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Tree/bush with blue berries - what is it?
Except the buckthorn has black berries, and mine are a bright blue.
"Karen" wrote in message om... (Pat Kiewicz) wrote in message ... Neil said: No, the leaves are more obviously serated on the edges, and the berries are a bright blue. Possibly common buckthorn ( Rhamnus cathartica)? http://www.nps.gov/plants/alien/fact/rhca1.htm http://tncweeds.ucdavis.edu/esadocs/franalnu.html I think you're right. It's buckthorn. My contractor was wrong. |
Tree/bush with blue berries - what is it?
Ok, here's a closeup
http://www.panix.com/~nradisch/blueberries2.jpg Neil "animaux" wrote in message ... I wasn't able to see those details on a non-close up shot. When trying to have things identified, it's always best to take photos of each segment, foliage, flowers and berries or fruits. Large photos of the plant, out of focus...well, not easy to identify. On Thu, 9 Oct 2003 12:34:19 -0400, "Neil" opined: No, the leaves are more obviously serated on the edges, and the berries are a bright blue. "animaux" wrote in message .. . Looks like you may have a rare specimen. Rusty blackhaw viburnum. Have it identified by a botanical garden center. They are very hard to come by in the trade. I have been trying to get cuttings for years. Take a look here to see if it matches your shrub/tree. http://www.cnr.vt.edu/dendro/dendrol...vrufidulum.htm Victoria |
Tree/bush with blue berries - what is it?
Send me your address and i'll mail you some berries.
"Allview" wrote in message ... Whatever those trees are I wouldn't mind having some. I guessed some type of viburnum when I saw the picture but I am far from being an expert. It would be nice to have late winter berries for the birds. Marilyn in Ohio |
Tree/bush with blue berries - what is it?
Can I have some too?
Do you remember what the flowers looked like? |
Tree/bush with blue berries - what is it?
Its definitley a viburnum, probably Viburnum lentago. Definitley not a
buckthorn because the berries are way too blue. Toad |
Tree/bush with blue berries - what is it?
Xref: kermit rec.gardens:252942
On Tue, 7 Oct 2003 15:30:10 -0400, "Neil" wrote: There's a picture at http://www.panix.com/~nradisch/blueberries.jpg On Sat, 11 Oct 2003 16:56:41 -0400, "Neil" wrote: Ok, here's a closeup http://www.panix.com/~nradisch/blueberries2.jpg On 13 Oct 2003 22:29:13 GMT, (Marley1372) wrote: Its definitley a viburnum, probably Viburnum lentago. Definitley not a buckthorn because the berries are way too blue. Hi Toad, Try comparing what you suggested (viburnum lentago) to this link: http://www.cnr.vt.edu/dendro/dendrol...s/vlentago.htm It doesn't look the same to me... The best I've been able to come up with is Ovalleaf Huckleberry or Bilbery (vaccinium ovalifolium). See: http://www.cnr.vt.edu/dendro/dendrol...valifolium.htm http://www.esveld.nl/htmldiaen/v/vaoval.htm I suspect that it is some type of vaccinium. From what I could find out most of the blueberries grown as commercial crops came from the vaccinium varieties. Looking inside the drupe for seeds and counting them (if there are any) could be helpful in identifying. How tall this speciman is and diameter of the trunk would be useful too. It is hard to tell from the images. Another possibility (already suggested?) are the Huckleberry's from gaylussacia. Possibly gaylussacia baccata. The leaves look to be too big for this though. See: http://www.cnr.vt.edu/dendro/dendrol...aylussacia.htm http://www.bbg.org/sci/nymf/encyclop...i/gay0010b.htm The oval leaf shape in the images that Neil provided and the apparent size (too big for most suggestions?) ruins many suggested identities... I have quite a few good shrub/tree books and this doesn't seem to be in any of them. Maybe Neil can provide a little history/background. Was this tree planted or did it occur naturally. Any guess on how old it might be? That could be useful in eliminating named species of recent origin. I haven't given up, but I have pretty much exhausted my current resources... -- Leon Fisk Grand Rapids MI/Zone 5b Remove no.spam for email |
Tree/bush with blue berries - what is it?
"Leon Fisk" wrote in message ... On Tue, 7 Oct 2003 15:30:10 -0400, "Neil" wrote: There's a picture at http://www.panix.com/~nradisch/blueberries.jpg On Sat, 11 Oct 2003 16:56:41 -0400, "Neil" wrote: Ok, here's a closeup http://www.panix.com/~nradisch/blueberries2.jpg On 13 Oct 2003 22:29:13 GMT, (Marley1372) wrote: Its definitley a viburnum, probably Viburnum lentago. Definitley not a buckthorn because the berries are way too blue. Hi Toad, Try comparing what you suggested (viburnum lentago) to this link: http://www.cnr.vt.edu/dendro/dendrol...s/vlentago.htm It doesn't look the same to me... The best I've been able to come up with is Ovalleaf Huckleberry or Bilbery (vaccinium ovalifolium). See: http://www.cnr.vt.edu/dendro/dendrol...valifolium.htm http://www.esveld.nl/htmldiaen/v/vaoval.htm I suspect that it is some type of vaccinium. From what I could find out most of the blueberries grown as commercial crops came from the vaccinium varieties. Looking inside the drupe for seeds and counting them (if there are any) could be helpful in identifying. How tall this speciman is and diameter of the trunk would be useful too. It is hard to tell from the images. Another possibility (already suggested?) are the Huckleberry's from gaylussacia. Possibly gaylussacia baccata. The leaves look to be too big for this though. See: http://www.cnr.vt.edu/dendro/dendrol...aylussacia.htm http://www.bbg.org/sci/nymf/encyclop...i/gay0010b.htm The oval leaf shape in the images that Neil provided and the apparent size (too big for most suggestions?) ruins many suggested identities... I have quite a few good shrub/tree books and this doesn't seem to be in any of them. Maybe Neil can provide a little history/background. Was this tree planted or did it occur naturally. Any guess on how old it might be? That could be useful in eliminating named species of recent origin. I haven't given up, but I have pretty much exhausted my current resources... -- Leon Fisk Grand Rapids MI/Zone 5b Remove no.spam for email Funny this has become an obsession with me as well. The closest I could come up with was viburnum or vaccinium but the although the berries are the right color - the calyx are not right and the stem colors are not right. Are the berries very fleshy like a type of service berry? They almost look more crabapple like than berry like or possible wild cherry like but blue?? I can't google any more. I as well have many North American native plant books, edible plant books and shrub books that I cannot find these in - so is it really wild in NA?? Be nice to see someone solve this mystery!! Have you tried bringing it in to a local nursery or College. There must be a well versed horticulturalist in the area. |
Tree/bush with blue berries - what is it?
The Vibrunum Lengato seems to be the closest match so far, but the
description of the berries doesn't seem quite right. It talks about blue-black berries, and these are a bright blue, definitely not approaching black. I have no idea about the trees history. I bought the property a year ago, and they were already here. There are about three or four of them together in the area in sort of a clump. The general appearance is that of a small (8') tree a bit spindly with sort of crooked angular branches. I've been following everyone's suggestions here, and this really seems to be a stumper. In every case the suggested plant has either the wrong leaf shape, or wrong berry color. I'm wondering, however, if the tree's environment is effecting it's normal appearance somewhat. It is in a very shady area that gets little sun. Probably not much more than a couple of hours of indirect sun a day. Maybe the berries would be black if the tree got more sun. Dunno. I sent an e-mail to the Connecticut horticultural society, but they have yet to respond. I'l go do some measurements today, and disect a berry or two and post my results. Neil "Tina Gibson" wrote in message news:xtcjb.104221$pl3.55041@pd7tw3no... "Leon Fisk" wrote in message ... On Tue, 7 Oct 2003 15:30:10 -0400, "Neil" wrote: There's a picture at http://www.panix.com/~nradisch/blueberries.jpg On Sat, 11 Oct 2003 16:56:41 -0400, "Neil" wrote: Ok, here's a closeup http://www.panix.com/~nradisch/blueberries2.jpg On 13 Oct 2003 22:29:13 GMT, (Marley1372) wrote: Its definitley a viburnum, probably Viburnum lentago. Definitley not a buckthorn because the berries are way too blue. Hi Toad, Try comparing what you suggested (viburnum lentago) to this link: http://www.cnr.vt.edu/dendro/dendrol...s/vlentago.htm It doesn't look the same to me... The best I've been able to come up with is Ovalleaf Huckleberry or Bilbery (vaccinium ovalifolium). See: http://www.cnr.vt.edu/dendro/dendrol...valifolium.htm http://www.esveld.nl/htmldiaen/v/vaoval.htm I suspect that it is some type of vaccinium. From what I could find out most of the blueberries grown as commercial crops came from the vaccinium varieties. Looking inside the drupe for seeds and counting them (if there are any) could be helpful in identifying. How tall this speciman is and diameter of the trunk would be useful too. It is hard to tell from the images. Another possibility (already suggested?) are the Huckleberry's from gaylussacia. Possibly gaylussacia baccata. The leaves look to be too big for this though. See: http://www.cnr.vt.edu/dendro/dendrol...aylussacia.htm http://www.bbg.org/sci/nymf/encyclop...i/gay0010b.htm The oval leaf shape in the images that Neil provided and the apparent size (too big for most suggestions?) ruins many suggested identities... I have quite a few good shrub/tree books and this doesn't seem to be in any of them. Maybe Neil can provide a little history/background. Was this tree planted or did it occur naturally. Any guess on how old it might be? That could be useful in eliminating named species of recent origin. I haven't given up, but I have pretty much exhausted my current resources... -- Leon Fisk Grand Rapids MI/Zone 5b Remove no.spam for email Funny this has become an obsession with me as well. The closest I could come up with was viburnum or vaccinium but the although the berries are the right color - the calyx are not right and the stem colors are not right. Are the berries very fleshy like a type of service berry? They almost look more crabapple like than berry like or possible wild cherry like but blue?? I can't google any more. I as well have many North American native plant books, edible plant books and shrub books that I cannot find these in - so is it really wild in NA?? Be nice to see someone solve this mystery!! Have you tried bringing it in to a local nursery or College. There must be a well versed horticulturalist in the area. |
Tree/bush with blue berries - what is it?
I've been following along because I remember searching for the name of
this shrub years ago. [long before I had internet access] My feeble mind can't remember if I was ever successful, or where exactly I saw this shrub. It was definitely in NY-- around Albany/Schenectady. I thought it was in the woods on my current property, but a quick look through yesterday didn't reveal any more. "Neil" wrote: The Vibrunum Lengato seems to be the closest match so far, but the description of the berries doesn't seem quite right. It talks about blue-black berries, and these are a bright blue, definitely not approaching black. Your second picture shows the color well--- if anything it downplays the metallic/porcelain-like blue. The color is so strikingly different it seems like anyone who has ever seen one will remember it. I think both of the species that Leon posted [Vaccinium & Viburnums] had a 'blush' or 'bloom' on the berry/drupe. These do not-- they are bright & shiny. Was it this berry or another that I popped open to find 4 seeds arranged like orange sections to form a globe? If you pop one, also note the color of the juice & flesh. I have no idea about the trees history. I bought the property a year ago, and they were already here. There are about three or four of them together in the area in sort of a clump. The general appearance is that of a small (8') tree a bit spindly with sort of crooked angular branches. If my memory serves, I would call them an understory plant with a habit somewhere between 'gracefully sweeping' and 'leggy'. I've been following everyone's suggestions here, and this really seems to be a stumper. In every case the suggested plant has either the wrong leaf shape, or wrong berry color. I'm wondering, however, if the tree's environment is effecting it's normal appearance somewhat. It is in a very shady area that gets little sun. Probably not much more than a couple of hours of indirect sun a day. Maybe the berries would be black if the tree got more sun. Dunno. I don't think so-- I'm still looking for the ones I saw around here, but I'm pretty sure the ones I saw were all in the shade. I sent an e-mail to the Connecticut horticultural society, but they have yet to respond. I'l go do some measurements today, and disect a berry or two and post my results. While you're out there, also note; The color / odor of the bark & the layer under the bark. The arrangement of the berries [cluster of 2 or 3 or single] Arrangement of leaves/leaflets - how many, are the opposite or alternate, etc. What color are the leaves turning to? [I went out looking for this bush yesterday & noted that a lot of our shrubs have lost their leaves already] Reposting Neil's links for anyone tuning in late; General http://www.panix.com/~nradisch/blueberries.jpg Closeup http://www.panix.com/~nradisch/blueberries2.jpg Jim |
Tree/bush with blue berries - what is it?
Hi Neil,
I may have found it. Sapphire Berry or Asiatic Sweetleaf (symplocos paniculata). See the following links and see what you think. http://www.keystonetree.com/saphire.jpg http://www.esveld.nl/htmldiaen/s/sypani.htm http://ridgwaydb.mobot.org/kemperweb....asp?code=T710 http://www.hort.uconn.edu/plants/s/sympan/sympan1.html It is an import from China and Japan. Makes it hard to find in our native books ;) You can do your own Google search using the latin name if you want to explore this further. I didn't find very many images of it... -- Leon Fisk Grand Rapids MI/Zone 5b Remove no.spam for email |
Tree/bush with blue berries - what is it?
THAT'S IT!!!!!!!!!!!!1
The picture in the first link is dead on. Also the description in the uconn site is very accurate. The berries, BTW, are not really fleshy. I cut one open and it has a hard seed inside. Anyhow, here are more pictures of mine for comparison. http://www.panix.com/~nradisch/berriescut.jpg http://www.panix.com/~nradisch/leavesbottom.jpg http://www.panix.com/~nradisch/leavestop.jpg Thanks you everyone for helping me with this mystery. Neil "Leon Fisk" wrote in message ... Hi Neil, I may have found it. Sapphire Berry or Asiatic Sweetleaf (symplocos paniculata). See the following links and see what you think. http://www.keystonetree.com/saphire.jpg http://www.esveld.nl/htmldiaen/s/sypani.htm http://ridgwaydb.mobot.org/kemperweb....asp?code=T710 http://www.hort.uconn.edu/plants/s/sympan/sympan1.html It is an import from China and Japan. Makes it hard to find in our native books ;) You can do your own Google search using the latin name if you want to explore this further. I didn't find very many images of it... -- Leon Fisk Grand Rapids MI/Zone 5b Remove no.spam for email |
Tree/bush with blue berries - what is it?
"Neil" wrote in message ...
THAT'S IT!!!!!!!!!!!!1 The picture in the first link is dead on. Also the description in the uconn site is very accurate. The berries, BTW, are not really fleshy. I cut one open and it has a hard seed inside. Anyhow, here are more pictures of mine for comparison. http://www.panix.com/~nradisch/berriescut.jpg http://www.panix.com/~nradisch/leavesbottom.jpg http://www.panix.com/~nradisch/leavestop.jpg Thanks you everyone for helping me with this mystery. Neil "Leon Fisk" wrote in message ... Hi Neil, I may have found it. Sapphire Berry or Asiatic Sweetleaf (symplocos paniculata). See the following links and see what you think. http://www.keystonetree.com/saphire.jpg http://www.esveld.nl/htmldiaen/s/sypani.htm http://ridgwaydb.mobot.org/kemperweb....asp?code=T710 http://www.hort.uconn.edu/plants/s/sympan/sympan1.html It is an import from China and Japan. Makes it hard to find in our native books ;) You can do your own Google search using the latin name if you want to explore this further. I didn't find very many images of it... -- Leon Fisk Grand Rapids MI/Zone 5b Remove no.spam for email Way to go Leon!! Now we all can sleep!! Neil if you can send seeds - I would love some. just email me if you can. |
Tree/bush with blue berries - what is it?
Thanks Leon!
Leon Fisk wrote: Hi Neil, I may have found it. Sapphire Berry or Asiatic Sweetleaf (symplocos paniculata). See the following links and see what you think. http://www.keystonetree.com/saphire.jpg http://www.esveld.nl/htmldiaen/s/sypani.htm http://ridgwaydb.mobot.org/kemperweb....asp?code=T710 http://www.hort.uconn.edu/plants/s/sympan/sympan1.html Well, we're all in agreement that this is the one. The Latin name seems vaguely familiar, so maybe I did stumble on an ID years ago. [but the common names don't-- so maybe I didn't.] I looked in Wyman's Encyclopedia & they mention that it has fragrant white flowers for a short time in the spring-- and that it loses the berries rather quickly once they are ripe. But they also say that the berries are "of a color not seen in the fruit of any other hardy woody plant." So they make up in uniqueness what they lack in longevity. For those who have asked for seeds,Wyman's says they can be propagated, but that the seeds germinate erratically. They recommend stratifying the seeds at 40degees F for 3 months before sowing. They also say softwood cuttings will root. -snip- I second Neil's Thanks- Jim |
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