In article ,
songbird wrote:

Billy wrote:
...
If you got to http://www.polyfacefarms.com/default.aspx and click on
"Principles" there are 3 videos to watch. In the first video "Mimic
Nature", Daniel Salatin mentions that the turkeys get 20% of their feed
from the pasture, so it isn't a closed system.

sorry, slow dialup, i don't watch video
or youtube here...


Today on "Democracy Now" http://www.democracynow.org/ there are 2
reports on food production. One is on egg production and the other is on
meat production. They both fit nicely into the discussion that we we
having on the quality of food. They don't talk about increasing supply,
but rather about maintaining quality.

yea, i read something the other day in
the WSJ about eggs being recalled and new
rules (FDA i think) that just went into
effect. we'll see if they actually help.
two producers and hundreds of millions
of eggs.


Since the food supply has become so integrated, just on supplier can
screw up the system for many others.

what ever happened to monopoly enforcement?


It's like the dog food scandal,
where one supplier provided the cheapest source of protein powder, which
turned out to be adulterated with melamine and cyanuric acid to give the
appearance of higher levels of protein.

that was outright fraud. which is a moral
and ethical issue apart from sustainable
agricultural practices. i didn't follow
up what happened back in China but i think
there were comments about, "facing possible
execution."


songbird

Relax, he was executed. The dog food was feed to steers, pork, and fish.
Feel better?

"Pet Food Politics: The Chihuahua in the Coal Mine" by Marion Nestle
http://www.amazon.com/Pet-Food-Polit...520265890/ref=
sr_1_2?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1282796329&sr=1-2

She isn't the best of writers, but it is a good book.
--
- Billy
"Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the
merger of state and corporate power." - Benito Mussolini.
http://www.democracynow.org/2010/7/2/maude
http://english.aljazeera.net/video/m...515308172.html

Billy wrote:
In article ,
songbird wrote:

Billy wrote:
...
If you got to http://www.polyfacefarms.com/default.aspx and click
on
"Principles" there are 3 videos to watch. In the first video "Mimic
Nature", Daniel Salatin mentions that the turkeys get 20% of their
feed
from the pasture, so it isn't a closed system.

sorry, slow dialup, i don't watch video
or youtube here...


Today on "Democracy Now" http://www.democracynow.org/ there are 2
reports on food production. One is on egg production and the other
is on
meat production. They both fit nicely into the discussion that we we

having on the quality of food. They don't talk about increasing
supply,
but rather about maintaining quality.

yea, i read something the other day in
the WSJ about eggs being recalled and new
rules (FDA i think) that just went into
effect. we'll see if they actually help.
two producers and hundreds of millions
of eggs.


Since the food supply has become so integrated, just on supplier can

screw up the system for many others.

what ever happened to monopoly enforcement?


It's like the dog food scandal,
where one supplier provided the cheapest source of protein powder,
which
turned out to be adulterated with melamine and cyanuric acid to give
the
appearance of higher levels of protein.

that was outright fraud. which is a moral
and ethical issue apart from sustainable
agricultural practices. i didn't follow
up what happened back in China but i think
there were comments about, "facing possible
execution."


songbird

Relax, he was executed. The dog food was feed to steers, pork, and
fish.
Feel better?

"Pet Food Politics: The Chihuahua in the Coal Mine" by Marion Nestle
http://www.amazon.com/Pet-Food-Polit...520265890/ref=
sr_1_2?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1282796329&sr=1-2

She isn't the best of writers, but it is a good book.

Not just dog food! They were executed for putting the same stuff in
human baby food formulas which killed several babies in China. The baby
formulas was not sold in the US.

Have you purchased cod, catfish in stores? Product of China.
Some have statements like "Carbon Monoxide added for flavor enhancement"
on the bags????

--
Enjoy Life... Dan L

In article
-se
ptember.org,
Dan L wrote:

Billy wrote:
In article ,
songbird wrote:

Billy wrote:
...
If you got to http://www.polyfacefarms.com/default.aspx and click
on
"Principles" there are 3 videos to watch. In the first video "Mimic
Nature", Daniel Salatin mentions that the turkeys get 20% of their
feed
from the pasture, so it isn't a closed system.

sorry, slow dialup, i don't watch video
or youtube here...


Today on "Democracy Now" http://www.democracynow.org/ there are 2
reports on food production. One is on egg production and the other
is on
meat production. They both fit nicely into the discussion that we we

having on the quality of food. They don't talk about increasing
supply,
but rather about maintaining quality.

yea, i read something the other day in
the WSJ about eggs being recalled and new
rules (FDA i think) that just went into
effect. we'll see if they actually help.
two producers and hundreds of millions
of eggs.


Since the food supply has become so integrated, just on supplier can

screw up the system for many others.

what ever happened to monopoly enforcement?


It's like the dog food scandal,
where one supplier provided the cheapest source of protein powder,
which
turned out to be adulterated with melamine and cyanuric acid to give
the
appearance of higher levels of protein.

that was outright fraud. which is a moral
and ethical issue apart from sustainable
agricultural practices. i didn't follow
up what happened back in China but i think
there were comments about, "facing possible
execution."


songbird

Relax, he was executed. The dog food was feed to steers, pork, and
fish.
Feel better?

"Pet Food Politics: The Chihuahua in the Coal Mine" by Marion Nestle
http://www.amazon.com/Pet-Food-Polit...520265890/ref=
sr_1_2?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1282796329&sr=1-2

She isn't the best of writers, but it is a good book.

Not just dog food! They were executed for putting the same stuff in
human baby food formulas which killed several babies in China. The baby
formulas was not sold in the US.
China's economy is growing at a rate of 10%/year. This would probably
come under the heading of deadly growing pain. I saw an interview with
some of the workers of the factory where the wheat flour was laced with
melamine and cyanuric acid (they are about 5 times more deadly in
combination than alone), and the workers smiled and said, "Yeah, it
looks like it has more protein." They obviously didn't have a clue about
its effects on a living organism. People thought that they were buying
wheat gluten (not laced wheat flour). There isn't one wheat gluten for
animals and one for humans. This was one of the points that Amy Goodman
was trying to make about the integrated global economy. No one knows
what's in the food anymore, because it has be made from a mish-mash of
ingredients from around the planet. In 2006, China ranked third behind
India and Mexico in the number of food shipments refused by the FDA.
These dame neo-nutcake-liberals don't want any government regulations
because it impedes business. But as we can see with the egg recall,
people are getting sick because business is on the honor system. The
least we can do is give the FDA the authority to declare a recall when
they see a health concern. The FDA also needs to be funded for what it
has been mandated to do. The funding for health concerns should be taken
away from the USDA, which markets farm products (conflict of interest),
and be given to the FDA.

Have you purchased cod, catfish in stores? Product of China.
Some have statements like "Carbon Monoxide added for flavor enhancement"
on the bags????

That is damn decent of them. Here in the good ol' U.S. of A., we do it
without any kind notification.
http://meatisneat.wordpress.com/2009...aging-meat-in-
carbon-monoxide/
The carbon monoxide binds with the hemoglobin to keep the meat looking
fresh (red), no matter how old and funky it may be. This is done to some
meat that is wrapped in plastic. It is also the reason that I won't buy
meat that is wrapped in plastic, like Saturday's, barbecue, pork ribs.

How's "Eaarth" coming along?
--
- Billy
"Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the
merger of state and corporate power." - Benito Mussolini.
http://www.democracynow.org/2010/7/2/maude
http://english.aljazeera.net/video/m...515308172.html

In article
,
Billy wrote:

In article
-se
ptember.org,
Dan L wrote:

Billy wrote:
In article ,
songbird wrote:

Billy wrote:
...
If you got to http://www.polyfacefarms.com/default.aspx and click
on
"Principles" there are 3 videos to watch. In the first video "Mimic
Nature", Daniel Salatin mentions that the turkeys get 20% of their
feed
from the pasture, so it isn't a closed system.

sorry, slow dialup, i don't watch video
or youtube here...


Today on "Democracy Now" http://www.democracynow.org/ there are 2
reports on food production. One is on egg production and the other
is on
meat production. They both fit nicely into the discussion that we we

having on the quality of food. They don't talk about increasing
supply,
but rather about maintaining quality.

yea, i read something the other day in
the WSJ about eggs being recalled and new
rules (FDA i think) that just went into
effect. we'll see if they actually help.
two producers and hundreds of millions
of eggs.


Since the food supply has become so integrated, just on supplier can

screw up the system for many others.

what ever happened to monopoly enforcement?


It's like the dog food scandal,
where one supplier provided the cheapest source of protein powder,
which
turned out to be adulterated with melamine and cyanuric acid to give
the
appearance of higher levels of protein.

that was outright fraud. which is a moral
and ethical issue apart from sustainable
agricultural practices. i didn't follow
up what happened back in China but i think
there were comments about, "facing possible
execution."


songbird

Relax, he was executed. The dog food was feed to steers, pork, and
fish.
Feel better?

"Pet Food Politics: The Chihuahua in the Coal Mine" by Marion Nestle
http://www.amazon.com/Pet-Food-Polit...520265890/ref=
sr_1_2?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1282796329&sr=1-2

She isn't the best of writers, but it is a good book.

Not just dog food! They were executed for putting the same stuff in
human baby food formulas which killed several babies in China. The baby
formulas was not sold in the US.
China's economy is growing at a rate of 10%/year. This would probably
come under the heading of deadly growing pain. I saw an interview with
some of the workers of the factory where the wheat flour was laced with
melamine and cyanuric acid (they are about 5 times more deadly in
combination than alone), and the workers smiled and said, "Yeah, it
looks like it has more protein." They obviously didn't have a clue about
its effects on a living organism. People thought that they were buying
wheat gluten (not laced wheat flour). There isn't one wheat gluten for
animals and one for humans. This was one of the points that Amy Goodman
was trying to make about the integrated global economy. No one knows
what's in the food anymore, because it has be made from a mish-mash of
ingredients from around the planet. In 2006, China ranked third behind
India and Mexico in the number of food shipments refused by the FDA.
These dame neo-nutcake-liberals don't want any government regulations
because it impedes business. But as we can see with the egg recall,
people are getting sick because business is on the honor system. The
least we can do is give the FDA the authority to declare a recall when
they see a health concern. The FDA also needs to be funded for what it
has been mandated to do. The funding for health concerns should be taken
away from the USDA, which markets farm products (conflict of interest),
and be given to the FDA.

I have sometimes wondered about wheat gluten. When I make my own
homemade breads I do not have stomach upsets. However I almost always
get heartburn and upset stomach from "added gluten" in store bought
products. I have been tested negative for celiac or wheat allergies.
I make my own foods and tend to stay away from packaged foods.
Why I have my own chickens and a Jersey milk cow.

Have you purchased cod, catfish in stores? Product of China.
Some have statements like "Carbon Monoxide added for flavor enhancement"
on the bags????

That is damn decent of them. Here in the good ol' U.S. of A., we do it
without any kind notification.
http://meatisneat.wordpress.com/2009...aging-meat-in-
carbon-monoxide/
The carbon monoxide binds with the hemoglobin to keep the meat looking
fresh (red), no matter how old and funky it may be. This is done to some
meat that is wrapped in plastic. It is also the reason that I won't buy
meat that is wrapped in plastic, like Saturday's, barbecue, pork ribs.
A very interesting site. You correct "Damn decent of them"! Other
companies have been doing it for years!!!! We are living on a new world.
I think I am going to get a boat a start fishing here in the great
lakes. I do miss the taste of good sea food, not just lake food. Only
thing in sea food markets are the bug foods, lobster, shrimp and oysters.

How's "Eaarth" coming along?
A very good book, currently on page thirty. He seemed to give up on
changing the world. Shifted to self protection. Seems like I have been
doing just that myself in the last few years. Just like the economy and
global warming, what can one do except, do our part and protect
ourselves.

We are living on a new world called "Eaarth". Learn to live with it.

--
Enjoy Life... Dan
Garden in Zone 5 South East Michigan.
Using a Laptop

"Dan L." wrote in message

Why I have my own chickens and a Jersey milk cow.

Mmmmmm.. A Jersey. How much does she produce a day?

"FarmI" ask@itshall be given wrote:
"Dan L." wrote in message

Why I have my own chickens and a Jersey milk cow.

Mmmmmm.. A Jersey. How much does she produce a day?

Nothing yet, impregnated the cow last week. She should produce more than
I can drink. Will learn to make my own cheese products with the extra.
The cheese making equipment is not cheap. I read, not done it yet, it
takes 17 pounds of milk and one year to make one pound of parmesan
cheese. Bessy plays like a dog, wants to be petted and runs and romps
around. Sometimes I get a little nervous around her with her playfulness
and hope I do not get hurt.

--
Enjoy Life... Dan L

"Dan L" wrote in message
"FarmI" ask@itshall be given wrote:
"Dan L." wrote in message

Why I have my own chickens and a Jersey milk cow.

Mmmmmm.. A Jersey. How much does she produce a day?

Nothing yet, impregnated the cow last week. She should produce more than
I can drink.

I'm sure she will :-))

Will learn to make my own cheese products with the extra.
The cheese making equipment is not cheap.

You can make soft cheese very easily and wouldn't need anything more than
you'd have in your kitchen. Either make yoghurt or make junket using
Hansen's junket tablets (although I seem to recall that USian for Junket is
something else - curd perhaps???). Line a colander with an old soft tea
towel, pour in the yoghurt or junket and tie up the towle and hang it up and
leave it to drip overnight. if I ever have to let soemthign drip overnight
then I upturn and old stool that I keep just for this purpose and hang
whatever has to drip off a long handled wooden spoon place horizontally
across the bottom of the stool.

I read, not done it yet, it
takes 17 pounds of milk and one year to make one pound of parmesan
cheese.

Yeah I think that'd be about right. I've read up on it to as it's something
that's always interested me, but we don't have a dairy cow, I've only ever
made soft cheese but they are delicious and easy to do.

Bessy plays like a dog, wants to be petted and runs and romps
around. Sometimes I get a little nervous around her with her playfulness
and hope I do not get hurt.

Yeah. I'd be a bit nervous too. If she ever does start throwing her weight
around and pushing you, get rid of her instantly and replacce her.

Dan L wrote:
"FarmI" ask@itshall be given wrote:
"Dan L." wrote in message

Why I have my own chickens and a Jersey milk cow.

Mmmmmm.. A Jersey. How much does she produce a day?

Nothing yet, impregnated the cow last week.

How was it for you? At least she wouldn't want to share your cigarette
afterwards.

She should produce more
than I can drink. Will learn to make my own cheese products with the
extra. The cheese making equipment is not cheap. I read, not done it
yet, it takes 17 pounds of milk and one year to make one pound of
parmesan cheese. Bessy plays like a dog, wants to be petted and runs
and romps around. Sometimes I get a little nervous around her with
her playfulness and hope I do not get hurt.

I have the same worry when Mootilda bangs her face into the feed bucket I am
holding. Cows seem very rough compared to horses. I am pretty sure she
won't deliberately hurt me but the horns come close.

David

Dan L wrote:
FarmI wrote:
Dan L.wrote:

Why I have my own chickens and a Jersey milk cow.

Mmmmmm.. A Jersey. How much does she produce a day?

Nothing yet, impregnated the cow last week. She should produce more
than I can drink. Will learn to make my own cheese products with the
extra. The cheese making equipment is not cheap. I read, not done it
yet, it takes 17 pounds of milk and one year to make one pound of
parmesan cheese.

sterilized buckets, cheese-cloth and a culture of some kind.
none of these are majorly expensive. some heat source during
the cooler months if your place of production is not insulated
well... the most expensive part is the time it takes to finish or
age and that means storage space. the people who use caves
have it right. mmm!


Bessy plays like a dog, wants to be petted and runs
and romps around.

uhoh,


Sometimes I get a little nervous around her with
her playfulness and hope I do not get hurt.

you gotta show her who's boss. physics, otherwise,
will not be your friend, in this equation.


songbird