today's kids are every bit as smart as that older generation and they *can* learn to spell well. Our daughter has always been able to spell well but her firiend whose parents are both teachers has always struggled. I do think that some people are more inclined to be good spellers than others although have absolutely no proof to support that statement, just observation. Did you catch the interesting show in the TV tonight about intelligence testing? It was called "the Battle of the Brains". There was one interesting snippet in that show. In Scotland, they found IQ tests done decades ago by a large number of 11 year olds. They had tracked down many of them (now in their late 70s/early 80s) and ran them through the same test. They found that on average, their IQs had gone up 10 points. I've always said that we (should) learn and continue to develop all through life and I wouldn't mind betting that your parents did just that even if they left school with a good education in just the basic 3Rs. I think it's interesting to note that Latin names for plants are easily understood by most of us and leave no doubt as to a plant's identity when various common names might be in use... :-)) The trouble with Latin names, is that when I use them and I tend to do so a lot, I always seem to be accused of being a snob or a know it all. I used to explain to people that the more interested one in plants and gardening, the more likely one is to seek out the sort of publications that use botanical names and that reading such documents leads to using the correct names. That explantion doesn't seem to wash with many people though so I don't bother doing that so much these days. I just think 'Idiot!' to myself. I'm getting old and intolerant. |
The Romans Tried Aquaducts
"FarmI" ask@itshall be given wrote in message ... "Trish Brown" wrote in message FarmI wrote: :-)) The trouble with Latin names, is that when I use them and I tend to do so a lot, I always seem to be accused of being a snob or a know it all. I used to explain to people that the more interested one in plants and gardening, the more likely one is to seek out the sort of publications that use botanical names and that reading such documents leads to using the correct names. That explantion doesn't seem to wash with many people though so I don't bother doing that so much these days. I just think 'Idiot!' to myself. I'm getting old and intolerant. Not only with Latin names but, even when you use the proper names for a car for example: I own a Ford, would not bring a great response yet, I own a 1969 Ford Mustang 427 Super Cobra Jet fastback, would bring a huge response from the people who know, that the car I have is a special model identified by its proper name. I could be accused of being a snob, but I tend to believe that lucky would be the more appropriate word. However, if you use the proper Latin name for a plant, doesn't to me show snobbery, but shows that you are intelligent enough to know your plants and only passing on the information to others. I went to a nursery with a photo of a plant I wanted to identify and was given a Latin name, which he wrote down, so I looked it up and found it wasn't what he said it was, so I posted a photo on a newsgroup and very helpful people came up with the correct Latin name and the English name for it So, it pays to know the Latin name as well as the English name for any plant |
The Romans Tried Aquaducts
"Blackadder XXIV" wrote in message u... "0tterbot" wrote in message ... everyone else got over the "yellow peril" idea decades ago. kylie No Kylie, its not paranoia. Its just a rational suggestion. I mean, whose going to stop them? The Indonesians walked into East Timor in the 1970s. And no one stopped them. The only reason they got pushed out - was because of their economic and political problems Damn, and here I was thinking that Kylie was talking about the Yellow Peril in Melbourne years ago. But give them enough time, and they will have the numbers to not just walk in, but stay and create a nation of their own. Its just demographics. Sure you could put a few thousand in detention. But you can' stop 1% of Indonesia from coming over. Right now, they're population is at 200 million. In 30 years time, apparently it will reach 278 million. If you were an Indonesian, it would make sense to come over to Australia by hook or by crook. It'd be a much better life for them. http://www.iiasa.ac.at/Research/LUC/...gkh1/chap1.htm The Indonesians are already here and with little Johnny giving them $1 billion for flood relief from the tsunami tells me that teh Govco are bending over backwards to appease them Your reference to 1970 and East Timor reminds me that Papua used to be be called Dutch New Guinea, but is now known as Papua Indonesia when did this happen? |
The Romans Tried Aquaducts
"FarmI" ask@itshall be given wrote in message
news:478a05c9$0$30842$5a62ac22@per-qv1- I think in the past, we had a culture of self-education. People generally yearned to better educate themselves, to learn to be more civil and genteel. People generally had a sense of personal honor and people kept to their word. Unfortunately, this honor system kept on getting abused. Nowadays, we have a culture based on self-gratification and hedonism. Watch MTV for awhile and you'll find out. |
The Romans Tried Aquaducts
"Blackadder XXIV" wrote in message ... "FarmI" ask@itshall be given wrote in message news:478a05c9$0$30842$5a62ac22@per-qv1- I think in the past, we had a culture of self-education. People generally yearned to better educate themselves, to learn to be more civil and genteel. People generally had a sense of personal honor and people kept to their word. Unfortunately, this honor system kept on getting abused. Nowadays, we have a culture based on self-gratification and hedonism. Watch MTV for awhile and you'll find out. You must be a Capitalist I can't afford Pay TV |
The Romans Tried Aquaducts
0tterbot wrote:
I can feel my soapbox rising up beneath me... Writing properly out of respect for Trish's incipient conniption & the subject matter involved ;-) Why thank you, Otbot, dear! ;- snip I was of the generation who wasn't formally taught grammar - but mine's fine (as with most of the generation, in fact, luckily). Which doesn't mean I'm not pleased particular attention is being paid these days! Really, people who have good grammar & spelling against all odds are most likely those who read a lot - it's really the only way it happens. Well, being surrounded by people with good grammar also helps, I must say. But, it can be learned, too. DH's grammar was appalling until I insisted he work harder because the way he used to speak just made him sound like a moron, & he's not. He still can't spell to save his life, but that's not really my concern (his customers don't deal with anything he's written; that's mostly my privilege ;-) I don't want my kids to sound particularly uppah clahss (We're not! We're so working class, it's not funny!) I want them to be eloquent and articulate. I also want them to have easy access to their heritage in all forms of its literature and art. Just the other day, I was quoting 'The Man From Snowy River' at my daughter *who had never heard it recited before*. How can it be that such an icon of the Australian heritage can be left out of today's education system? I can never read that poem without shedding a little tear! Having been a horsewoman for most of my life, I can picture the stripling's wild ride with such clarity, it hurts. I want my kids to be able to share such experiences and also to communicate them to others. I have a theory that it will be far fewer years than we could imagine before kids no longer need to learn to read or write or spell or punctuate because machines will do it for them. The art forms we call 'the novel' and 'the poem' will disappear in favour of video movies and thus all the imagery of the great poets and writers will become antique and therefore no longer have currency. How awful! I think it's interesting to note that Latin names for plants are easily understood by most of us and leave no doubt as to a plant's identity when various common names might be in use... That's exactly right. Everyone agrees there has to be a common denominator (as it were) in language. Kylie P.S. There you go, Farmie!! I told you I know capitals bg! ROTFL! I guess it all comes down to learning about what matters to us, doesn't it? -- Trish {|:-} Newcastle, NSW, Australia |
The Romans Tried Aqueducts
FarmI wrote:
snip And 'ass' for 'arse' - I tend to ask why they are into donkey abuse. I'd love to know where that came from? (Should be 'whence that came' but what the hell!) ;- snip Our daughter has always been able to spell well but her friend whose parents are both teachers has always struggled. I do think that some people are more inclined to be good spellers than others although have absolutely no proof to support that statement, just observation. Yes. Some people just have that kind of memory for words and constructions. It doesn't mean that others shouldn't try, though. Misspelling a difficult word is always forgivable, but misspelling common, everyday words is just laziness. Did you catch the interesting show in the TV tonight about intelligence testing? It was called "the Battle of the Brains". There was one interesting snippet in that show. In Scotland, they found IQ tests done decades ago by a large number of 11 year olds. They had tracked down many of them (now in their late 70s/early 80s) and ran them through the same test. They found that on average, their IQs had gone up 10 points. No, I missed it unfortunately. I think these things all come down to a thirst for knowing things. People who like to know stuff never cease learning, IMHO. I've always said that we (should) learn and continue to develop all through life and I wouldn't mind betting that your parents did just that even if they left school with a good education in just the basic 3Rs. Oh yes! My Dad could add a column of figures in his head much quicker than I could do it on a calculator (and he always described himself as 'only a butcher'). My Mum is 86 and she keeps her dictionary and her atlas nearby at all times. It irritates her that political boundaries keep changing and she has to keep re-learning the names and cities of all the countries mentioned in the daily news. :-D I think it's interesting to note that Latin names for plants are easily understood by most of us and leave no doubt as to a plant's identity when various common names might be in use... :-)) The trouble with Latin names, is that when I use them and I tend to do so a lot, I always seem to be accused of being a snob or a know it all. I used to explain to people that the more interested one in plants and gardening, the more likely one is to seek out the sort of publications that use botanical names and that reading such documents leads to using the correct names. That explantion doesn't seem to wash with many people though so I don't bother doing that so much these days. I just think 'Idiot!' to myself. I'm getting old and intolerant. Ah, join the club! Whenever we go bush, I spend most of my day walking along with my nose either on the ground looking at plants or in the air looking at birds. My continual muttering of Latin names used to irritate the family, but they've learned to tolerate it and even join in on the easy ones. Of course it must be annoying to those who don't know the Latin, but it's just my way of consolidating them in my mind and making sure I continue to remember them. I majored in Taxonomy at Uni and it's still hugely important to me to be able to classify things. LOL! (Also, I think it's pretty neat that I'm using names assigned by people like Sir Joseph Banks and Carl Solander over two hundred years ago...) -- Trish {|:-} Newcastle, NSW, Australia |
The Romans Tried Aquaducts
"George W. Frost" wrote in message
news:tcAij.2818$421.1225@news- You must be a Capitalist I can't afford Pay TV Its on the regular channels occasionally. You can try ABC's Rage. Its on in the weekends. |
The Romans Tried Aquaducts
Blackadder XXIV wrote:
Looking at our situation today, Indonesia's population is increasing rapidly. 200 million + at the last count. I'd suspect that in about 30 or 50 years time or so, their population will be about 500 million - and they'll come over and take this land. lol, let me see if I understand this OT garbage. Millions of Indonesians are going to leave their land of water surplus to suddenly invade a land of very little water. Not to mentionthe fact that they some how have to fit 500 million Indonesians into that place in the first place. |
The Romans Tried Aquaducts
Blackadder XXIV wrote:
The aquaduct system was physically destroyed by barbarians who invaded the country. Sure? The country had died anyway well before the barbarians decided they'd had enough of their lands being pillaged by yhe romans and decided to return the favour. |
The Romans Tried Aquaducts
"0tterbot" wrote in message news:WXkij.2641
P.S. There you go, Farmie!! I told you I know capitals bg! Well done Otter! Now you just have to use them, ya slack tart! :-)) BTW, could you e-mail me please? moura at bluemaxx and add the country code at the end. Fran |
The Romans Tried Aquaducts
"Trish Brown" wrote in message
Just the other day, I was quoting 'The Man From Snowy River' at my daughter *who had never heard it recited before*. How can it be that such an icon of the Australian heritage can be left out of today's education system? I can never read that poem without shedding a little tear! Having been a horsewoman for most of my life, I can picture the stripling's wild ride with such clarity, it hurts. I want my kids to be able to share such experiences and also to communicate them to others. Aaaaaah! A woman after my own heart! Not the horsewoman part, I'm an indifferent rider, and always have been even though I love horses and sadly on this farm they are no more. However, I do love poetry and the mere mention of the Man from Snowy River can easily bring a tear to my eye. My mother could recite poetry till the cows come home and I can remember many a night when we would start to do the washing up and she would start to recite. Lovely old poems like "Here she goes and there she goes", "King John and the Abbot of Canterbury", "The Man from Snowy River", "The Geebung Polo Club", "The man from Ironbark", and a personla favourite "Pardon the son of Reprieve". You've brought back some lovely memories. Mum's memory was phenomenal but just sometimes it would fail her, so out would come the poetry books while she looked up the small bit that had slipped her mind. Once reminded off she would go again, but the poetry books would draw her back till she spotted another old favourite and then the washing up would be forgotten and while the water slowly congealed she's recite poetry to us. This would go on for hours until she'd suddenly notice the time and we would be packed off to bed while she had to continue the washing up "alone and unassisted". She too had been a wonderful horsewoman in her youth and since doing the family history I've since learned that according to old family members,"there wasn't a horse that she couldn't ride". I never knew that as a child. I have a theory that it will be far fewer years than we could imagine before kids no longer need to learn to read or write or spell or punctuate because machines will do it for them. The art forms we call 'the novel' and 'the poem' will disappear in favour of video movies and thus all the imagery of the great poets and writers will become antique and therefore no longer have currency. How awful! Shudder! I hope not. |
The Romans Tried Aquaducts
"George W. Frost" wrote in message
"FarmI" ask@itshall be given wrote in message :-)) The trouble with Latin names, is that when I use them and I tend to do so a lot, I always seem to be accused of being a snob or a know it all. I used to explain to people that the more interested one in plants and gardening, the more likely one is to seek out the sort of publications that use botanical names and that reading such documents leads to using the correct names. That explantion doesn't seem to wash with many people though so I don't bother doing that so much these days. I just think 'Idiot!' to myself. I'm getting old and intolerant. Not only with Latin names but, even when you use the proper names for a car for example: I own a Ford, would not bring a great response yet, I own a 1969 Ford Mustang 427 Super Cobra Jet fastback, would bring a huge response from the people who know, that the car I have is a special model identified by its proper name. I have fond memories of a Ford Mustang of about that vintage :-)) Now we have lots of old Land Rovers which I find hard to get excited about but we do have a few other old cars which I rather like. I could be accused of being a snob, but I tend to believe that lucky would be the more appropriate word. However, if you use the proper Latin name for a plant, doesn't to me show snobbery, but shows that you are intelligent enough to know your plants and only passing on the information to others. I went to a nursery with a photo of a plant I wanted to identify and was given a Latin name, which he wrote down, so I looked it up and found it wasn't what he said it was, so I posted a photo on a newsgroup and very helpful people came up with the correct Latin name and the English name for it So, it pays to know the Latin name as well as the English name for any plant I find the uk.rec.gardening ng is a good one for seeing people who really know their Latin names -leaves us Aussies for dead. I also notice that about the British mags too which is why I always buy "The English Garden". Their plant info is far better than any of the Aussie mags but i do sometimes smile to myself. I was reading one article about Romneya and the article said that it could become invasive. Given how sodding dry it's been here for so many years, I thought "I wish!". |
The Romans Tried Aqueducts
"Trish Brown" wrote in message
(snip) I think these things all come down to a thirst for knowing things. People who like to know stuff never cease learning, IMHO. I thinks so too. Curiosity is a wonderful learning aid. I've always said that we (should) learn and continue to develop all through life and I wouldn't mind betting that your parents did just that even if they left school with a good education in just the basic 3Rs. Oh yes! My Dad could add a column of figures in his head much quicker than I could do it on a calculator (and he always described himself as 'only a butcher'). My Mum is 86 and she keeps her dictionary and her atlas nearby at all times. It irritates her that political boundaries keep changing and she has to keep re-learning the names and cities of all the countries mentioned in the daily news. :-D I know jsut what she means! I think it's interesting to note that Latin names for plants are easily understood by most of us and leave no doubt as to a plant's identity when various common names might be in use... :-)) The trouble with Latin names, is that when I use them and I tend to do so a lot, I always seem to be accused of being a snob or a know it all. I used to explain to people that the more interested one in plants and gardening, the more likely one is to seek out the sort of publications that use botanical names and that reading such documents leads to using the correct names. That explantion doesn't seem to wash with many people though so I don't bother doing that so much these days. I just think 'Idiot!' to myself. I'm getting old and intolerant. Ah, join the club! Whenever we go bush, I spend most of my day walking along with my nose either on the ground looking at plants or in the air looking at birds. My continual muttering of Latin names used to irritate the family, but they've learned to tolerate it and even join in on the easy ones. Of course it must be annoying to those who don't know the Latin, but it's just my way of consolidating them in my mind and making sure I continue to remember them. I majored in Taxonomy at Uni and it's still hugely important to me to be able to classify things. LOL! I wish I could classify things! it must be wonderful to be able to do that! About as much as I can manage is to get out my Horticultural Dictionary and look at individual leaf shapes and tree shapes and then try to identify things from there. Very unsatisfactory and frustrating. You might be interested in a book that I have found to be simply fascinating. It's called "Life on forty acres" by Barry P. Moore. He trained as a chemist but has an interest in biology and entomology and I think his wife was a botanist. Tragically she was killed. This book is about his 40 acre block and I wouldn't have believed that anyone could make a book about 40 acres not too distant from Canberra, the least bit interesting. If anyone had asked me, I'd have descibed it as scrofulous boring country but that isn't how he sees it or describes it. He covers everything on his block from the smallest insect to the Wedge tailed eagle. And in such superb detail. I never thought I would be interested in insects but he writes about them so well that I now look at bugs in my own garden with a magnifying glass. (Also, I think it's pretty neat that I'm using names assigned by people like Sir Joseph Banks and Carl Solander over two hundred years ago...) :-)) A true link with our past. |
The Romans Tried Aquaducts
Kylie
Ooops. Sorry Kylie, forgot to mention to put the 'dot com' in before the country code! Fran |
The Romans Tried Aqueducts
FarmI wrote:
I wish I could classify things! it must be wonderful to be able to do that! About as much as I can manage is to get out my Horticultural Dictionary and look at individual leaf shapes and tree shapes and then try to identify things from there. Very unsatisfactory and frustrating. It doesn't get better than that. What makes it easier is just doing it frequently so you learn a few names. |
The Romans Tried Aquaducts
"George W. Frost" writes:
"Trish Brown" wrote in message ... George W. Frost wrote: wrote in message ... And they are all dead now... But, some of their aqueducts are still standing and being used 'Aqueducts'! Yes! Aqu*e*ducts! Thank you! -- Trish {|:-} Newcastle, NSW, Australia Sorry Trish, wasn't trying to be facetious, I just typed it as I thought and wasn't concerned with how others spelled it aqua-plane aque-duct aqui-culture All too confusing. Let's standardise and have them all begin "aqua". -- John Savage (my news address is not valid for email) |
The Romans Tried Aquaducts
"Trish Brown" wrote in message
... (snip) Just the other day, I was quoting 'The Man From Snowy River' at my daughter *who had never heard it recited before*. How can it be that such an icon of the Australian heritage can be left out of today's education system? 1: we have many "education systems", not just one :-) 2: it would certainly feature in some classes, but not others. the list of available literature for schools is massive - from within that, teachers decide. 3: i've heard it recited before & tbh, it does nothing for me. (one person's classic is another's waste of time, it's just how it is :-) 99% of people who know me cannot BELIEVE what my favourite book is. usually, i can't believe theirs, either g I can never read that poem without shedding a little tear! Having been a horsewoman for most of my life, I can picture the stripling's wild ride with such clarity, it hurts. I want my kids to be able to share such experiences and also to communicate them to others. I have a theory that it will be far fewer years than we could imagine before kids no longer need to learn to read or write or spell or punctuate because machines will do it for them. why would anyone make a machine to do that if _nobody_ knows (nor presumably, cares)? that doesn't make sense. The art forms we call 'the novel' and 'the poem' will disappear in favour of video movies and thus all the imagery of the great poets and writers will become antique and therefore no longer have currency. How awful! it would be awful, but frankly i think you're being a little alarmist. the death of novels & poems has been predicted but it is doubtful it will happen (for one thing, if would-be video artists don't know the written word, how would they be able to read the instructions? ;-) again tbh, i can foresee worse than the disappearance of poems (which i generally consider to be one of the worst forms of self-indulgence ;-) but even so, poets just keep pumping them out! certainly the nature of performance and storytelling changes (bards are a rare thing these days) but generally what we've always had & presumably will continue to have are just different ways of people telling their stories to others. the novel is nowhere near dead - there have never been as many works of fiction (or for that matter, non-fiction) available to so many people at once. mass literacy has brought that about & people do value their literacy. i'd say the novel replaced bards & gossips & "wise men" of old, video is akin to watching a play or a dance (although we still have plays & dance performances - & again, more than ever). lastly, not all of the "great" poets & writers really stand up these days anyway. sometimes, things just lose currency. there's always a hardcore of nerds who care about Brilliant Writer X, but not everything ages well. shrug. imo, the truly remarkable thing about shakespeare (for example) is that it never loses currency (or hasn't so far, anyway). most of his contemporaries clearly didn't have what he had - they've lost currency. it happens. not to make excuses, but i've tried & tried to read some stuff (the iliad, for e.g.) & just find the style so inadequate compared to people who came later. the bible is another good example - some bits are just tops, & others so very, very ordinary (all right, let's be frank - badly written, outlandish and silly) that they just don't pass muster & simply wouldn't be published in modern, more discerning times. I think it's interesting to note that Latin names for plants are easily understood by most of us and leave no doubt as to a plant's identity when various common names might be in use... That's exactly right. Everyone agrees there has to be a common denominator (as it were) in language. Kylie P.S. There you go, Farmie!! I told you I know capitals bg! ROTFL! I guess it all comes down to learning about what matters to us, doesn't it? gasp! i've forgotten my capitals for this one!! thinking about gum trees, many of them have 5-10 "common" names. the place of latin names (for the common folk) is to make clear exactly which one you're referring to. also, lots of plants are _only_ known by their latin names. i think people who are sensitive about others using latin names have a generalised anxiety you can't address or change for them :-) kylie |
The Romans Tried Aquaducts
"FarmI" ask@itshall be given wrote in message
... "0tterbot" wrote in message news:WXkij.2641 P.S. There you go, Farmie!! I told you I know capitals bg! Well done Otter! Now you just have to use them, ya slack tart! :-)) that's Slack Tart to you!!!!!! BTW, could you e-mail me please? moura at bluemaxx and add the country code at the end. ok! i think i have seen your gate. i can't remember where it is, though. kylie Fran |
The Romans Tried Aquaducts
"FarmI" ask@itshall be given wrote in message
... And 'ass' for 'arse' - I tend to ask why they are into donkey abuse. something that cracks me right up is: have you heard that (yank) expression, that someone is a jackass? well, a jackass is meant, of course, to be jackASS. but i've heard a few youngsters saying jackarse, because they want to use the word but know how ridiculous "ass" (as in arse) sounds in our accent! gosh it makes me laugh. (internally, so as not to appear rude). i don't worry as jackass is undoubtedly a short lived fad that will go away. i'm not quite sure what a jackass is anyway. being an australian lover of cricket, i have to wonder if it's related to a monkey or a *******. g! kylie |
The Romans Tried Aquaducts
Ooo! What a great post! Thanks for the considered reply! :-)
0tterbot wrote: 1: we have many "education systems", not just one :-) Yep! I'm in touch with other educators in every state and most share my paranoia. (That is, 'most of those whom I know', not 'most of those who exist'.) 2: it would certainly feature in some classes, but not others. the list of available literature for schools is massive - from within that, teachers decide. Yep! My point is that classic Oz literature from Banjo Paterson, Henry Kendall, CJ Dennis and so on ought to have a permanent place in schools because they reflect a period of our development. I'm pretty fond of John Marsden and other modern authors/poets too, but they don't come from the pioneering era. Ever read Ethel Turner's books? They describe pretty accurately what Oz kids did at the turn of the last century. We oughtn't to pretend our history didn't happen! 3: i've heard it recited before & tbh, it does nothing for me. (one person's classic is another's waste of time, it's just how it is :-) 99% of people who know me cannot BELIEVE what my favourite book is. usually, i can't believe theirs, either g Fair enough! Not gonna argue there! What *is* your favourite book, just out of interest? I love finding a good read through other people! :-) snip I have a theory that it will be far fewer years than we could imagine before kids no longer need to learn to read or write or spell or punctuate because machines will do it for them. why would anyone make a machine to do that if _nobody_ knows (nor presumably, cares)? that doesn't make sense. Well, I've been in the computer industry on and off for - geez! - nearly thirty years now! I've watched 'WYSIWYG', 'multi media', 'multi tasking' and 'the information superhighway' arrive and take hold. I've seen storage media change from 12" floppies that held 4k of info give way to terabytes of storage. I've learned that technology does have massive power to change what we do and how we do it. Kids today don't need to spell, for example. The language they use to communicate on their phones and MSN bears little resemblance to accepted English, yet they understand each other perfectly. It's utilitarian, isn't it? Voice recognition has taken a long time to come along in a useful form, but it's nearly there. I can see a day when it'll no longer be necessary to write what you want to say. Your computer will 'hear' your voice through supermicrophones and transmit your info to someone else who will simply listen to it and save it in audio format. Where's the need to write anything? Just a suspicion I have... The art forms we call 'the novel' and 'the poem' will disappear in favour of video movies and thus all the imagery of the great poets and writers will become antique and therefore no longer have currency. How awful! it would be awful, but frankly i think you're being a little alarmist. the death of novels & poems has been predicted but it is doubtful it will happen (for one thing, if would-be video artists don't know the written word, how would they be able to read the instructions? ;-) again tbh, i can foresee worse than the disappearance of poems (which i generally consider to be one of the worst forms of self-indulgence ;-) but even so, poets just keep pumping them out! certainly the nature of performance and storytelling changes (bards are a rare thing these days) but generally what we've always had & presumably will continue to have are just different ways of people telling their stories to others. the novel is nowhere near dead - there have never been as many works of fiction (or for that matter, non-fiction) available to so many people at once. mass literacy has brought that about & people do value their literacy. i'd say the novel replaced bards & gossips & "wise men" of old, video is akin to watching a play or a dance (although we still have plays & dance performances - & again, more than ever). Yep! I hear what you're saying and respectfully keep my own counsel. :-) D'you happen to like classical ballet? I think poetry is very like ballet: it's stylised and has boundaries and rules, that's all. Not everyone can write a poem; not everyone can perform a great ballet, but they do have standards of excellence and neither is everyone's cup of tea... Among my favourite poets: Paul Simon (seventies writer of songs: Simon and Garfunkel) stands far out there! Also, Till Lindemann of Rammstein, an East German group. lastly, not all of the "great" poets & writers really stand up these days anyway. sometimes, things just lose currency. there's always a hardcore of nerds who care about Brilliant Writer X, but not everything ages well. shrug. imo, the truly remarkable thing about shakespeare (for example) is that it never loses currency (or hasn't so far, anyway). most of his contemporaries clearly didn't have what he had - they've lost currency. it happens. not to make excuses, but i've tried & tried to read some stuff (the iliad, for e.g.) & just find the style so inadequate compared to people who came later. Hmmm... I think I can see your point. I have to say, though, that 'great' writers such as Shakespeare, Dickens, Dostoyevsky etc etc are often an acquired taste and come with age. I only managed to read 'The Lord of the Rings' (generally regarded as one of the great modern classics from the Days of My Youth) by putting it in the dunny and reading it in short bursts. I can't *stand* Tolkein's inflated, self-conscious writing style. the bible is another good example - some bits are just tops, & others so very, very ordinary (all right, let's be frank - badly written, outlandish and silly) that they just don't pass muster & simply wouldn't be published in modern, more discerning times. LOL! I've often wondered what was the drug of choice among those ancient prophets. I think the Bible stands alone, though, since it's pretty much unique in its origins, history and purpose. It takes a certain kind of mind to want to wade through much of its allegory and ancient forms. gasp! i've forgotten my capitals for this one!! thinking about gum trees, many of them have 5-10 "common" names. the place of latin names (for the common folk) is to make clear exactly which one you're referring to. also, lots of plants are _only_ known by their latin names. i think people who are sensitive about others using latin names have a generalised anxiety you can't address or change for them :-) kylie Yeah, but did you know the taxonomy of gum trees has recently been changed? Just to upset all our applecarts, I s'pose. In fact, a friend who is a botanist in Texas broke the news to me. I was talking to her about Angophoras and she gently corrected me, saying 'You mean 'Corymbia', don't you?' Apparently, the whole family Myrtaceae has been revamped and 'fixed' so that many former Eucalyptus species now come under 'Corymbia'. I think there's more info on the SGAP website. Ack! Why do they do these things to us? Again, thanks for a really enjoyable post and interesting point of view! :-D -- Trish {|:-} Newcastle, NSW, Australia |
The Romans Tried Aquaducts
In article ,
"0tterbot" wrote: shrug. imo, the truly remarkable thing about shakespeare (for example) is that it never loses currency (or hasn't so far, anyway). most of his contemporaries clearly didn't have what he had - they've lost currency. it happens. not to make excuses, but i've tried & tried to read some stuff (the iliad, for e.g.) & just find the style so inadequate compared to people who came later. the bible is another good example - some bits are just tops, & others so very, very ordinary (all right, let's be frank - badly written, outlandish and silly) that they just don't pass muster & simply wouldn't be published in modern, more discerning times. The two books you're complaining about are translations, and a lot depends on the skill of the translator. AFAIK most modern translations of the Bible have not set beauty as an objective, unlike the translators of the KJV. Most set a great deal of store on accuracy of translation (resulting in an academically-useful but wooden text) or accuracy of vibe (where a lot of the 'foreign' bits are made less foreign -- my favourite example is a Yank translation where King Saul "went to the bathroom" in the cave!) No doubt translators of the Iliad have the same problems. Me, I love poetry. But it has to be something that *sounds* good. Most hip new poetry is too hip to last imo. -- Chookie -- Sydney, Australia (Replace "foulspambegone" with "optushome" to reply) http://chookiesbackyard.blogspot.com/ |
The Romans Tried Aquaducts
"Trish Brown" wrote in message
... Ooo! What a great post! Thanks for the considered reply! :-) 0tterbot wrote: 1: we have many "education systems", not just one :-) Yep! I'm in touch with other educators in every state and most share my paranoia. (That is, 'most of those whom I know', not 'most of those who exist'.) Well then, i probably think you're _all_ worrying a bit over nothing :-) 2: it would certainly feature in some classes, but not others. the list of available literature for schools is massive - from within that, teachers decide. Yep! My point is that classic Oz literature from Banjo Paterson, Henry Kendall, CJ Dennis and so on ought to have a permanent place in schools because they reflect a period of our development. I see. I don't necessarily disagree. (I LOVE "Mulga Bill's Bicycle"!!!!) but really, I don't think it's the sort of thing you could spend an entire term on, or anything like that. Certainly those things have historical significance. Then again, so do other things. How does one choose? One thing that drives me a bit bats is everyone dumping on schools & school kids re the curriculum. I asked a recent year-12 what he studied in English for his HSC & was promptly gobsmacked. They did 10-odd different things which seemed to include a spot of comparitive media studies thrown in. I didn't do my HSC (dropped out) but at my school you'd do one "biggie" a term. One Shakespeare play, one English classic of some sort (sadly, Jane Austen [blurghhh!] seems to have featured heavily), and something "modern" (perhaps from the 1960s or 70s) & then you must have had to revise, or something - truthfully, I only remember doing one thing in year 11 but we must have filled up the time somehow with soemthing boring I've forgotten about. Same with my kids' schedule for primary school - they cover so much in the curriculum while at the same age I did virtually nothing in the same time frame! So when people are saying kids "should" be doing this or that, I would ask "what the hell do you want them to drop so they can fit it in?!" We oughtn't to pretend our history didn't happen! I'm not sure that they do. But equally, we can't know our history through literature particularly well anyway - it was all written by white men. :-) Fair enough! Not gonna argue there! What *is* your favourite book, just out of interest? I love finding a good read through other people! :-) It's "Wuthering Heights". Now shaddup & stop laughing g why would anyone make a machine to do that if _nobody_ knows (nor presumably, cares)? that doesn't make sense. Well, I've been in the computer industry on and off for - geez! - nearly thirty years now! I've watched 'WYSIWYG', 'multi media', 'multi tasking' and 'the information superhighway' arrive and take hold. I've seen storage media change from 12" floppies that held 4k of info give way to terabytes of storage. I've learned that technology does have massive power to change what we do and how we do it. Kids today don't need to spell, for example. The language they use to communicate on their phones and MSN bears little resemblance to accepted English, yet they understand each other perfectly. It's utilitarian, isn't it? But this is partly what set this thread going - the dude who wanted cuttings didn't write "properly" for a newsgroup - he wrote sms-style. He didn't write it "wrong" so much as he had the _context_ all wrong. I rarely send sms because I just plain cannot be bothered - it's just so tedious to me, so when I do, I abbreviate as much as I can. (Almost everyone does.) BUT - if a person doesn't know a word, I can't see that it can be abbreviated sensibly either. Everyone who uses sms has already had a good (hopefully) grounding in Proper English (which changes with time anyway) beforehand, otherwise the whole system falls down. People really do go on & on about this & I'm not saying you're being silly or anything, but I cannot see the risk of people "no longer" using good spelling or whatnot. In Australia, literacy is very near total - unlike, say, 50 years ago when it simply was not. Literate people play with language, deliberately. What you see with sms is really just a by-product of mass literacy, in my view. It doesn't undermine or particularly effect the standard English that everyone has to use in daily life if they want to participate in society. IIUC, Braille (novels, say) for good (older) readers is very, very abbreviated, otherwise things would simply take too long to get through (the hand being so much slower than the eye), but until you know what is being abbreviated, you need to learn full spellings in order to understand the abbreviations. If I've got that wrong about Braille I am happy to be corrected, but that's a good example, isn't it? Voice recognition has taken a long time to come along in a useful form, but it's nearly there. I can see a day when it'll no longer be necessary to write what you want to say. Your computer will 'hear' your voice through supermicrophones and transmit your info to someone else who will simply listen to it and save it in audio format. Where's the need to write anything? Just a suspicion I have... Sounds a bit like that wacky modern invention, the "telephone". g! Gawd, I sound like a technophile when really I'm a bit of a Luddite - but I do strongly think people get worried about literacy somewhat unduly - instead of enjoying the effects of mass literacy, they see it as further excuse to get into a panic about the country going down the toilet. Yep! I hear what you're saying and respectfully keep my own counsel. :-) D'you happen to like classical ballet? I think poetry is very like ballet: it's stylised and has boundaries and rules, that's all. Not everyone can write a poem; not everyone can perform a great ballet, but they do have standards of excellence and neither is everyone's cup of tea... I rather do like classical ballet although not to the point of going to see it. I approve of its existence :-) And I _did_ very much approve of poetry when I was younger, but I just got over it. It's not that I think poetry is bad or irrelevent - it's more part of a general gripe of mine about people faffing about with the "arts" as though it makes them a better person, when in truth the vast majority of them simply don't have enough talent or relevence & are just being utterly self-indulgent. Among my favourite poets: Paul Simon (seventies writer of songs: Simon and Garfunkel) stands far out there! Also, Till Lindemann of Rammstein, an East German group. Ja, Rammstein. Cookie Monster got a new job & that's what it was G! sorry ;-) I think you bring up an interesting thing, though - poetry set to music (i.e. a "song") will always have a far greater audience. I think there's a human need for song but no corresponding great need for poetry. Or so it seems to me. Hmmm... I think I can see your point. I have to say, though, that 'great' writers such as Shakespeare, Dickens, Dostoyevsky etc etc are often an acquired taste and come with age. I only managed to read 'The Lord of the Rings' (generally regarded as one of the great modern classics from the Days of My Youth) by putting it in the dunny and reading it in short bursts. I can't *stand* Tolkein's inflated, self-conscious writing style. Um, I'd just say that Tolkein just isn't that good & be done with it. :-) I wouldn't consider it a modern classic whatsoever. LOTR does have mass nerd-appeal, though. Some things just do - it defies explanation & is hard to pick. The others? Shakespeare - excellent. Dickens - infantile. Dostoyevsky - actually pretty readable if that's your thing. We could go on. I'm sure we agree that there's something for everyone out there! :-) LOL! I've often wondered what was the drug of choice among those ancient prophets. I think the Bible stands alone, though, since it's pretty much unique in its origins, history and purpose. It takes a certain kind of mind to want to wade through much of its allegory and ancient forms. I find it pretty interesting & i'm NOT a believer. & yes, mostly it's interesting due to historical significance - not for its own sake. So that's probably a different category again. But do I think it could be published now? No - just not good enough. I'm pretty sure the Revelation is a record of either a drug experience or a psychiatric event :-) The bible doesn't stand alone so much as it stands with other religious "classics". They're all a bit mental, but as you say, it's just a different case. Yeah, but did you know the taxonomy of gum trees has recently been changed? Yes. But fortunately, having known almost nothing about any of them under the old classifications, the new ones therefore don't bother me!! :-D Just to upset all our applecarts, I s'pose. In fact, a friend who is a botanist in Texas broke the news to me. I was talking to her about Angophoras and she gently corrected me, saying 'You mean 'Corymbia', don't you?' Apparently, the whole family Myrtaceae has been revamped and 'fixed' so that many former Eucalyptus species now come under 'Corymbia'. I think there's more info on the SGAP website. Ack! Why do they do these things to us? Again, thanks for a really enjoyable post and interesting point of view! :-D Well, you too!! We are very on-topic here, as a rule!! Kylie |
The Romans Tried Aquaducts
"Chookie" wrote in message
news:ehrebeniuk-A0DDC4.23363817012008@news... The two books you're complaining about was i complaining? i thought i was just airing my views! sorry about that. are translations, and a lot depends on the skill of the translator. excellent point. AFAIK most modern translations of the Bible have not set beauty as an objective, unlike the translators of the KJV. i like the kjv. there IS no other bible!!! Most set a great deal of store on accuracy of translation (resulting in an academically-useful but wooden text) or accuracy of vibe (where a lot of the 'foreign' bits are made less foreign -- my favourite example is a Yank translation where King Saul "went to the bathroom" in the cave!) oh noooooooooooooooooooo...! i don't suppose you happen to know what they did about onan "spilling his seed upon the ground" **. (one shudders to think!) No doubt translators of the Iliad have the same problems. Me, I love poetry. But it has to be something that *sounds* good. Most hip new poetry is too hip to last imo. probably, in the 16th century (etc) there was a lot of hip poetry that didn't last :-) kylie ** i must have been about 25 before i even worked out what that _meant_!! |
The Romans Tried Aquaducts
"0tterbot" wrote in message
i'm not quite sure what a jackass is anyway. being an australian lover of cricket, i have to wonder if it's related to a monkey or a *******. g! Jack = male, ass = donkey as opposed to a female donkey which is a Jenny, but I don't think that there is such as thing as a Jennyass. |
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