wrote in message
...


Jim Webster wrote:
...
I think you better wait for next planting time. If Indian farmers think
that
GM cotton is rubbish, they will not plant it. If, on the other hand,
they
reckon it did pretty well and and the problems are purely hyped up by a
lot
of antis, then they will plant it.

Jim Webster

Once the farmer is broke is it easy to go back and plant again?

these people have regular droughts. They have regular crop failures, they go
back and plant again. I don't think you have the faintest idea what the
average peasant farmer has to go through

Jim Webster

wrote in message
...


Jim Webster wrote:
...

no, these are old genes, purely in a different place, I have heard of no
case where a new gene has been manufactured, they are just moved from
one
species to another

Jim Webster

How long has humanity been eating BT or HIV vaccines?

stop and think about it carefully. How does a vaccine work and then explain
how it fits into gm crops

Jim Webster

"Jim Webster" wrote in message
...

wrote in message
...

So you dismiss the current and predictable problems?
This might have been a little problem in a world with millions
of little farmers. Now the world is turning into one mega farmer
that uses the seed of one mega seed company and the pesticides
of one mega biochemical company all using the same technological
base.

you seem to forget that conventional seed varieties have a short life,
conventional seed production is a treatmill and new varieties are always
needed. This differs from the GM scenario exactly how?

Have you looks around lately to see who is breeding crops. In the US they
public breeders are getting old and retiring and the departments are using
their funds as salary savings. In other words the don't hire a new guy and
divvy up he money and stuff. Ten years ago the Oklahoma Board of Regencies
cased cotton breeding or any program on cotton no supported by law, or trust
fund. Texas has 1 man actively breeding cotton seed.

I expect we best be thankful the commercial guy are there to take up the
slack.

In the last ten years than state has quit funding ag research at oust you
get an office a phone 1/5 a secretary and all the money you can friend. I
think they are still milking a few cow that were around 40 years ago.

Grip

"Jim Webster" wrote in message
...

wrote in message
...

So you dismiss the current and predictable problems?
This might have been a little problem in a world with millions
of little farmers. Now the world is turning into one mega farmer
that uses the seed of one mega seed company and the pesticides
of one mega biochemical company all using the same technological
base.

you seem to forget that conventional seed varieties have a short life,
conventional seed production is a treatmill and new varieties are always
needed. This differs from the GM scenario exactly how?

Have you looks around lately to see who is breeding crops. In the US they
public breeders are getting old and retiring and the departments are using
their funds as salary savings. In other words the don't hire a new guy and
divvy up he money and stuff. Ten years ago the Oklahoma Board of Regencies
cased cotton breeding or any program on cotton no supported by law, or trust
fund. Texas has 1 man actively breeding cotton seed.

I expect we best be thankful the commercial guy are there to take up the
slack.

In the last ten years than state has quit funding ag research at oust you
get an office a phone 1/5 a secretary and all the money you can friend. I
think they are still milking a few cow that were around 40 years ago.

Grip

"Jim Webster" wrote in message
...

wrote in message
...

So you dismiss the current and predictable problems?
This might have been a little problem in a world with millions
of little farmers. Now the world is turning into one mega farmer
that uses the seed of one mega seed company and the pesticides
of one mega biochemical company all using the same technological
base.

you seem to forget that conventional seed varieties have a short life,
conventional seed production is a treatmill and new varieties are always
needed. This differs from the GM scenario exactly how?

Have you looks around lately to see who is breeding crops. In the US they
public breeders are getting old and retiring and the departments are using
their funds as salary savings. In other words the don't hire a new guy and
divvy up he money and stuff. Ten years ago the Oklahoma Board of Regencies
cased cotton breeding or any program on cotton no supported by law, or trust
fund. Texas has 1 man actively breeding cotton seed.

I expect we best be thankful the commercial guy are there to take up the
slack.

In the last ten years than state has quit funding ag research at oust you
get an office a phone 1/5 a secretary and all the money you can friend. I
think they are still milking a few cow that were around 40 years ago.

Grip

wrote in message
...


wparrott wrote:

Here are some differences that I could think in 5 minutes
the GM scenario would have a large number of crop varieties or even a
large
number of crops with several genes in common. In conventional seed
production
there is variety. Genes that dictate the use of one chemical (a
chemical that
by the way is not friendly to certain organisms of the soil, and a
chemical
that stays for very long in the soil clay structure and a chemical
that is
difficult to analyze and detect). Conventional crops require different
practices (chemical or mechanical) to maintain a reduced pest and weed
populations.

By mechanical, you mean plowing? That is the worst thing one can do to
soil. Not only does it promote erosion, it destroys organic matter, and
disrupts all soil organisms.


mechanical weed control is sometimes even required in some crops!
not only kills weeds but it put soil where the roots need it!

Please provide an example.


Also, if you have real information on glyphosate being harmful to soil
organisms, please share it.

read the fine print in your Roundup container.

It is far less harmful than tillage or any other heribcide since it binds
very tightly with clay paricals. Even dirty water inacivates it.

Do your home work on the alternitives. See the difference in conventional
tillage and no till and reduced tillage on two farms after a week of rain.
http://www.couger.com/farm/




The use of that one chemical implies a series of cultural practices
that
affect the soil fauna and flora. Multiple pesticides implies that at
least
some area is not affected by unintended chemical effects.

While it guarantees that the other areas are affected by unintended
effects.

Had the fellow that farms my wife's place had his no till in place he
wouldn't have lost 10% of his cotton in a wind storm in front of thunder
storm last week in west Texas. The damage of tillage is well know and real.
Until now we had little other choice with most crops. No till is the only
method of farming that restores organic matter and invertebrate live to the
soil to anything that approaches the levels of native sod. There may be some
unexpected findings but we can find it on the soil that is still on the farm
not in the Gulf of Mexico.

Gordon

I thought about it,
Lets make an experiment.
Lets 270 million american volunteer as
guiny pigs. Let them all have an HIV vaccine
in their potatoes. Let's see if they come out
HIV positive.

Jim Webster wrote:

wrote in message
...


Jim Webster wrote:
...

no, these are old genes, purely in a different place, I have heard of no
case where a new gene has been manufactured, they are just moved from
one
species to another

Jim Webster

How long has humanity been eating BT or HIV vaccines?

stop and think about it carefully. How does a vaccine work and then explain
how it fits into gm crops

Jim Webster

wrote:

I thought about it,
Lets make an experiment.
Lets 270 million american volunteer as
guiny pigs. Let them all have an HIV vaccine
in their potatoes. Let's see if they come out
HIV positive.

Now, remember, I just said HIV positive and not
positive for HIV.

wrote in message
...
I thought about it,
Lets make an experiment.
Lets 270 million american volunteer as
guiny pigs. Let them all have an HIV vaccine
in their potatoes. Let's see if they come out
HIV positive.


set up as many straw men as you like

Jim Webster