I am a huge fan (almost 250 lbs.) of raised beds and my first set will
soon be nearing the end of their life. I have a welder in mind who
says he can build some simple raised beds out of 3/8" or 1/4" x 12"
metal. Has anyone ever tried this? The benefits are obvious, and I
don't see an obvious downside, except for these issues:

Do the sides get too hot and fry the soil and whatever else comes in
close contact? and

Perhaps they should be just a little larger so the new bed can snugly
fit over the wood, thereby keeping an insulating wall between the
metal and the soil?

What about rust?

"Chris" wrote in message
om...
I am a huge fan (almost 250 lbs.) of raised beds and my first set will
soon be nearing the end of their life. I have a welder in mind who
says he can build some simple raised beds out of 3/8" or 1/4" x 12"
metal. Has anyone ever tried this? The benefits are obvious, and I
don't see an obvious downside, except for these issues:

Do the sides get too hot and fry the soil and whatever else comes in
close contact? and

Perhaps they should be just a little larger so the new bed can snugly
fit over the wood, thereby keeping an insulating wall between the
metal and the soil?

If you build it out of copper, the snails won't crawl in.
Mike
Chris wrote:

I am a huge fan (almost 250 lbs.) of raised beds and my first set will
soon be nearing the end of their life. I have a welder in mind who
says he can build some simple raised beds out of 3/8" or 1/4" x 12"
metal. Has anyone ever tried this? The benefits are obvious, and I
don't see an obvious downside, except for these issues:

Do the sides get too hot and fry the soil and whatever else comes in
close contact? and

Perhaps they should be just a little larger so the new bed can snugly
fit over the wood, thereby keeping an insulating wall between the
metal and the soil?

On 9 Jun 2003 09:55:00 -0700, (Chris) wrote:

I am a huge fan (almost 250 lbs.) of raised beds

Out of interest, why are raised beds any better than just planting
straight into the normal soil?

People say that they get better results, but apart from being about 3
or 4 inches closer to the sun, I can't see what the difference is.

As for the soil getting warmed better, how can any warmth from the
sides get through to the centre (despite the moisture, soil can't be a
very good conductor of heat).

Please let me in on the secret.

Colin
-----
Replace the obvious with Bigfoot

On Tue, 10 Jun 2003 21:55:58 +0100, Colin Malsingh
wrote:

On 9 Jun 2003 09:55:00 -0700, (Chris) wrote:

I am a huge fan (almost 250 lbs.) of raised beds

Out of interest, why are raised beds any better than just planting
straight into the normal soil?

People say that they get better results, but apart from being about 3
or 4 inches closer to the sun, I can't see what the difference is.

As for the soil getting warmed better, how can any warmth from the
sides get through to the centre (despite the moisture, soil can't be a
very good conductor of heat).

Please let me in on the secret.


It's actually more of a combination of raised beds plus
intensive planting (planting close together), I think. With
the good soil (tailor-made sometimes, as in our case) in
raised beds, one can plant intensively.

Right now, if I walk about three steps away from my
computer, I can look out my kitchen window and see my
garden. The entire garden is presently a sea of mud and
standing water, as we've had about six weeks of daily rain.
Rain every day.

EXCEPT the raised beds, which are islands in the sea of mud
and muck and water. In the raised beds are thriving plants
- which would have all drowned by now if they hadn't been in
raised beds.

This has been an extraordinarily wet spring, but every
spring our garden is full of standing water and un-plantable
until very late in the spring. Our property is on a
sidehill and slopes gently towards the valley bottom. All
the water from uphill of us has to run through our yard to
get downhill, naturally enough. This makes for an
unplant-able garden in spring.

Another very important advantage - to me personally - is
that I have a lot of joint and muscle pain (a chronic
illness) and it's much easier for me to tend raised beds
than to try to work flat on the ground. This reason *alone*
is sufficient for me to want raised beds.

Another advantage - in this particular location - is that we
don't actually *have* anything that can be called 'topsoil'.
We have exceedingly heavy clay, mixed with an awful lot of
rocks. Our so-called 'soil' is almost 100% clay.

So we've bought spent-mushroom-soil and are filling the
raised beds with a mixture of that, peat moss, and a little
lime. Obviously, covering the entire garden with this
mixture to the depth of about a foot would be VERY much more
expensive than only using it in the raised beds, as well as
more work.

I will also have less weeding to do, and I can apply water
and fertilizer right to the plants, right where it's needed,
rather than water and fertilize the whole garden. When I
mulch, I'll need less mulch too. I won't be mulching the
paths. (Well, I might mulch the paths later so they are less
muddy.)

I can picture that in different circumstances - hot, dry
deserts perhaps - raised beds might be counter-indicated,
and do more harm than good.

Pat

"Colin Malsingh" wrote in
message ...
On 9 Jun 2003 09:55:00 -0700, (Chris) wrote:

I am a huge fan (almost 250 lbs.) of raised beds

Out of interest, why are raised beds any better than just planting
straight into the normal soil?

People say that they get better results, but apart from being about 3
or 4 inches closer to the sun, I can't see what the difference is.

As for the soil getting warmed better, how can any warmth from the
sides get through to the centre (despite the moisture, soil can't be a
very good conductor of heat).

Please let me in on the secret.

Colin
-----
Replace the obvious with Bigfoot

- improved drainage
- in many cases better depth of soil than could be created on the flat
- improved access, less stooping and kneeling
- the made border makes it easier to keep out grass and other intruding
species

The few inches closer to the sun is of marginal benefit except on cloudy
days

David

i think i'd want something on the top edge of that metal raised bed so that you
won't hurt yourself should your shins come in contact with that top edge while
gardening.

pat

how deep are raised beds to be?

ROBERT O'REILLY wrote:

how deep are raised beds to be?

That's a can o' worms!

Mine are 4' (2' above grade, 2' below it) ... but I am well at the extreme
end of things.

Try for at least 18" of loose soil below grade and an additional 6" (or
more) above it. With this arrangement, soil compaction from walking on the
path is dramatically reduced and plant roots grow unimpeded. Here in
Detroit, raised beds have an additional benefit that Pat didn't mention
(she lives nearby).

Frost.

Cool air sinks / warm air rises and I have found that the higher the raised
bed, the longer into the fall before a frost causes me problems. I have had
gardens that combined flat with raised with raised boxes and the raised
boxes were clearly better at evading the first frost or two. Next in order
were the (unenclosed) raised beds followed by flat beds sheltered by
overhanging trees. Flat beds simply failed at the first opportunity.

I have also found that raising a bed lets the sun strike and warm the sides
of it early in the spring and that the warming effect is cumulative. In the
early spring about 1/2 of my beds are shadowed by my garage and I notice a
decided difference in germination rates from one end of these 20' beds to
the other. The bean seeds in the end warmed by the sun germinated a LONG
time before the rest did. In fact, I had decided I needed to replant the
shaded end when I noticed that they were finally starting to sprout.

As the seaon progresses the sun is at a higher angle so less heat is
generated / plus the plants have grown and provide shade for the soil so my
soil doesn't get overly warm ... it gets to about 50-60 deg F and that's
about all.

On Sat, 14 Jun 2003 12:58:15 -0400, Noydb
wrote:

ROBERT O'REILLY wrote:

how deep are raised beds to be?

That's a can o' worms!

Mine are 4' (2' above grade, 2' below it) ... but I am well at the extreme
end of things.

Try for at least 18" of loose soil below grade and an additional 6" (or
more) above it. With this arrangement, soil compaction from walking on the
path is dramatically reduced and plant roots grow unimpeded. Here in
Detroit, raised beds have an additional benefit that Pat didn't mention
(she lives nearby).

I don't. Not unless you consider about 500 miles nearby.
I think out climate is probably quite similar though.

The other Pat (Pat K.), I think lives nearby?

Pat

Pat Meadows wrote:

I don't. Not unless you consider about 500 miles nearby.
I think out climate is probably quite similar though.

The other Pat (Pat K.), I think lives nearby?

Pat

When did you move? :-)

Yeah ... prolly the other Pat. The one who lives in Plymouth, MI. My
boo-boo.

Bill C

Colin Malsingh wrote:

On 9 Jun 2003 09:55:00 -0700, (Chris) wrote:

People say that they get better results, but apart from being about 3
or 4 inches closer to the sun, I can't see what the difference is.


Every little bit helps! :-)

As for the soil getting warmed better, how can any warmth from the
sides get through to the centre (despite the moisture, soil can't be a
very good conductor of heat).

Cold falls ... if it has somewhere to fall to.

Additionally, drainage will be better in a raised bed than in a flat one and
the depth of the worked soil is usually greater. The deeper a root travels,
the less likely it is to be affected by short term droughts. The key to a
happy garden is to keep the plants growing at a constant rate and this
means having a strong root system (among other factors).

Wide rows, Organic methods, Raised beds and Deep soil (WORD)

Bill C

Pat Meadows said:

On Sat, 14 Jun 2003 12:58:15 -0400, Noydb
wrote:

ROBERT O'REILLY wrote:

how deep are raised beds to be?

That's a can o' worms!

Mine are 4' (2' above grade, 2' below it) ... but I am well at the extreme
end of things.

Try for at least 18" of loose soil below grade and an additional 6" (or
more) above it. With this arrangement, soil compaction from walking on the
path is dramatically reduced and plant roots grow unimpeded. Here in
Detroit, raised beds have an additional benefit that Pat didn't mention
(she lives nearby).

I don't. Not unless you consider about 500 miles nearby.
I think out climate is probably quite similar though.

The other Pat (Pat K.), I think lives nearby?

Hmm? I have raised beds, but they are raised mainly because that's where
I've worked in lots of compost (and I don't tromp on them, at all). No edges
or borders, they just stay up by themselves.

I tend to work them each year so they are taller at the edges than the middle,
the better to hold water (especially when I am watering newly seeded beds).
--
Pat in Plymouth MI

Any technology distinguishable from magic is insufficiently advanced.
(attributed to Don Marti)