Howdy again, I'm chiming in all over the place *sigh*

"Fran" wrote in message
...
"len gardener" wrote in message

but when you get involved around the 'net and try to do any research
all you get is certificates, diplomas, institutes and the call for it
to be a uni degree and a senior school curriculum. and it all spells
money and they are not promoting pc as something everyone can do

(snip)
and for discenteres just do a search under pc and see what you get
lots and lots of certificates and diplomas, none of here is how simple
pc can be so get started today. pc is a mind set not a design course.


Well that is true to some extent, but if you think about it for a moment,
just how many home veggie gardening pages do you find when you do a google
search?

If I just do a hunt using the word "vegetables" I'm going to get up every
page with veggies on it whether I want it or not AND most of those pages
will be about commercial ventures:- vegetable wholesalers, vegetarian
restaurants, health practitioners extolling the value of their diet
services
that use vegetables, etc, etc etc.

People like you, who put up a homepage that includes veggies growing,
won't
necessarily know how to put in the info needed for search engines to pick
up
the site. Also, since you also probably have to pay for your home page
you
are less likely to put in much info that the rest of us would like to see.
The commercial world will always be to the forefront in putting the info
out
there because they will pay for professionals to make their page and they
will pay to do it well and for it to come up in each and every search that
uses the keyword of "permaculture".

Too true, web advertising is budgeted for in businesses now days, it's hard
to compete with that if you're an 'owner/builder' web page, but keep
plugging away there (lol, i also think if you put 'vegetables' into a search
engine you'd probably get a load of strange and probably unhygenic sounding
porn judging by the crap that's been flooding this group lately p)

You may object to the making money approach and think that all pc
practisioners should all do it for free and gratis but it has never been
that way from what I can tell. Friends of mine ran a pc course way, way
back in the very early days. They had met Mollison or knew him somehow
and
asked him to come and run a session. He agreed if he was put up for the
time he was there.
snip, but that must have been incredibly disheartening

Mollison hasn't done too badly off permaculture either, which is reasonable
since he & David Holmgren coined the phrase, then, iirc, copyrighted it, so
making a bob off the idea has always been there, but it is a bit of a pain
in the butt if you're given the impression that the only way to get into it
is to shell out a large amount of dosh to 'learn' it... I'm with you there
Len


Anyway I suspect that the grassroots bodies who are doing pc are probably
all busily out there doing it and not spending as much time on the
computer.

Just ignore the pc yuppies. You don't have to buy their way of doing it
and
as I said earlier I don't ever recall anyone who posted here regularly
ever
having had a cert or an interest in making money out of pc. Better to
stick
around here than those other forums.

Excellent advice Fran D And everyone who used to post here was busily
doing their own thing and learning as we went and sharing their experiences,
it'd be great to get that back, but i suppose monitoring the group,
responding to q's etc (which I know you guys do) and being welcoming to any
new people is probably the best way to get the ng back from the spammers and
breathe some life back into it...
just to save replying further down: I loved your story about the compost
and the worms, Fran - only people with gardeners hearts (and maybe
fisherperson hearts) would think to save the worms, it did make me laugh,
I'd be doing the same thing I think, and as to being 'old meat', I
resemble... er... resent that remark, lmao

Have a good weekend all,
Andrea