garden virgin wrote:
snip
Don't use the autumn leaves in your composter: they need to break down
slowly by fungi. Bung them in black plastic bags, tie up the tops,
ventilate by sticking your garden fork through a few times, leave in an
inconspicuous place and forget about them until next spring (at least).

i don't think i've space for bags of autumn leaves in my already small city
garden, would it be possible... just for this year, to dig up part of my
garden (the barren bit) & bury the leaves. I would imagine earthworms would
munch on them, would this work?

I think you'll find that they're still there next year. Autumn leaves
have very little nutritional value: the tree takes all the goodness out
before discarding them. They are used as a soil conditioner to add humus
(a complex carbohydrate) which improves soil structure. Leaf-mould and
compost are two different things. It's slow aerobic decomposition by
fungi that you're trying to achieve - hence the holes in the bag. The
bag is just there to keep them in one place, someone else suggested a
wire basket approach which does the same thing.

You can buy compost accelerators but each human being comes with a ready
supply of 'recycled beer' and the male of the species has been specially
designed with an application device.

blimey is that right? i will be visiting my composter tonight, hope the
neighbours don't look out the windows.

;-)

Derek Turner writes
K wrote:

I know that's the theory, but I'm not sure that in practice most
gardeners can achieve the heat levels required, and also get all of
the material to that temperature (not just the bit in the centre).
It's easier to do in a big heap.

agreed, but the conical plastic Dalek, and the way the material shrinks
from the sides and falls into the centre seems to compensate somewhat.
Weed seeds are ubiquitous in soil, so it's not a major benefit to
remove them from the compost.

it is if you're using it to make your own potting compost :-)

Fair point!
I use mine as a mulch and for filling up the bottom half of big pots.
Weed seeds aren't a problem in that scenario.


I'd say a cold heap made in the summer will be ready for use next
spring - the poster advising the hot heap was giving much the same
timescale - it surprised me, as I though hot heaps were faster than that.

That was me, they are, but a single Dalek will take all summer to fill
as the volume decreases dramatically with each 'hot run'.

Really! How big is this Dalek? ;-)
(I usually fill two heaps both 4ft x 4ft x 4ft cubes)


--
Kay

"K" wrote in message
...
Derek Turner writes
K wrote:
snip

I'd say a cold heap made in the summer will be ready for use next
spring - the poster advising the hot heap was giving much the same
timescale - it surprised me, as I though hot heaps were faster than
that.

That was me, they are, but a single Dalek will take all summer to fill as
the volume decreases dramatically with each 'hot run'.

Really! How big is this Dalek? ;-)
(I usually fill two heaps both 4ft x 4ft x 4ft cubes)

Kay

The biggest Dalek I have seen is about 400L. which is considerably smaller
than your 4ft cubes.
Doesn't your cube hot compost even for a short time? I thought that a cold
compost was just the traditional compost heap (without containment).
In reality don't we all compost by both the cold and hot method depending on
the mix , weather conditions and perhaps skill.

Rupert writes


The biggest Dalek I have seen is about 400L. which is considerably smaller
than your 4ft cubes.
Doesn't your cube hot compost even for a short time?

Sometimes. Depends on the mix. In winter, there's a high proportion of
cardboard which makes for a more open and cooler heap. We get periods of
hotter running in summer when there's more greenery on it.


--
Kay

snip
I've found it quite useful to have some sort of a bottom on a compost bin-
it
means that when necessary I can move it somewhere else- and in my
largely-still-in-the-planning-stage garden I have needed to do this. With
composters that have solid plastic bottoms, it might be that all that is
necessary to give earthworm/insect/etc access to a composter that is sited
on
the soil is to make some holes in the base (a hot screwdriver or blade
heated
to red hot or nearly so will go through that plastic easily- but have good
ventilation or better still use an electric fan AND have good ventilation
if
doing this indoors- some plastics give off cyanide gas when heated this
much-
btw this is also a good way of adding more airholes to plastic composters
that don't have enough of them). Earthworms are very good at gettting into
places where they want to be- I keep finding them under planters and such
on
concrete paths and inside all sorts of things that are out in the garden-
including potted plants that I'm repotting (and that were potted with
sterile
compost, not garden soil). Some of these aren't earthworms but some
definitely are.

My composter/dalek is going to stay where it is, there's no other place for
it. So i will go for the bottomless pit option : )

garden virgin

snip
I think you'll find that they're still there next year. Autumn leaves have
very little nutritional value: the tree takes all the goodness out before
discarding them. They are used as a soil conditioner to add humus (a
complex carbohydrate) which improves soil structure. Leaf-mould and
compost are two different things. It's slow aerobic decomposition by fungi
that you're trying to achieve - hence the holes in the bag. The bag is
just there to keep them in one place, someone else suggested a wire basket
approach which does the same thing.

ok i won't bury the leaves but... i've been told i can have as much horse
manure from a muck heap (fresh manure on top, steaming & rotting in the
middle & good black stuff at the bottom). Can i grab a carrier bag full of
fresh manure or the half cooked steaming layer in the middle, mix it up with
the autumn leaves & let that sit in the bottom half of the dalek with the
bottom/base removed. Would this help break down the leaves? & can i begin
topping up with kitchen waste on the top half of the dalek? i'm thinking it
might help kick start the composter & at least get some of the leaves broken
down faster. i reckon i have about... 6-8 black bin sack full of brown
autumn leaves & would like to *recycle* as much as i can, probably bin the
rest as my garden is not big enough to leave them lying around in bags

garden virgin.

garden virgin wrote:
snip
I think you'll find that they're still there next year. Autumn leaves have
very little nutritional value: the tree takes all the goodness out before
discarding them. They are used as a soil conditioner to add humus (a
complex carbohydrate) which improves soil structure. Leaf-mould and
compost are two different things. It's slow aerobic decomposition by fungi
that you're trying to achieve - hence the holes in the bag. The bag is
just there to keep them in one place, someone else suggested a wire basket
approach which does the same thing.

ok i won't bury the leaves but... i've been told i can have as much horse
manure from a muck heap (fresh manure on top, steaming & rotting in the
middle & good black stuff at the bottom). Can i grab a carrier bag full of
fresh manure or the half cooked steaming layer in the middle, mix it up with
the autumn leaves & let that sit in the bottom half of the dalek with the
bottom/base removed. Would this help break down the leaves? & can i begin
topping up with kitchen waste on the top half of the dalek? i'm thinking it
might help kick start the composter & at least get some of the leaves broken
down faster. i reckon i have about... 6-8 black bin sack full of brown
autumn leaves & would like to *recycle* as much as i can, probably bin the
rest as my garden is not big enough to leave them lying around in bags

garden virgin.


Well, you could try it but which part of 'compost and leaf-mould are two
different things' and 'leaves break down by fungi, an entirely different
process' did you not understand? Bottom line: if it ever lived it CAN be
composted, given sufficient time, however sometimes there are more
appropriate ways of dealing with it e.g. wormery, fungal action,
shredding and using as mulch. In the end it's your composter, feel free
to experiment!

snip
Well, you could try it but which part of 'compost and leaf-mould are two
different things' and 'leaves break down by fungi, an entirely different
process' did you not understand? Bottom line: if it ever lived it CAN be
composted, given sufficient time, however sometimes there are more
appropriate ways of dealing with it e.g. wormery, fungal action, shredding
and using as mulch. In the end it's your composter, feel free to
experiment!

Thanks Derek, will ponder over your & others wise words & decide. But i
think the wormery option is now looking more feasible : )

garden virgin.

"garden virgin" - wrote in message
...
snip
Well, you could try it but which part of 'compost and leaf-mould are two
different things' and 'leaves break down by fungi, an entirely different
process' did you not understand? Bottom line: if it ever lived it CAN be
composted, given sufficient time, however sometimes there are more
appropriate ways of dealing with it e.g. wormery, fungal action,
shredding and using as mulch. In the end it's your composter, feel free
to experiment!

Thanks Derek, will ponder over your & others wise words & decide. But i
think the wormery option is now looking more feasible : )

garden virgin.


Forget the wormery option until you have mastered the composting thing.
If next year you compost the leaves when they first fall (i.e. still green)
you will have no problems. Once leaves have dried out then a separate leaf
composter is the better option.
A good compost heap is normally infested by worms and other bug type things
once the composting process is nearing completion.

Under no circumstances ever buy a wormery or worms -DIY is better.