Thanks a lot for the tips. I will post what I did and how everything is
going tomorrow. I'm excitied.

"Jim Miller" wrote in message
...
i've currently got a 46oz bottle which i use 1.5 cups sugar and a half
teaspoon of yeast and a pinch of baking soda in. i don't worry much about
the proportions since it always runs for a bit less than two weeks and i
just change it when i do my bi-weekly water changes. i'm sure if i cared
to
i could optimize this but it just isn't worth it to me.

i used to check my co2 levels daily until i decided they don't go too high
and they just dwindle away when the bubble rate gets too low.

i run my co2 directly into the intake of my system3 which is really
simple.
i was fiddling around with diffusers and had settled on the Rena 2" when i
discovered that the System3 impeller did a sufficient job with nothing
additional in the tank. the rena was definitely better however. i tried
limewood diffusers and a variety of "airstones" but the rena was by far
the
best. it produced a pretty mist of bubbles; very nice. now that i've got a
different plant arrangement in the tank i may actually go back to using
it.
if you decide to use the rena make sure to trim the little rubber gasket
lip
at the top since it tends to collect some of the mist into larger bubbles.

my system 3 is three gallons. i suspect that you'll want a better
diffusion
mechanism as well as a 64oz or multiple 64oz bottles if you don't have a
efficient diffuser. the one sold by aquatbotanic looks to be a great way
to
go for a larger tank such as yours. i'd stagger the start times for your
bottles and change them every other week.

good luck

jtm

--
Remove NOSPAM for email replies
"SlimFlem" wrote in message
news:8yrR9.552192$P31.184467@rwcrnsc53...
"use the minimum necessary to start co2 production at a comfortable
level."

Jim, what is your minimum level mixture and what size tank do you have?
How
many bottles do you use at once to give a comfortable level? How often
are
you checking PH?

Thanks,

OK, one last question for now...based on another thread I started about
removing the glass tops from the aquarium which I have done and really like,
how does this affect CO2 escaping? What about when you add some DIY jugs?
Will the lack of tops negate the benefit of the injected CO2? How does
water evaporation and water temperature affect CO2 amounts?

Thanks.

"Jim Miller" wrote in message
...
i've currently got a 46oz bottle which i use 1.5 cups sugar and a half
teaspoon of yeast and a pinch of baking soda in. i don't worry much about
the proportions since it always runs for a bit less than two weeks and i
just change it when i do my bi-weekly water changes. i'm sure if i cared
to
i could optimize this but it just isn't worth it to me.

i used to check my co2 levels daily until i decided they don't go too high
and they just dwindle away when the bubble rate gets too low.

i run my co2 directly into the intake of my system3 which is really
simple.
i was fiddling around with diffusers and had settled on the Rena 2" when i
discovered that the System3 impeller did a sufficient job with nothing
additional in the tank. the rena was definitely better however. i tried
limewood diffusers and a variety of "airstones" but the rena was by far
the
best. it produced a pretty mist of bubbles; very nice. now that i've got a
different plant arrangement in the tank i may actually go back to using
it.
if you decide to use the rena make sure to trim the little rubber gasket
lip
at the top since it tends to collect some of the mist into larger bubbles.

my system 3 is three gallons. i suspect that you'll want a better
diffusion
mechanism as well as a 64oz or multiple 64oz bottles if you don't have a
efficient diffuser. the one sold by aquatbotanic looks to be a great way
to
go for a larger tank such as yours. i'd stagger the start times for your
bottles and change them every other week.

good luck

jtm

--
Remove NOSPAM for email replies
"SlimFlem" wrote in message
news:8yrR9.552192$P31.184467@rwcrnsc53...
"use the minimum necessary to start co2 production at a comfortable
level."

Jim, what is your minimum level mixture and what size tank do you have?
How
many bottles do you use at once to give a comfortable level? How often
are
you checking PH?

Thanks,

OK, just one more. Do all you guys keep the DIY bottles going at night as
well? If not, how do you "turn them off" at night. By nothing disabling
them, would it cause PH levels to drop more at night since the plants as
well as the DIY are releasing CO2? What sorts of PH swings have you guys
noticed with DIY units?

Thanks.

"Jim Miller" wrote in message
...
i've currently got a 46oz bottle which i use 1.5 cups sugar and a half
teaspoon of yeast and a pinch of baking soda in. i don't worry much about
the proportions since it always runs for a bit less than two weeks and i
just change it when i do my bi-weekly water changes. i'm sure if i cared
to
i could optimize this but it just isn't worth it to me.

i used to check my co2 levels daily until i decided they don't go too high
and they just dwindle away when the bubble rate gets too low.

i run my co2 directly into the intake of my system3 which is really
simple.
i was fiddling around with diffusers and had settled on the Rena 2" when i
discovered that the System3 impeller did a sufficient job with nothing
additional in the tank. the rena was definitely better however. i tried
limewood diffusers and a variety of "airstones" but the rena was by far
the
best. it produced a pretty mist of bubbles; very nice. now that i've got a
different plant arrangement in the tank i may actually go back to using
it.
if you decide to use the rena make sure to trim the little rubber gasket
lip
at the top since it tends to collect some of the mist into larger bubbles.

my system 3 is three gallons. i suspect that you'll want a better
diffusion
mechanism as well as a 64oz or multiple 64oz bottles if you don't have a
efficient diffuser. the one sold by aquatbotanic looks to be a great way
to
go for a larger tank such as yours. i'd stagger the start times for your
bottles and change them every other week.

good luck

jtm

--
Remove NOSPAM for email replies
"SlimFlem" wrote in message
news:8yrR9.552192$P31.184467@rwcrnsc53...
"use the minimum necessary to start co2 production at a comfortable
level."

Jim, what is your minimum level mixture and what size tank do you have?
How
many bottles do you use at once to give a comfortable level? How often
are
you checking PH?

Thanks,

co2 is mostly affected by surface turbulence; keep the output of any filters
from disturbing the surface too much. the top isn't going to have that much
effect. perhaps a little.

don't worry about it.

jtm

--
Remove NOSPAM for email replies
"SlimFlem" wrote in message
news:6ruR9.553922$P31.188577@rwcrnsc53...
OK, one last question for now...based on another thread I started about
removing the glass tops from the aquarium which I have done and really like,
how does this affect CO2 escaping? What about when you add some DIY jugs?
Will the lack of tops negate the benefit of the injected CO2? How does
water evaporation and water temperature affect CO2 amounts?

Thanks.

"Jim Miller" wrote in message
...
i've currently got a 46oz bottle which i use 1.5 cups sugar and a half
teaspoon of yeast and a pinch of baking soda in. i don't worry much about
the proportions since it always runs for a bit less than two weeks and i
just change it when i do my bi-weekly water changes. i'm sure if i cared
to
i could optimize this but it just isn't worth it to me.

i used to check my co2 levels daily until i decided they don't go too high
and they just dwindle away when the bubble rate gets too low.

i run my co2 directly into the intake of my system3 which is really
simple.
i was fiddling around with diffusers and had settled on the Rena 2" when i
discovered that the System3 impeller did a sufficient job with nothing
additional in the tank. the rena was definitely better however. i tried
limewood diffusers and a variety of "airstones" but the rena was by far
the
best. it produced a pretty mist of bubbles; very nice. now that i've got a
different plant arrangement in the tank i may actually go back to using
it.
if you decide to use the rena make sure to trim the little rubber gasket
lip
at the top since it tends to collect some of the mist into larger bubbles.

my system 3 is three gallons. i suspect that you'll want a better
diffusion
mechanism as well as a 64oz or multiple 64oz bottles if you don't have a
efficient diffuser. the one sold by aquatbotanic looks to be a great way
to
go for a larger tank such as yours. i'd stagger the start times for your
bottles and change them every other week.

good luck

jtm

--
Remove NOSPAM for email replies
"SlimFlem" wrote in message
news:8yrR9.552192$P31.184467@rwcrnsc53...
"use the minimum necessary to start co2 production at a comfortable
level."

Jim, what is your minimum level mixture and what size tank do you have?
How
many bottles do you use at once to give a comfortable level? How often
are
you checking PH?

Thanks,

i let mine run all night. check it for yourself just before you go to bed
after running all day. do it one night running and another night not. it
swung a little but not enough to matter in my case. i don't remember the
details.

jtm

--
Remove NOSPAM for email replies

Excellent suggestions and information from all of you. I am going to
give them a try on my new 60gal set up as well as a 30gal and 20gal as
well. I am going to experiment with some of your different recipes
and DIY systems and post the results later. I appreciate the help. I
am going to order the Nutrafin CO2 system and try the diffuser too.

Thanks, dpots

"Owen Graupman" wrote in message news:%8mR9.6298$wQ1.1428@fe01...
I'd like to add my $.02 worth on DIY systems...

Here's my recipe for a more (IMHO) successful DIY CO2. Since switching to
this method, I've had far better success with DIY CO2. Instead of changing
bottles every two weeks or so, I'm changing them every 6 to 8 weeks.

Use a small plastic soda bottle. I bought a 6 pack of 24oz Wild Cherry
Pepsi's. The 1-liter bottles also work well, but don't use anything larger!
Drill a hole in the top and insert a silicone air line just like you would
for a 2 liter bottle. I like to seal the airline with silicone just to make
certain there's no leaks. I discovered a while ago that after a time, the
silicone would leak around the edges of the joint if I didn't.

For my yeast recipe, put a little warm water in the bottom of the bottle
(about 1/4 cup) and add 1/4 teaspoon of yeast to the mixture (BTW, I've
discovered no difference between the quick-rise, bakers and champagne yeast
using this method). Cap the bottle and shake well to mix the yeast. Now fill
the bottle half full with sugar, then about 1/4 full with water and a dash
of baking powder. That should leave about 1/4 full of air. Gently invert the
bottle a few times to make sure all the sugar is wet, but _not_ dissolved.
Leave the bottle in a sink or tub for a couple of days, so that when the
yeast starts reacting, any overflow doesn't make a mess. Attach to an
airline with a check valve and an airstone at the end and place so the
bubbles get swirled around by the filter outflow. For the check valve, I use
one's I found at Petsmart that have a small chamber filled with filter
floss, which acts as a miniature drop container (for the occasional bubble
that goes up the tube).

Each bottle puts out about enough CO2 to keep a heavily planted 20-30 gallon
tank at around 15ppm and in my home tanks (2 20gals, 2 30gals and a 5) they
last around 7 weeks (some only six, some up to 8). If you have a larger
tank, add more bottles.

I built a bracket for the bottles on the inside of my stands, so I don't
have to worry about them getting knocked over and hence, don't use any sort
of drip container in case the mixture overflows. If you decide to use one on
your setup, I recommend using a tiny container (I like those miniature water
bottles I get on airplane flights), otherwise the mixture will peter out
sooner.

Well, FWIW...
-Owen Graupman

"Jason" wrote in message
...
I use a 1gal wine jug (glass) for my DIY method... Basically you can buy a
cheap jug of wine for about $6, get a stopper at Ace hardware for about
$1.70, tubing for about $2, and the DIY recipe ingrediants. (about $4
which
will last a year or more) I also bought a Tetrafin check valve since I
have
my bottle in the tank stand (these cost about $2) (this prevents resverse
siphoning).

Anyway, the options are really limitless, but here is the recipe for DIY
co2:

for a 2 litre bottle concoction:
6 cups water
2 cups sugar
1 tspn yeast (NOT the quick rise stuff, but either bakers or brewers
yeast)

for a 1 gal container:
~12 cups of water (fill until a little over 3/4 full)
4 cups sugar
2 tspn yeast. (again, NOT the quick rise crap)

These concoctions should last about 2 weeks per batch. If you use this in
a
60 gal aquarium (mine is 63gal), MAKE SURE you have a co2 test kit
handy...
I found out after a couple of weeks that my co2 levels were in excess of
50ppm which is toxic for fish...

-Jason

"dpots" wrote in message
om...
I am setting up a new 60g plant tank and want to try to us CO2. Is a
DIY set up appropriate for this size aquarium. If so, what type of
DIY set up do you recommend (recipe, bottles, tubing, ...). My LFS
sells the Nutrafin CO2 system for $30 and I was considering purchasing
it just for the diffuser and tubing? Good or bad idea?

Leigh, if you read this message, I think your posts are very
informative and your web page link is great-THANKS!

Thanks, dpots

"Eric Schreiber" wrote in message
...
tose (LeighMo) wrote:

A lot of people like the Nutrafin system's diffuser. If you want to buy
it for
that, though, consider buying online. Pet Solutions has it for $19.99.

If that's the Hagen Natural Plant System that you're talking about,
Pet Solutions actually goes one better - they sell just the
diffuser/bubble counter. I wanted one of those since the moment I
first laid eyes on it at the LFS, but wasn't about to fork out $40 for
the whole package.

I didn't know that just the diffuser was available until I read your
post and looked at Pet Solutions - thanks, I'm going to go order one
right now

--


Ive got the Nutrafin system and the diffuser works great.
You only get the tiniest bubbles not dissolving.
They are so small they dont even have enough bouyancy to make it up the last
stage of the diffuser !
I am not sure the Nutrafin 'reaction chamber'? adds any value to the deal.
It is supposed to have a valve to release excess pressure, but i think it is
basically only a lid that doesnt seal properly at high pressure lol
I have now used up my sachets that came with the kit, so I am going to try
champagne yeast/baking soda next.
Anyone worked out quantities for the Nutrafin system yet?
In the UK, the whole kit retails for 15.99 GBP in my LFS.

Phil.

the line on an angle and then poke/pull it through the hole with a pair of
pliers. this will make a leakproof fitting without the need for glues which
always end up leaking after a time.

After some experimenting with different glues, I prefer the kind you
use with a "pistol" that heats it up. Ready to go in a few minutes.
Also its sturdy(but not as sturdy as arakdite) yet flexible (but not
as flexible as silicone).

Anyway, saw a link here in this group i think(?) with an exelent
solution to fastening air-hoses to bottle-screwcaps.
http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...1&I=LXG849&P=M

SEE YA !!!

Malawi, The Fisher King - Ruler Of The World
Conquering the world for YOU since 1972.

On Sat, 04 Jan 2003 06:20:42 GMT, "SlimFlem"
wrote:
OK, just one more. Do all you guys keep the DIY bottles going at night as
well? If not, how do you "turn them off" at night. By nothing disabling
them, would it cause PH levels to drop more at night since the plants as
well as the DIY are releasing CO2? What sorts of PH swings have you guys
noticed with DIY units?

If you use a powerhead/cannister pump for eiter crushing the bubbles
or to run water trough a reactor, you can simply put a timer on the
pump. But beware that if the pump is a canister type with bacterias,
they may die from oxygen deplation.

SEE YA !!!

Malawi, The Fisher King - Ruler Of The World
Conquering the world for YOU since 1972.