I'm about to plant some peas on Friday.
................................
U.S. Military Launches Spy Operation Using Fake Online Identities
Online Persona Management

The Huffington Post Amy Lee First Posted: 03/17/11 02:11 PM Updated:
03/17/11 02:11 PM

The U.S. Military has purchased software designed to create and control
false online personas in an attempt to use social media and other
websites to counter anti-U.S. messaging.

According to the contract between US Central Command (Centcom) and
California company Ntrepid, the software would let each user control 10
personas, each "replete with background, history, supporting details,
and cyber presences that are technically, culturally and geographically
consistent." The software would also be able to let personas "appear to
originate in nearly any part of the world" and interact through
"conventional online services and social media platforms," while using a
static IP address for each persona to maintain a consistent online
identity.

These false online personas, also known as "sock puppets," would be
equipped to seem like real people while entering online discussion
through blogs, tweets, chats, and more. With a false persona, a user
could discredit opponents, or create the semblance of consensus.

The Guardian explains, "The US military is developing software that will
let it secretly manipulate social media using fake online personas
designed to influence internet conversations and spread pro-American
propaganda."

Centcom spokesman Commander Bill Speaks told The Guardian that the
software "supports classified blogging activities on foreign-language
websites to enable Centcom to counter violent extremist and enemy
propaganda outside the US."

The technology would not be used in America. "We do not target U.S.
audiences, and we do not conduct these activities on sites owned by U.S.
companies," Speaks told the Washington Times.

At a senate hearing March 1, Centcom commander James N. Mattis said,
"Our enemies operate within cyberspace (and its associated relevant
physical infrastructure) to plan, coordinate, recruit, train, equip,
execute and garner support for operations against the U.S., its allies
and interests. Clearly, in the information age, our military must adapt
to this new domain of warfare."
Advertisement

The online persona project is thought to fall under the domain of
Operation Earnest Voice, which oversees Centcom's Information
Operations, and in the words of Mattis, "seeks to disrupt recruitment
and training of suicide bombers; deny safe havens for our adversaries;
and counter extremist ideology and propaganda."

Online persona management looks to rely heavily on many American social
media outlets, like Twitter and Facebook. But the latter has
aggressively promoted its philosophy of tying real names to real online
identities, deleting profiles it suspects to be fake, or which use false
names. In fact, Facebook's terms of use clearly state, "You will not
provide any false personal information on Facebook."

The users controlling the personas would be hidden in a variety of ways,
including randomizing the IP addresses they accessed the software with,
and "traffic mixing," or blending web traffic with that outside of
Centcom to provide "excellent cover and powerful deniability."

The strategy may sound familiar. Last month, hacker group Anonymous
unloaded a batch of 50,000 emails from security firm HBGary, where
documents indicated that the firm was in the process of developing their
own persona management software. The document outlined some of the
proposed strategies for creating verisimilitude:

Using hashtags and gaming some location based check-in services we
can make it appear as if a persona was actually at a conference and
introduce himself/herself to key individuals as part of the exercise, as
one example. There are a variety of social media tricks we can use to
add a level of realness to all fictitious personas

--
Bill S. Jersey USA zone 5 shade garden

http://uppitywis.org/ live WI

Bill who putters wrote:
I'm about to plant some peas on Friday.
...............................
U.S. Military Launches Spy Operation Using Fake Online Identities
Online Persona Management

The Huffington Post Amy Lee First Posted: 03/17/11 02:11 PM Updated:
03/17/11 02:11 PM

The U.S. Military has purchased software designed to create and control
false online personas in an attempt to use social media and other
websites to counter anti-U.S. messaging.

According to the contract between US Central Command (Centcom) and
California company Ntrepid, the software would let each user control 10
personas, each "replete with background, history, supporting details,
and cyber presences that are technically, culturally and geographically
consistent." The software would also be able to let personas "appear to
originate in nearly any part of the world" and interact through
"conventional online services and social media platforms," while using a
static IP address for each persona to maintain a consistent online
identity.

These false online personas, also known as "sock puppets," would be
equipped to seem like real people while entering online discussion
through blogs, tweets, chats, and more. With a false persona, a user
could discredit opponents, or create the semblance of consensus.

The Guardian explains, "The US military is developing software that will
let it secretly manipulate social media using fake online personas
designed to influence internet conversations and spread pro-American
propaganda."

Centcom spokesman Commander Bill Speaks told The Guardian that the
software "supports classified blogging activities on foreign-language
websites to enable Centcom to counter violent extremist and enemy
propaganda outside the US."

The technology would not be used in America. "We do not target U.S.
audiences, and we do not conduct these activities on sites owned by U.S.
companies," Speaks told the Washington Times.

At a senate hearing March 1, Centcom commander James N. Mattis said,
"Our enemies operate within cyberspace (and its associated relevant
physical infrastructure) to plan, coordinate, recruit, train, equip,
execute and garner support for operations against the U.S., its allies
and interests. Clearly, in the information age, our military must adapt
to this new domain of warfare."
Advertisement

The online persona project is thought to fall under the domain of
Operation Earnest Voice, which oversees Centcom's Information
Operations, and in the words of Mattis, "seeks to disrupt recruitment
and training of suicide bombers; deny safe havens for our adversaries;
and counter extremist ideology and propaganda."

Online persona management looks to rely heavily on many American social
media outlets, like Twitter and Facebook. But the latter has
aggressively promoted its philosophy of tying real names to real online
identities, deleting profiles it suspects to be fake, or which use false
names. In fact, Facebook's terms of use clearly state, "You will not
provide any false personal information on Facebook."

The users controlling the personas would be hidden in a variety of ways,
including randomizing the IP addresses they accessed the software with,
and "traffic mixing," or blending web traffic with that outside of
Centcom to provide "excellent cover and powerful deniability."

The strategy may sound familiar. Last month, hacker group Anonymous
unloaded a batch of 50,000 emails from security firm HBGary, where
documents indicated that the firm was in the process of developing their
own persona management software. The document outlined some of the
proposed strategies for creating verisimilitude:

Using hashtags and gaming some location based check-in services we
can make it appear as if a persona was actually at a conference and
introduce himself/herself to key individuals as part of the exercise, as
one example. There are a variety of social media tricks we can use to
add a level of realness to all fictitious personas

Just in case that is true, I will say that I truly believe 2+2=5 and I love
Big Brother.

This may work for most people. After all look at how many people believe
that Glenn Beck is the right hand of God and believes everything he says.
If not, could be more blowback. There also seems to be a greater interest
for creating AI avatars in computer applications in other computer groups.

--
Enjoy Life... Nad R (Garden in zone 5a Michigan)

Bill who putters wrote:
I'm about to plant some peas on Friday.
...............................
U.S. Military Launches Spy Operation Using Fake Online Identities
Online Persona Management

The Huffington Post Amy Lee First Posted: 03/17/11 02:11 PM Updated:
03/17/11 02:11 PM

The U.S. Military has purchased software designed to create and control
false online personas in an attempt to use social media and other
websites to counter anti-U.S. messaging.

According to the contract between US Central Command (Centcom) and
California company Ntrepid, the software would let each user control 10
personas, each "replete with background, history, supporting details,
and cyber presences that are technically, culturally and geographically
consistent." The software would also be able to let personas "appear to
originate in nearly any part of the world" and interact through
"conventional online services and social media platforms," while using a
static IP address for each persona to maintain a consistent online
identity.

These false online personas, also known as "sock puppets," would be
equipped to seem like real people while entering online discussion
through blogs, tweets, chats, and more. With a false persona, a user
could discredit opponents, or create the semblance of consensus.

The Guardian explains, "The US military is developing software that will
let it secretly manipulate social media using fake online personas
designed to influence internet conversations and spread pro-American
propaganda."

Centcom spokesman Commander Bill Speaks told The Guardian that the
software "supports classified blogging activities on foreign-language
websites to enable Centcom to counter violent extremist and enemy
propaganda outside the US."

The technology would not be used in America. "We do not target U.S.
audiences, and we do not conduct these activities on sites owned by U.S.
companies," Speaks told the Washington Times.

At a senate hearing March 1, Centcom commander James N. Mattis said,
"Our enemies operate within cyberspace (and its associated relevant
physical infrastructure) to plan, coordinate, recruit, train, equip,
execute and garner support for operations against the U.S., its allies
and interests. Clearly, in the information age, our military must adapt
to this new domain of warfare."
Advertisement

The online persona project is thought to fall under the domain of
Operation Earnest Voice, which oversees Centcom's Information
Operations, and in the words of Mattis, "seeks to disrupt recruitment
and training of suicide bombers; deny safe havens for our adversaries;
and counter extremist ideology and propaganda."

Online persona management looks to rely heavily on many American social
media outlets, like Twitter and Facebook. But the latter has
aggressively promoted its philosophy of tying real names to real online
identities, deleting profiles it suspects to be fake, or which use false
names. In fact, Facebook's terms of use clearly state, "You will not
provide any false personal information on Facebook."

The users controlling the personas would be hidden in a variety of ways,
including randomizing the IP addresses they accessed the software with,
and "traffic mixing," or blending web traffic with that outside of
Centcom to provide "excellent cover and powerful deniability."

The strategy may sound familiar. Last month, hacker group Anonymous
unloaded a batch of 50,000 emails from security firm HBGary, where
documents indicated that the firm was in the process of developing their
own persona management software. The document outlined some of the
proposed strategies for creating verisimilitude:

Using hashtags and gaming some location based check-in services we
can make it appear as if a persona was actually at a conference and
introduce himself/herself to key individuals as part of the exercise, as
one example. There are a variety of social media tricks we can use to
add a level of realness to all fictitious personas

Just in case that is true, I will say that I truly believe 2+2=5 and I love
Big Brother.

This may work for most people. After all look at how many people believe
that Glenn Beck is the right hand of God and believes everything he says.
If not, could be more blowback. There also seems to be a greater interest
for creating AI avatars in computer applications in other computer groups.

--
Enjoy Life... Nad R (Garden in zone 5a Michigan)

Yes, it is off topic. Possibly you have incorrectly assumed that people in
this (REC.GARDENS.EDIBLE) group give a rat's ass about this. Is this story
news to you? I heard it over a week ago, and I encourage you to consider
the source.

The Huffington Post Amy Lee First Posted: 03/17/11 02:11 PM Updated:
03/17/11 02:11 PM

Really??

Posting this kind of crap here is why I rarely check this group. VERY
little informative information regarding edible gardens...

Just a bunch of people with way too much time on their hands. Have you
considered getting out of the house? Maybe you should try planting
something and actually gardening. Do some research on, uh.... maybe the use
of a product called "Thrive". Ever heard of it? It makes use of
mycorrhizal fungi to improve and increase the amount of microbial activity
in the soil, which leads to improved root development and ultimately
improves rooting. In short, it makes your EDIBLE GARDENS healthier with
stronger root systems requiring LESS WATERING. (not sure about you, but I
have to PAY for my water, and in the heat of my zone 8 summer garden, it
makes things expensive) I suggest you spend more time researching things
which can actually make a difference in EDIBLE GARDENS, and less time paying
any attention to the Huffing post worrying about the government making up
false identities.
Get a life and bring relevant information to the group.
I have more suggestions regarding EDIBLE GARDENS, which can actually make a
difference in increased production and healthier soil and plants, but I
guess it remains to be seen if you care more about that or some ridiculous
*alleged* conspiracy.

Google search for;
Vegetable Thrive
or try
www.alphabiosystems.com

It works.
(I'm not affiliated)

"Bill who putters" wrote in message
...
I'm about to plant some peas on Friday.
...............................
U.S. Military Launches Spy Operation Using Fake Online Identities
Online Persona Management

The Huffington Post Amy Lee First Posted: 03/17/11 02:11 PM Updated:
03/17/11 02:11 PM

The U.S. Military has purchased software designed to create and control
false online personas in an attempt to use social media and other
websites to counter anti-U.S. messaging.

According to the contract between US Central Command (Centcom) and
California company Ntrepid, the software would let each user control 10
personas, each "replete with background, history, supporting details,
and cyber presences that are technically, culturally and geographically
consistent." The software would also be able to let personas "appear to
originate in nearly any part of the world" and interact through
"conventional online services and social media platforms," while using a
static IP address for each persona to maintain a consistent online
identity.

These false online personas, also known as "sock puppets," would be
equipped to seem like real people while entering online discussion
through blogs, tweets, chats, and more. With a false persona, a user
could discredit opponents, or create the semblance of consensus.

The Guardian explains, "The US military is developing software that will
let it secretly manipulate social media using fake online personas
designed to influence internet conversations and spread pro-American
propaganda."

Centcom spokesman Commander Bill Speaks told The Guardian that the
software "supports classified blogging activities on foreign-language
websites to enable Centcom to counter violent extremist and enemy
propaganda outside the US."

The technology would not be used in America. "We do not target U.S.
audiences, and we do not conduct these activities on sites owned by U.S.
companies," Speaks told the Washington Times.

At a senate hearing March 1, Centcom commander James N. Mattis said,
"Our enemies operate within cyberspace (and its associated relevant
physical infrastructure) to plan, coordinate, recruit, train, equip,
execute and garner support for operations against the U.S., its allies
and interests. Clearly, in the information age, our military must adapt
to this new domain of warfare."
Advertisement

The online persona project is thought to fall under the domain of
Operation Earnest Voice, which oversees Centcom's Information
Operations, and in the words of Mattis, "seeks to disrupt recruitment
and training of suicide bombers; deny safe havens for our adversaries;
and counter extremist ideology and propaganda."

Online persona management looks to rely heavily on many American social
media outlets, like Twitter and Facebook. But the latter has
aggressively promoted its philosophy of tying real names to real online
identities, deleting profiles it suspects to be fake, or which use false
names. In fact, Facebook's terms of use clearly state, "You will not
provide any false personal information on Facebook."

The users controlling the personas would be hidden in a variety of ways,
including randomizing the IP addresses they accessed the software with,
and "traffic mixing," or blending web traffic with that outside of
Centcom to provide "excellent cover and powerful deniability."

The strategy may sound familiar. Last month, hacker group Anonymous
unloaded a batch of 50,000 emails from security firm HBGary, where
documents indicated that the firm was in the process of developing their
own persona management software. The document outlined some of the
proposed strategies for creating verisimilitude:

Using hashtags and gaming some location based check-in services we
can make it appear as if a persona was actually at a conference and
introduce himself/herself to key individuals as part of the exercise, as
one example. There are a variety of social media tricks we can use to
add a level of realness to all fictitious personas

--
Bill S. Jersey USA zone 5 shade garden

http://uppitywis.org/ live WI

In article ,
"Thos" wrote:

Yes, it is off topic. Possibly you have incorrectly assumed that people in
this (REC.GARDENS.EDIBLE) group give a rat's ass about this. Is this story
news to you? I heard it over a week ago, and I encourage you to consider
the source.

The Huffington Post Amy Lee First Posted: 03/17/11 02:11 PM Updated:
03/17/11 02:11 PM

Really??

Posting this kind of crap here is why I rarely check this group. VERY
little informative information regarding edible gardens...

Just a bunch of people with way too much time on their hands. Have you
considered getting out of the house? Maybe you should try planting
something and actually gardening. Do some research on, uh.... maybe the use
of a product called "Thrive". Ever heard of it? It makes use of
mycorrhizal fungi to improve and increase the amount of microbial activity
in the soil, which leads to improved root development and ultimately
improves rooting. In short, it makes your EDIBLE GARDENS healthier with
stronger root systems requiring LESS WATERING. (not sure about you, but I
have to PAY for my water, and in the heat of my zone 8 summer garden, it
makes things expensive) I suggest you spend more time researching things
which can actually make a difference in EDIBLE GARDENS, and less time paying
any attention to the Huffing post worrying about the government making up
false identities.
Get a life and bring relevant information to the group.
I have more suggestions regarding EDIBLE GARDENS, which can actually make a
difference in increased production and healthier soil and plants, but I
guess it remains to be seen if you care more about that or some ridiculous
*alleged* conspiracy.

Google search for;
Vegetable Thrive
or try
www.alphabiosystems.com

It works.
(I'm not affiliated)

"Bill who putters" wrote in message
...
I'm about to plant some peas on Friday.
...............................
U.S. Military Launches Spy Operation Using Fake Online Identities
Online Persona Management

The Huffington Post Amy Lee First Posted: 03/17/11 02:11 PM Updated:
03/17/11 02:11 PM

The U.S. Military has purchased software designed to create and control
false online personas in an attempt to use social media and other
websites to counter anti-U.S. messaging.

According to the contract between US Central Command (Centcom) and
California company Ntrepid, the software would let each user control 10
personas, each "replete with background, history, supporting details,
and cyber presences that are technically, culturally and geographically
consistent." The software would also be able to let personas "appear to
originate in nearly any part of the world" and interact through
"conventional online services and social media platforms," while using a
static IP address for each persona to maintain a consistent online
identity.

These false online personas, also known as "sock puppets," would be
equipped to seem like real people while entering online discussion
through blogs, tweets, chats, and more. With a false persona, a user
could discredit opponents, or create the semblance of consensus.

The Guardian explains, "The US military is developing software that will
let it secretly manipulate social media using fake online personas
designed to influence internet conversations and spread pro-American
propaganda."

Centcom spokesman Commander Bill Speaks told The Guardian that the
software "supports classified blogging activities on foreign-language
websites to enable Centcom to counter violent extremist and enemy
propaganda outside the US."

The technology would not be used in America. "We do not target U.S.
audiences, and we do not conduct these activities on sites owned by U.S.
companies," Speaks told the Washington Times.

At a senate hearing March 1, Centcom commander James N. Mattis said,
"Our enemies operate within cyberspace (and its associated relevant
physical infrastructure) to plan, coordinate, recruit, train, equip,
execute and garner support for operations against the U.S., its allies
and interests. Clearly, in the information age, our military must adapt
to this new domain of warfare."
Advertisement

The online persona project is thought to fall under the domain of
Operation Earnest Voice, which oversees Centcom's Information
Operations, and in the words of Mattis, "seeks to disrupt recruitment
and training of suicide bombers; deny safe havens for our adversaries;
and counter extremist ideology and propaganda."

Online persona management looks to rely heavily on many American social
media outlets, like Twitter and Facebook. But the latter has
aggressively promoted its philosophy of tying real names to real online
identities, deleting profiles it suspects to be fake, or which use false
names. In fact, Facebook's terms of use clearly state, "You will not
provide any false personal information on Facebook."

The users controlling the personas would be hidden in a variety of ways,
including randomizing the IP addresses they accessed the software with,
and "traffic mixing," or blending web traffic with that outside of
Centcom to provide "excellent cover and powerful deniability."

The strategy may sound familiar. Last month, hacker group Anonymous
unloaded a batch of 50,000 emails from security firm HBGary, where
documents indicated that the firm was in the process of developing their
own persona management software. The document outlined some of the
proposed strategies for creating verisimilitude:

Using hashtags and gaming some location based check-in services we
can make it appear as if a persona was actually at a conference and
introduce himself/herself to key individuals as part of the exercise, as
one example. There are a variety of social media tricks we can use to
add a level of realness to all fictitious personas

--
Bill S. Jersey USA zone 5 shade garden

http://uppitywis.org/ live WI





I'd suggest you stick some of that Thrive up your anal ass.

--
Bill S. Jersey USA zone 5 shade garden

http://uppitywis.org/ live WI

On Mar 18, 7:40*am, Bill who putters wrote:
In article ,



Angry? then quit posting such dribble and learn to address your
paranoia and the rest of your esteem issues in a different manner and
on a different forum. Your eco-fringe propaganda is getting as bad
and as inaccurate as his and has nothing to do with the act of
gardening.

Eco-fringe propaganda snipped.

When you come back from this mission from God, you really should spend
some time in a garden and a lot less in your ideologue chat rooms.

In article
,
Gunner wrote:

On Mar 18, 7:40*am, Bill who putters wrote:
In article ,



Angry?
No just sad.

Then quit posting such dribble and learn to address your
paranoia and the rest of your esteem issues in a different manner and
on a different forum.
I will seek professional help perhaps FOX news.

Your eco-fringe propaganda is getting as bad
and as inaccurate as his and has nothing to do with the act of
gardening.

Who is this "his" you mention?

Bill a paranoid dribbler with esteem issues diagnosed by some anonymous
guy? called Gunner who must get his button pushed so easily.

--
Bill S. Jersey USA zone 5 shade garden

http://uppitywis.org/ live WI

In article
,
Gunner wrote:

On Mar 18, 7:40*am, Bill who putters wrote:
In article ,



Angry? then quit posting such dribble and learn to address your
paranoia and the rest of your esteem issues in a different manner and
on a different forum. Your eco-fringe propaganda is getting as bad
and as inaccurate as his and has nothing to do with the act of
gardening.

You don't show that the article is "dribble".
You don't show that Bill is "paranoid" or has "esteem issues".
You don't show that the article was "eco-fringe propaganda".
You don't show that you understand when a post is tagged "OT",
that it will be "Off Topic".
You don't show anything, nothing at all, except poor toilet training.

You don't seem to understand that everything is connected, just like in
a garden, e.g. soil and sky are connected.

You don't seem to understand that gardeners are people too.

If you don't want to read "OT" comments, skip them.

If you don't want to read Bill who Putters, kill file him, as I have
with you.

Capisce!


P.S.S. Since we are off topic any way ;O)

The Shock Doctrine: The Rise of Disaster Capitalism by Naomi Klein

http://www.amazon.com/Shock-Doctrine...ism/dp/0312427
999/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1300208360&sr=1-1
(Available at better libraries near you.)

In a strange coincidence, the Tiananmen Square massacre took place on
the same day as Solidarity's historic election sweep in Poland‹June 4,
1989. They were, in a way, two very different studies in the shock
doctrine. Both countries had needed to exploit shock and fear to push
through a free-market transformation. In China, where the state used the
gloves-off methods of terror, torture and assassination, the result was,
from a market perspective, an unqualified success. In Poland, where only
the shock of economic crisis and rapid change were harnessed‹and there
was no overt violence--the effects of the shock eventually wore off, and
the results were far more ambiguous.

In Poland, shock therapy may have been imposed after elections, but it
made a mockery of the democratic process since it directly conflicted
with the wishes of the overwhelming majority of voters who had cast
their ballots for Solidarity. As late as 1992, 60 percent of Poles still
opposed privatization for heavy industry. Defending his unpopular
actions, Sachs claimed he had no choice, likening his role to that of a
surgeon in an emergency room. "When a guy comes into the emergency room
and his heart's stopped, you just rip open the sternum and you don't
worry about the scars that you leave, "he said. "The idea is to get the
guy's heart beating again. And you make a bloody mess. But you don't
have any choice."57

But once Poles recovered from the initial surgery, they had questions
about both the doctor and the treatment. Shock therapy in Poland did not
cause "momentary dislocations," as Sachs had predicted. It caused a
full-blown depression: a 30 percent reduction in industrial production
in the two years after the first round of reforms. With government
cutbacks and cheap imports flooding in, unemployment skyrocketed, and in
1993 it reached 25 percent in some areas‹a wrenching change in a country
that, under Communism, for all its many abuses and hardships, had no
open joblessness. Even when the


192 THE SHOCK DOCTRINE

economy began growing again, high unemployment remained chronic.
According to the World Bank's most recent figures, Poland has an
unemployment rate of 20 percent‹the highest in the European Union. For
those under twenty-four, the situation is far worse: 40 percent of young
workers were unemployed in 2006, twice the ELJ average. Most dramatic
are the number of people in poverty: in 1989, 15 percent of Poland's
population was living below the poverty line; in 2005, 59 percent of
Poles had fallen below the line.58 Shock therapy, which eroded job
protection and made daily life far more expensive, was not the route to
Poland's becoming one of Europe's "normal" countries (with their strong
labor laws and generous social benefits) but to the same gaping
disparities that have accompanied the counterrevolution everywhere it
has triumphed, from Chile to China.

The fact that it was Solidarity, the party built by Poland's blue-collar
workers, that oversaw the creation of this permanent underclass
represented a bitter betrayal, one that bred a deep cynicism and anger
in the country that has never fully lifted. Solidarity's leaders often
play down the party's socialist roots, with Walesa now claiming that as
far back as 1980 he knew they would "have to build capitalism." Karol
Modzelewski, a Solidarity militant and intellectual who spent eight and
a half years in Communist jails, retorts angrily, "I wouldn't have spent
a week nor a month, let alone eight and a half years in jail for
capitalism!"59

For the first year and a half of Solidarity rule, workers believed their
heroes when they were assured that the pain was temporary, a necessary
stop on the way to bringing Poland into modern Europe Even in the face
of soaring unemployment, they staged only a smattering of strikes and
waited patiently for the therapeutic part of their shock therapy to take
effect. When the promised recovery didn't arrive, at least not in the
form of jobs, Solidarity's members were simply confused: How could their
own movement have delivered a standard of living worse than that under
Communism? "[Solidarity] defended me in 1980 when I set up a union
committee," one forty-one-year-old construction worker said. "But when 1
went to them for help this time, they told me that I have to suffer for
the sake of reform."60

About eighteen months into Poland's period of "extraordinary politics,"
Solidarity's base had had enough and demanded an end to the experiment.
The extreme dissatisfaction was reflected in a marked increase in the
number of strikes: in 1990, when workers were still giving Solidarity a
free pass, there were only 250 strikes; by 1992 there were more than
6,000 such protests.61 Faced with this pressure from below, the
government was forced to slow down


SLAMMING THE DOOR ON HISTORY 193

its more ambitious privatization plans. By the end of 1993 ‹a year that
saw al-
most 7,500 strikes‹62 percent of Poland's total industry was still
public.62

The fact that Polish workers managed to stop the wholesale privatization
of their country means that as painful as the reforms were, they could
have been far worse. The wave of strikes unquestionably saved hundreds
of thousands of jobs that would otherwise have been lost if these
supposedly inefficient firms had been allowed to close or be radically
downsized and sold off. Interestingly, Poland's economy began growing
quickly in this same period, proving, according to the prominent Polish
economist and former Solidarity member Tadeusz Kowalik, that those who
were ready to write off the state firms as inefficient and archaic were
"obviously wrong."

Besides going on strike, Polish workers found another way to express
their anger with their onetime allies in Solidarity: they used the
democracy they had fought for to punish the party decisively at the
polls, including their once-beloved leader Lech Walesa. The most
dramatic trouncing came on September 19, 1993, when a coalition of left
parties, including the former ruling Communists (rebranded Democratic
Left Alliance), won 66 percent of the seats in parliament. Solidarity
had, by this time, splintered into warring factions. The trade union
faction won less than 5 percent, losing official party status in the
parliament, and a new party led by Mazowiecki, the prime minister, won
just 10.6 percent‹a resounding rejection of shock therapy.

Yet somehow, in the years to come, as dozens of countries struggled with
how to reform their economies, the inconvenient details‹the strikes, the
election defeats, the policy reversals‹would be lost. Instead, Poland
would be held up as a model, proof that radical free-market makeovers
can take place democratically and peacefully.

Like so many stories about countries in transition, this one was mostly a
myth. But it was better than the truth: in Poland, democracy was used as
a weapon against "free markets" on the streets and at the polls.
Meanwhile in China, where the drive for free-wheeling capitalism rolled
over democracy in Tiananmen Square, shock and terror unleashed one of
the most lucrative and sustained investor booms in modern history.
Another miracle born of a massacre.

-----

Bush's 3rd term: Obama
--
- Billy
"Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the
merger of state and corporate power." - Benito Mussolini.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b_vN0--mHug
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MyE5wjc4XOw

On Mar 18, 9:13*am, Billy wrote more BS like:

"You don't seem to understand that everything is connected, just like
in
a garden, e.g. soil and sky are connected. "

as I said billy , you are an idealouge, a rebel without a clue using
this forum as your soap box.

In article
,
Gunner wrote:

Eco-fringe propaganda snipped.

When you come back from this mission from God, you really should spend
some time in a garden and a lot less in your ideologue chat rooms.

This dear reader is called an ad hominem attack. While dripping with
sarcasm, it doesn't say any thing.

It is called censorship.

The reason for the "OT" label is to identify what may appear to be
non-relevant post within a news group. Knowing that a subject is beyond
the expertise of a group, one may avoid it.

Apparently, Gunny has a compulsion to read "OT" posts, and then feels
guilty about it. To relieve his guilt, he complains about the poster. He
doesn't address the content of the post, only obliquely refers to it,
and seems completely helpless to avert his eyes.

Grow up.

http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?hl=en...&msa=0&msid=11
8135173934136151745.00045bc25ee928a8872d0&z=3

-----

Bush's 3rd term: Obama

=====
--
- Billy
"Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the
merger of state and corporate power." - Benito Mussolini.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b_vN0--mHug
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MyE5wjc4XOw

Gunner wrote:
On Mar 18, 9:13 am, Billy wrote more BS like:

"You don't seem to understand that everything is connected, just like
in
a garden, e.g. soil and sky are connected. "

as I said billy , you are an idealouge, a rebel without a clue using
this forum as your soap box.

It is listed as an OT, you have the right and freedom to not read or
respond.
I will agree that Billy and others are "Idealist", however nothing is wrong
with that.
I am "Rational", I am against "authoritarians" that tell others how to live
their lives.

Take what you want and ignore the rest.

--
Enjoy Life... Nad R (Garden in zone 5a Michigan)

In article
,
Gunner wrote:

On Mar 18, 9:13*am, Billy wrote more BS like:

"You don't seem to understand that everything is connected, just like
in
a garden, e.g. soil and sky are connected. "

as I said billy , you are an idealouge, a rebel without a clue using
this forum as your soap box.

No one is asking for you to care about the on-going coup d'etat in
America. There is an "OT" predicating the post. You can avoid them.
You don't have to read the posts, yet seem as attracted to them as a
moth to a flame. You have a kill file, bozo, use it!


Bush's 3rd term: Obama


-----
--
- Billy
"Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the
merger of state and corporate power." - Benito Mussolini.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b_vN0--mHug
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MyE5wjc4XOw

Billy wrote:
In article
,
Gunner wrote:

On Mar 18, 9:13 am, Billy wrote more BS like:

"You don't seem to understand that everything is connected, just like
in
a garden, e.g. soil and sky are connected. "

as I said billy , you are an idealouge, a rebel without a clue using
this forum as your soap box.

No one is asking for you to care about the on-going coup d'etat in
America. There is an "OT" predicating the post. You can avoid them.
You don't have to read the posts, yet seem as attracted to them as a
moth to a flame. You have a kill file, bozo, use it!


Bush's 3rd term: Obama

Michigan the state in which I live in, the state passed a new law that
gives the Governor to have dictator like powers. Can remove/replace any
Mayor, Council Members, School Superintendents and board members, cancel
any local contracts, create local contracts without bids for just about any
reason he wishes. Democracy or the so called Republic as some would like to
say in Michigan may be coming to an end.

Big Brother is coming...

--
Enjoy Life... Nad R (Garden in zone 5a Michigan)

On Mar 18, 11:08*am, Billy Wildbilly without a brain wrote:
"No one is asking for you to care about the on-going coup d'etat in
America"

OMG. Frame it anyway you want and as many times as you want, yet
sometimes ya just gotta call stupid....stupid.

Good to see you finally got around to reading Sagan's "Fine art of
Baloney Detection" link I sent ya but I don't think you understand
that it is designed to challenge idiots that want us to believe you
ideologues who propagates this propaganda, this macabre fantasy with
doomsday and paranoia stories you and your other brother bill need us
to so desperately understand so as to save our very souls. Nor do you
get to claim censorship while calling for censorship. You brothers
bill and the other idiot fringe... on both ends.... have taken over
the microphone for too long now with this Westboro Baptist Church
argument you like to play. You have the right to have an opinion but
not to make up your facts nor proselytizing them. The smell will go
away when you get rid of the skunk. Its time for this group to get
back into gardening instead of The local Amazon book club circle
jerks for the Fringe.

Ya got to get rid of this 60's Commie act, The Federal People's
Republic of Berkley was overthrown by the New World Order back in the
80s...long, long ago. We aren't going back to your glory days
growing up watching The Little House on the Prairie pretending your a
farmer. BTW ya blew your KF lie again.