A couple days ago I made the mistake of putting my tomato seedlings out
on a windowsill for direct sunlight, and a few hours later I discovered
they were all withered. (We've had a lot of sunlight here lately in
Portland, Oregon.)

I immediately removed them, and enclosed them in a humidity-containing
package (it used to be a doughnut package but I filled it up halfway
with potting soil), and hid it away.

The next day, 10% of the seedlings began to perk up again.

If I buy a photometer, how much light should tomato seedlings be exposed
to?

Is the real problem loss of water instead of too much sunlight?

I'd speculate that it's not too much light, but too much heat. Did they get
dry while in the sunlight?
Thomas
"Matthew Montchalin" wrote in message
...
A couple days ago I made the mistake of putting my tomato seedlings out
on a windowsill for direct sunlight, and a few hours later I discovered
they were all withered. (We've had a lot of sunlight here lately in
Portland, Oregon.)

I immediately removed them, and enclosed them in a humidity-containing
package (it used to be a doughnut package but I filled it up halfway
with potting soil), and hid it away.

The next day, 10% of the seedlings began to perk up again.

If I buy a photometer, how much light should tomato seedlings be exposed
to?

Is the real problem loss of water instead of too much sunlight?

"Matthew Montchalin" wrote in message
...
A couple days ago I made the mistake of putting my tomato seedlings out
on a windowsill for direct sunlight, and a few hours later I discovered
they were all withered. (We've had a lot of sunlight here lately in
Portland, Oregon.)

I immediately removed them, and enclosed them in a humidity-containing
package (it used to be a doughnut package but I filled it up halfway
with potting soil), and hid it away.

The next day, 10% of the seedlings began to perk up again.

If I buy a photometer, how much light should tomato seedlings be exposed
to?

Is the real problem loss of water instead of too much sunlight?

Seedlings should be gradually exposed to direct sunlight, which means
initially keeping them off windowsills unless you can construct something to
filter the light.

Seems a little early for starting tomato plants. How early in the
Portland/s growing season does the overnight temperature stay above 55°F?

Thomas wrote:
|I'd speculate that it's not too much light, but too much heat. Did
|they get dry while in the sunlight?

Yes, they dried up. The seedlings were about 2 inches tall but they
all fell over and withered up. After I returned them to the dark,
and controlled their humidity, 10 percent of them perked up again.

I think I ought to buy a photometer.

Matthew Montchalin wrote:
Thomas wrote:
|I'd speculate that it's not too much light, but too much heat. Did
|they get dry while in the sunlight?

Yes, they dried up. The seedlings were about 2 inches tall but they
all fell over and withered up. After I returned them to the dark,
and controlled their humidity, 10 percent of them perked up again.

I think I ought to buy a photometer.


My tomatoes were started from seed in a 5-gallon bucket. They were then
placed next to the patio door (south window) and allowed to grow.
There's probably about 2 feet of space between the window and the
plants. The more sun they get, the taller they grow. The more water
they get the more they grow. I'm looking for tomatoes sometime in March.

I don't think you can have too much light for plants, but that could be
an interesting experiment.

Oh and don't rule the other tomatoes out yet. They may come back "from
the dead." Last year we had about 18 do that. (That was supposed to be
the whole planting too. We replaced them and up come the original
plants. They were a little better established, though.)

Puckdropper
--
www.uncreativelabs.net

Old computers are getting to be a lost art. Here at Uncreative Labs, we
still enjoy using the old computers. Sometimes we want to see how far a
particular system can go, other times we use a stock system to remind
ourselves of what we once had.

To email me directly, send a message to puckdropper (at) fastmail.fm

--
http://home.earthlink.net/~billbernice1/
Includes "Poems of the Sea"
"Matthew Montchalin" wrote in message
...
A couple days ago I made the mistake of putting my tomato seedlings out
on a windowsill for direct sunlight, and a few hours later I discovered
they were all withered. (We've had a lot of sunlight here lately in
Portland, Oregon.)

I immediately removed them, and enclosed them in a humidity-containing
package (it used to be a doughnut package but I filled it up halfway
with potting soil), and hid it away.

The next day, 10% of the seedlings began to perk up again.

If I buy a photometer, how much light should tomato seedlings be exposed
to?

Is the real problem loss of water instead of too much
sunlight?

Hi, Matthew, I havn't talked with you in a while. I don't think you need a
photometer. If you are interested in that aspect of plant growth, you need only
be aware of the average solar radiation for Portland (45.6 deg.N.). In February
it is 1.9 kWh/sq m/day. as opposed to July when it is 6.3 kWh/sq m/day on a
horizontal plate. I am near New Orleans where the solar radiation is stronger.
I have my tomato plants in a south window sill and they are about 4 inches high.
I also have cucumber plants and they are very leafy. My plants are planted in
plastic cups with holes in the bottom and sitting nn a tray with about 1/2 inch
of water. If you are interested in solar radiation intensity per day you can
input "Solar radiation for Portland, Oregon into Google" and find a number of
data sources near you such as the University of Oregon.

Nice "seeing" you
Bill

il Fri, 18 Feb 2005 15:11:45 -0800, Matthew Montchalin ha scritto:

A couple days ago I made the mistake of putting my tomato seedlings out
on a windowsill for direct sunlight, and a few hours later I discovered
they were all withered. (We've had a lot of sunlight here lately in
Portland, Oregon.)

I immediately removed them, and enclosed them in a humidity-containing
package (it used to be a doughnut package but I filled it up halfway
with potting soil), and hid it away.

The next day, 10% of the seedlings began to perk up again.

If I buy a photometer, how much light should tomato seedlings be exposed
to?

Is the real problem loss of water instead of too much sunlight?

It can be too much sunlight and its pal heat. If you think about how
seedlings start in the wild, they are protected by the bigger plants
and have quite a sheltered upbringing. Seedlings are more fragile
than a full grown plant and have less resistance to bad growing
conditons. The thing with windows is that they get incredibly hot.
You want a themometer, not a photometer, if anything. I protect them
with shade cloth or lacey curtains when on my windows, but even then
I watch the temperature as all morning in window light can be too
much for seedlings. At night they rested near the fridge cooler which
helped keep them warm on cold spring nights.

--
Cheers,
Loki [ Brevity is the soul of wit. W.Shakespeare ]

On Fri, 18 Feb 2005 15:11:45 -0800, Matthew Montchalin
wrote:

A couple days ago I made the mistake of putting my tomato seedlings out
on a windowsill for direct sunlight, and a few hours later I discovered
they were all withered. (We've had a lot of sunlight here lately in
Portland, Oregon.)

I immediately removed them, and enclosed them in a humidity-containing
package (it used to be a doughnut package but I filled it up halfway
with potting soil), and hid it away.

The next day, 10% of the seedlings began to perk up again.

If I buy a photometer, how much light should tomato seedlings be exposed
to?

Is the real problem loss of water instead of too much sunlight?

You probably shocked your plants with the sudden bright light.
Seedlings need time to acclimate to bright sun. Try them for just an
hour a day, doubling the time each day. And make sure they are getting
enough water and food. I can't imagine plants getting too much sun, as
long as they are gradually acclimated. Considering your location, you
have plenty of time to start over again, a few times. Sow them in your
humidity container and as soon as the very first bit of green appears,
get them out of the humidity and into the light. Your bright window
should be fine if done this way. Flourescent tubes an inch above the
plants would do as well. No acclimatation needed. The humidity beyond
this point is asking for fungus / damping off / weakening. conditions.
And you don't need a photo meter, unless you are a very serious
photographer.

-- Mr Gardener
-- Zone 5 - On The Maine Coast

Mr Gardener wrote:
|A couple days ago I made the mistake of putting my tomato seedlings out
|on a windowsill for direct sunlight, and a few hours later I discovered
|they were all withered. (We've had a lot of sunlight here lately in
|Portland, Oregon.)
|
|I immediately removed them, and enclosed them in a humidity-containing
|package (it used to be a doughnut package but I filled it up halfway
|with potting soil), and hid it away.
|
|The next day, 10% of the seedlings began to perk up again.
|
|If I buy a photometer, how much light should tomato seedlings be exposed
|to?
|
|Is the real problem loss of water instead of too much sunlight?
|
|You probably shocked your plants with the sudden bright light.

Well, yes, probably.

|Seedlings need time to acclimate to bright sun.

Are there any breeds of tomato that are less shockable than Beefsteak
or Roma?

|Try them for just an hour a day, doubling the time each day. And make
|sure they are getting enough water and food.

I was hoping that the tomatoes would thrive on potting soil and high
humidity.

|I can't imagine plants getting too much sun, as long as they are
|gradually acclimated. Considering your location, you have plenty of time
|to start over again, a few times.

Yes.

|Sow them in your humidity container and as soon as the very first bit of
|green appears, get them out of the humidity and into the light. Your
|bright window should be fine if done this way. Flourescent tubes an inch
|above the plants would do as well.

I have theory that Cool White fluorescent lights will work just as fine
as Grow Lights.

|No acclimatation needed. The humidity beyond this point is asking for
|fungus / damping off / weakening.

Argh! I was hoping the terrarium would be self-sufficient, and I could
just seal them off from the outside world.

|conditions.
|And you don't need a photo meter, unless you are a very serious
|photographer.

If I knew the amount of light that was appropriate, I could computerize
the setup.

Matthew Montchalin wrote:
A couple days ago I made the mistake of putting my tomato seedlings
out
on a windowsill for direct sunlight, and a few hours later I
discovered
they were all withered. (We've had a lot of sunlight here lately in
Portland, Oregon.)

I immediately removed them, and enclosed them in a
humidity-containing
package (it used to be a doughnut package but I filled it up halfway
with potting soil), and hid it away.

The next day, 10% of the seedlings began to perk up again.

If I buy a photometer, how much light should tomato seedlings be
exposed
to?

Is the real problem loss of water instead of too much sunlight?

those seedlings died because of dryness and heat, not too much light.
better start over, and keep them moist at all times.

On Sun, 20 Feb 2005 12:32:57 -0800, Matthew Montchalin
wrote:

Are there any breeds of tomato that are less shockable than Beefsteak
or Roma?

No. Seeds are seeds, when it comes to sudden changes. No different,
really, than you or I spending too much time in the bright sunlight
after a winter of covering up indoors.

I was hoping that the tomatoes would thrive on potting soil and high
humidity.

"Potting soil" is usually too heavy for optimum seedstarting. Try a
soilless mix specifically labeled for starting seeds. This mix is
usually a combination of vermiculate and peat and maybe a little lime.
ProMix is a popular brand, another is Jiffy Mix. If neither is
available, plain vermiculite will be fine. These mixes contain no
nutrients, your seeds contain all the food they need to get them
started through the "seed leaf" phase. After that, water with a half
strength fertilizer solution. I use fish emulsion and/or liquid
seaweed. Shultz's famous 7 drops per litre all around plant food works
just as well. Maybe better.

Humidity covers are used to keep the seedbed moist, water being one of
the requirements for germination. After the seed has germinated, it
gets its water through its roots. If you think about a plant in
nature, its stems and leaves are above ground, high and dry in the
fresh air.

I have theory that Cool White fluorescent lights will work just as fine
as Grow Lights.

Yes. Not just a theory. Cool whites, the $1.99 cheapies, contain the
parts of the color spectrum that plants need to make leaves. Since you
are not attempting to produce flowers or fruits under lights, grow
lights are mostly superfluous. I've used both, but I will never be
1000% convinced, so I often use one cool and one grow in each of my 4
foot shoplights. Just in case I don't know what I'm talking about. By
the way, I've noticed in recent years that more and more suppliers are
selling "energy saving" 4 foot flourescent tubes. On close inpection,
you will discover that these bulbs are only 32 watts, rather than the
common 40 watters we have been usiing since time began. Buyer beware.

Argh! I was hoping the terrarium would be self-sufficient, and I could
just seal them off from the outside world. If I knew the amount of light that was appropriate, I could computerize
the setup.

Yes, and I'm sure that's how the big producers do it. But without the
greenhouse and the specialized equipment, we must do a little hands on
care in order to get our seeds ready for the garden. You have reminded
me of the first year I started my own seeds, a few decades ago. I had
an elaborate setup using large aquariums with covers and bright
lights, all under a tent made of 4 mil poly, the entire affair about 6
feet from the woodstove to ensure plenty of warmth . . . what a
disaster! I learned my lessons about heat and humidity in that one
fateful spring - a truly humbling experience.

-- Mr Gardener
-- Zone 5 - On The Maine Coast

On Fri, 18 Feb 2005 15:11:45 -0800, Matthew Montchalin
wrote:

Hay folks! too many complex answers to a simple problem (I think).

Think about this. If your first day at the beach you rippedoff your
shirt and stayed in the sun all day- - -You'd wilt too! BUT, if you
started out at say 15 minutes the first day,,30the next and etc, you'd
soon adapt to it.

Now for the person that mentioned using florescent lights instead of
grow light. It works great! BUT, you need both the Soft White and
Daylight type bulbs(different light spectrums ).

I raised tomatoes in my basement (hydroponically ) and had tomatoes in
January and February one year. (lots of work).

Another thing you can do by using lights is; Adjust your day length
to make your plants think it is summer. Don't over do it though.
Plants manufacture food during the day and grow in darkness (I know
there are exceptions). bit as a general rule.

Guess I might have offended some, but not my intentions, After
70+years of watching thing grow, I still get a thrill out of it..

All of you gardeners have a good day- -Rogerx

A couple days ago I made the mistake of putting my tomato seedlings out
on a windowsill for direct sunlight, and a few hours later I discovered
they were all withered. (We've had a lot of sunlight here lately in
Portland, Oregon.)

I immediately removed them, and enclosed them in a humidity-containing
package (it used to be a doughnut package but I filled it up halfway
with potting soil), and hid it away.

The next day, 10% of the seedlings began to perk up again.

If I buy a photometer, how much light should tomato seedlings be exposed
to?

Is the real problem loss of water instead of too much sunlight?