At
the end of the job it worked out that the fitter (and there was only
one) cost me about £350 a day....nice work if you can get it.

Ah, but if you had paid by the hour the job would have taken 2 days at
£175 per day! (;-)

No it wouldn't - cos like everyone else who was on site he'd have worked for
his money or I'd have refused to pay him...in point of fact he probably
wasted about a day - he spent half of one afternoon sat in my garden on his
mobile sorting out some domestic issue! Obviously since I wasn't paying him
by the hour I didn't care BUT it actually only makes the thing worse cos if
he'd done 4 solid days work instead of 5 "lazy" days he'd have got the job
finished in 4 days & the effective hourly/daily rate would have been even
higher!

And the point is the firm I used charges about the same as everyone else - I
checked before I used them - and they ALL charge by the square metre - its a
rip off. When you finally translate it to an hourly price & compare it to
what I was paying carpenters, builders, electricians, plumbers etc etc etc
it was/is outrageous.

Its rather like garages, most do not charge actual labour hours for a
job they charge "standard hours" from a trade reference guide. The
good garages make more money by consistently beating the "standard"
times. That's how come they can have multiple jobs running at the same
time without keeping detailed timing records.

Don't get me started on the motor trade (!) Explain to me why it is when I
take my VW and My Wife's Audi to the same (authorised) dealer for servicing
I pay £60 an hour for one and £65 an hour for the other???? That said, when
you run a workshop that's dealing with volume like that its not so daft to
have menu pricing & furthermore, its easy to compare prces with other
dealers so it stays reasonably straight.

To an extent it is the same in Gardens: what you should expect to pay
for is a combination of time and expertise. Ask a novice to prune your
fruit trees or roses and he will take far longer than an expert. It is
fair and reasonable that the expert charges a higher hourly rate.

No issue with that idea....and I'd expect to pay a specialist a higher
hourly rate - I don't have a problem with that and I wouldn't ask a novice
to do a specialist's job....same goes for anything, be it gardening or
whatever

Quite.

I don't see a problem with charging a standard monthly rate, but doing
more work when it is needed and less at other times. People find that
sort of bill easier to pay, and quibble less over prices, which saves
everyone's time and money.

Give them an hourly rate and people will waste hours of your time
quibbling over exactly how long it will really take, or insisting you
explain it to them so they can do it instead. By the time you've done
that you need to charge them more to cover the cost of the quibble.

I always price by the job now: it gives a fairer basis for comparison
overall.

From the supplier side I can quite see why you like it that way - but then
you are in a very different business. I'm quite sure you take some jobs
(where there is a deliverable "product") on a fixed price basis & that makes
sense when you provide a single deliverable but I'd be equally surprised if
you don't have a consultancy day rate.

As a customer I bloody hate fixed pricing & won't entertain it - especially
for any kind of domestic labour. Why? because its far too open to abuse. It
happens round here a lot with Household cleaners - they march in & say
"it'll be £60 a week " (and thats for a fairly simple std 4 bed house) "and
we'll send a team of people". For the first few weeks you get three or four
people & they spend an hour or two & look very busy & are very thorough.

Then its only two people (cos someone is sick - only you never see them
again)....then suddenly you get one person - who may spend a bit longer but
not much & when you compare what you were getting in the first week or two
its nothing like the same. You find you're paying the thick end of £25-£30
an hour for a cleaner who's only skating over the surface. It happened to us
& its happened to 2 or 3 other people I know, all with different firms.

Same goes for Gardening. The original poster may well get someone in who
does a great job for the first month or two but lets be honest, look at the
size of his garden....it won't take an hour a week to tidy it up providing
its kept fairly simple - and bear in mind its the gardener who's designing
it! In the winter I suspect he'll be lucky to see the bloke once a
month.....now what's the hourly rate on that average out at???

I totally agree that the 'provide plants' thing does sound a bit too
vague and needs exploring further,

Well that's something we agree on!

and would add that 15 quid a week
sounds absurdly cheap if they really do come very week, unless the
gardener lives next door, or is already looking after other gardens in
the street.

You say that from a perspective of someone who runs a full trading business
with some overheads and who, no doubt, keeps books - I have a feeling that
the transaction we have been discussing would be strictly "cash only!"
You're right of course it might well be cheap IF they come every week of the
year - but I suspect that won't happen in which case it could look really
rather expensive & that's the whole point. The bloke who's offered this
OBVIOUSLY knows what he's doing as far as the transaction is concerned -
he's clearly doing a fair bit of it - hence the "completeness" of the offer.

I'd either tie him down as to the minimum number of hours labour I'd get
during the year and the exact quantity & type of plants I'd get or I
wouldn't touch it with a barge pole. If he won't have that discussion then
he's got something to hide & I rest my case!

I.