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a few months ago there was an article in the papers about
basic rock nutrients you could but in bulk from a scottish site it improved the trace mineral content of the soil to make it like new soil formed by volcanic eruption you just chucked it on at the usual dosage of a couple of handfulls a square meter and let it do its funky stuff any ideas guys i would be most greatfull for a link ive done the google tingie but then again i am one of lifes computer iliterates dave |
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TR wrote:
a few months ago there was an article in the papers about basic rock nutrients you could but in bulk from a scottish site it improved the trace mineral content of the soil to make it like new soil formed by volcanic eruption you just chucked it on at the usual dosage of a couple of handfulls a square meter and let it do its funky stuff any ideas guys i would be most greatfull for a link ive done the google tingie but then again i am one of lifes computer iliterates dave Sounds like a waste of money. If your soil is lacking something, you find out what it is, and replace that, not a whole lot of other stuff. But you probably don't need anything you wouldn't get from the usual gardening processes: compost, bonemeal, etc, seaweed if you can get it, and a bit of ordinary fertiliser if you need it. There's no magic in volcanoes: the best thing for improving soil is growing things in it. -- Mike. |
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yup i agree
what i wanted was the site addy as i sponser a couple of prokects in Africa where this stuff has been used as im sending out a container of usefull items i did think a few bas of this might be usefull i have seen the pyramid garden minimal watering lock the nuetriants in the soil idea in several locations on the web i wnted feedback from GARDENERS who may be knew dave |
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TR wrote: yup i agree what i wanted was the site addy as i sponser a couple of prokects in Africa where this stuff has been used as im sending out a container of usefull items i did think a few bas of this might be usefull i have seen the pyramid garden minimal watering lock the nuetriants in the soil idea in several locations on the web i wnted feedback from GARDENERS who may be knew Dave. Are you looking for andisol? What are you looking for? I don't understand. What's your soil type? What's lacking? What do you want to grow? |
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In message , TR
writes yup i agree what i wanted was the site addy as i sponser a couple of prokects in Africa where this stuff has been used as im sending out a container of usefull items i did think a few bas of this might be usefull i have seen the pyramid garden minimal watering lock the nuetriants in the soil idea in several locations on the web i wnted feedback from GARDENERS who may be knew Sounds like you are talking about soil remineralisation, basically adding rock dust to soil too replace various minerals that can come depleted over time. There does seem to some evidence that this might be useful process. Anyway, I know Colin Shaw has tried out this, I've read an article he wrote in Kitchen Garden magazine a while ago. He has some stuff on it on his website with some contacts http://www.organicgarden.org.uk/remineralisation/index.htm This breaks the frames though, for the rest of the site see the base url: http://www.organicgarden.org.uk/ -- Chris French |
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"Janet Baraclough" wrote in message ... The message from "TR" you @me contains these words: a few months ago there was an article in the papers about basic rock nutrients you could but in bulk from a scottish site http://www.seercentre.org.uk/ is the place you're thinking of; but all is not what you think. Those impressive veg are not achieved just by scattering rockdust on barren hillside.. I spent a day there once and a long time talking to the Thomsons. What his website carefully doesn't mention, is that as well as the rockdust, he spreads hundreds of tons of municipal compost (the stuff councils make from their green-waste collection services). That's what really creates the soil fertility imho. http://www.sepa.org.uk/news/releases...p?id=96&y=2004 properly acknowledges that SEERS combines large-scale managed waste with the rockdust, and provides a more realistic account imho ( read down to what John Ferguson says.) I'm not decrying what SEER achieves, but understand that a dressing of Scottish quarry dust (that's what he uses; granite quarry iirc) will not, on its own, make infertile/exhausted soil produce heavy crops. I would also be surprised if Scottish rock dusts could "remineralise" depleted soils in Africa which are geologically unrelated. Janet A very fair critique. Whilst I applaud SEER for their work I really think that they let themselves down by extolling the virtues of ground granite. It contains the same trace elements that would be obtained from a variety of other sources. AFAIK it increases acidity slightly and that's about it. In fairness to SEER they do not make the same outrageous claims that are being chucked around by others |
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ey up thats the site
the seer stuff im going out to S africa and i wanted to show some people out there just what can be achived using this stuff and compost the idea is sound its a bit pricey i know but so is fertilizer i like the idea of vegie mounds ect in the township areas the aint got tthe room to dig but a mound a couple of meters round and a meter or so high is possible so many thanks dave |
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TR wrote:
ey up thats the site the seer stuff im going out to S africa and i wanted to show some people out there just what can be achived using this stuff and compost the idea is sound Hang about! I thought we established that the idea _wasn't_ particularly sound! its a bit pricey i know but so is fertilizer i like the idea of vegie mounds ect in the township areas the aint got tthe room to dig but a mound a couple of meters round and a meter or so high is possible so many thanks dave I wouldn't be too sure they need much help from us on how to grow things! And if you're worried about the cost, well, they do have rocks of their own. -- Mike. |
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"TR" you @me wrote in message ... ey up thats the site the seer stuff im going out to S africa and i wanted to show some people out there just what can be achived using this stuff and compost the idea is sound its a bit pricey i know but so is fertilizer i like the idea of vegie mounds ect in the township areas the aint got tthe room to dig but a mound a couple of meters round and a meter or so high is possible so many thanks dave On the basis of this info you will be detained and shot upon entry to SA:-) NPWA believes that the promotion of PR and ground granite soil conditioners by organic growers' organisations endangers the health and well-being of their members and of people who follow their advice. NPWA also believes that the use of raw phosphate rock and ground granite for fertiliser and/or soil conditioner should be banned for health and safety reasons. Full article http://www.organicconsumers.org/organic/phosphate.cfm |
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from "Mike Lyle" contains these words: TR wrote: a few months ago there was an article in the papers about basic rock nutrients you could but in bulk from a scottish site it improved the trace mineral content of the soil to make it like new soil formed by volcanic eruption you just chucked it on at the usual dosage of a couple of handfulls a square meter and let it do its funky stuff any ideas guys i would be most greatfull for a link ive done the google tingie but then again i am one of lifes computer iliterates dave Sounds like a waste of money. If your soil is lacking something, you find out what it is, and replace that, not a whole lot of other stuff. But you probably don't need anything you wouldn't get from the usual gardening processes: compost, bonemeal, etc, seaweed if you can get it, and a bit of ordinary fertiliser if you need it. There's no magic in volcanoes: the best thing for improving soil is growing things in it. It isn't a waste of time: in fact, in trials it has proved spectacularly effective in increasing crop yields. It was featured on (IIRC) one of the R4 science programmes. I can't unforget the details, except that I think the initial experiment was carried out in Perthshire. -- Rusty Direct reply to: horrid dot squeak snailything zetnet point co period uk Separator in search of a sig |
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Rusty Hinge 2 wrote:
The message from "Mike Lyle" [...] Sounds like a waste of money. If your soil is lacking something, you find out what it is, and replace that, not a whole lot of other stuff. But you probably don't need anything you wouldn't get from the usual gardening processes: compost, bonemeal, etc, seaweed if you can get it, and a bit of ordinary fertiliser if you need it. There's no magic in volcanoes: the best thing for improving soil is growing things in it. It isn't a waste of time: in fact, in trials it has proved spectacularly effective in increasing crop yields. It was featured on (IIRC) one of the R4 science programmes. I can't unforget the details, except that I think the initial experiment was carried out in Perthshire. OK, I'll accept that -- unfortunately missed the prog. So how does it work? And has it worked in other places? I can see that from time to time a depleted soil might need trace-mineral replacement; but surely that's a rare case? I'm assuming that the experiments were carried out with the usual controls, in order to avoid what I think of as "the reading-scheme phenomenon" (impressive results achieved with a new teaching method, but turning out to be just because of the extra attention received by both pupils and teachers). -- Mike. |
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"Mike Lyle" wrote in message ... Rusty Hinge 2 wrote: The message from "Mike Lyle" [...] Sounds like a waste of money. If your soil is lacking something, you find out what it is, and replace that, not a whole lot of other stuff. But you probably don't need anything you wouldn't get from the usual gardening processes: compost, bonemeal, etc, seaweed if you can get it, and a bit of ordinary fertiliser if you need it. There's no magic in volcanoes: the best thing for improving soil is growing things in it. It isn't a waste of time: in fact, in trials it has proved spectacularly effective in increasing crop yields. It was featured on (IIRC) one of the R4 science programmes. I can't unforget the details, except that I think the initial experiment was carried out in Perthshire. OK, I'll accept that -- unfortunately missed the prog. So how does it work? And has it worked in other places? I can see that from time to time a depleted soil might need trace-mineral replacement; but surely that's a rare case? I'm assuming that the experiments were carried out with the usual controls, in order to avoid what I think of as "the reading-scheme phenomenon" (impressive results achieved with a new teaching method, but turning out to be just because of the extra attention received by both pupils and teachers). -- Mike. I think your original statement "Sounds like a waste of money" was spot on, however, for those who want it here is the price schedule Rock Dust comes in 20 kg. bags which will cover approximately 40 sq. yds as an annual application, prices are as follows:- 1 bags £15.99 each 2 to 4 bags £14.50 each 5 to 10 bags £12.99 each Prices INCLUDE delivery and VAT |
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"Mike Lyle" wrote in message ... OK, I'll accept that -- unfortunately missed the prog. So how does it work? And has it worked in other places? I can see that from time to time a depleted soil might need trace-mineral replacement; but surely that's a rare case? I'm assuming that the experiments were carried out with the usual controls, in order to avoid what I think of as "the reading-scheme phenomenon" (impressive results achieved with a new teaching method, but turning out to be just because of the extra attention received by both pupils and teachers). -- Mike. There's some general stuff about some Australian trials (1997) on here - http://www.rosneath.com.au/ipc6/ch02/oldfield/ quote A Summary Of Our Reporting To Date: Granite dust promotes the fast and healthy growth of tree seedlings in the nursery. Granite dust particularly benefits nitrogen-fixing trees. Granite dust can provide some potassium to plants on demand. Although granite dust has a high pH it does not seem to raise significantly the pH of acid soils. Granite dust has been shown to reduce the yield of wheat under field conditions. Diorite dust may reduce weed competition to the benefit of a wheat crop. Quarry dust improves water infiltration rates to the benefit of non-wetting soils. Quarry dust improves water retention in free draining soils. Quarry dust benefits dairy pastures by promoting legume growth at the expense of less productive species when applied as an additive to slurry from cattle sheds. Granite dust has given a marginally higher yield from a lupin crop than either chemical fertiliser or a commercial rockdust blend. Composting earthworms prefer a feed ration to which rockdust has been added. Quarry dust may affect the way plants respond to electromagnetic radiation, in particular excess solar radiation. Granite dust does not seem to benefit well-nurtured gardens. Nevertheless a granite and marble dust mixture appeared to benefit garden crops grown on an alluvial loam. Granite dust contains 27ppm lanthanum, a rare earth considered by the Chinese to be a plant growth promoter. Quarry dust may deter wingless grasshoppers. Tree seedlings raised in a soil mix containing 5% granite dust appear to resist insect predation. Tree seedlings raised in a granite dust enriched potting mix appear to continue fast healthy growth after planting out under adverse climatic and soil conditions typical of the West Australian wheatbelt. There could be a link between the use of rock dust and the noted absence of fungal attack in the early stages of seedling growth. © Copyright Permaculture Association of Western Australia Inc. and authors, 1997. /quote michael adams .... |
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In message , Janet Baraclough
writes The message from "Mike Lyle" contains these words: I'm assuming that the experiments were carried out with the usual controls, in order to avoid what I think of as "the reading-scheme phenomenon" (impressive results achieved with a new teaching method, but turning out to be just because of the extra attention received by both pupils and teachers). snip At the time I was there, there were no "control beds ", using just stone dust as a dressing, and I have never seen reference to such a comparison being attempted. ISTR that in the article by Colin Shaw I mentioned he talked about comparing beds with and without the rock dust -- Chris French |
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"chris French" wrote in message ... In message , Janet Baraclough writes The message from "Mike Lyle" contains these words: I'm assuming that the experiments were carried out with the usual controls, in order to avoid what I think of as "the reading-scheme phenomenon" (impressive results achieved with a new teaching method, but turning out to be just because of the extra attention received by both pupils and teachers). snip At the time I was there, there were no "control beds ", using just stone dust as a dressing, and I have never seen reference to such a comparison being attempted. ISTR that in the article by Colin Shaw I mentioned he talked about comparing beds with and without the rock dust -- Chris French Chris,I took Janet's post to mean she had not seen trials or comparisons being made at SEER. There are a plethora of trials along similar lines to the one you mentioned. I would maintain that any differences are due to drainage/soil structure and not nutrient enhancement from assorted rock dusts. Here is a good trial (by an Undergraduate) which broadly confirms Colin's results http://www.geocities.com/HotSprings/...alisation1.htm |
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