I have recently had a company edge the pond with stone.

In carrying out this process, five tench I had in the pond have died. After the work was carried out they were initially distressed, and sadly died towards the end of the day.

I can only surmise that the cement from the work has entered the pond in sufficient quantity to cause polution? Is this a likely cause? There is also other wildlife living in the pond, newts frogs etc, and I am worried as to the effect the cement has on them.

What is the best way to go about cleaning up the pond so as not to cause any further harm to the remaining wildlife?

Thank you in advance.

Christine_B wrote in
:

What is the best way to go about cleaning up the pond so as
not to cause any further harm to the remaining wildlife?

if you think cement fell into the pond, first thing to do is
take a pH reading. raw cement is very alkaline & a rapid pH
change will kill fish & other wildlife. it won't do any pond
plants any good either.
i suspect that adjusting the pH (slowly!) back to a more
moderate range will solve your problems.

lee
--
Last night while sitting in my chair
I pinged a host that wasn't there
It wasn't there again today
The host resolved to NSA.

In article ,
enigma wrote:

Christine_B wrote in
:

What is the best way to go about cleaning up the pond so as
not to cause any further harm to the remaining wildlife?

if you think cement fell into the pond, first thing to do is
take a pH reading. raw cement is very alkaline & a rapid pH
change will kill fish & other wildlife. it won't do any pond
plants any good either.
i suspect that adjusting the pH (slowly!) back to a more
moderate range will solve your problems.

lee

Sound advice. If high a slow water exchange may be in order. Something
like 20 % every other day. Increase aerating if possible.

Good Luck!

Bill

--
Garden in shade zone 5 S Jersey USA

http://dodd.senate.gov/index.php?q=node/4476

On Jun 26, 6:58�am, Christine_B Christine_B.
wrote:
I have recently had a company edge the pond with stone.

In carrying out this process, five tench I had in the pond have died.
After the work was carried out they were initially distressed, and
sadly died towards the end of the day.

I can only surmise that the cement from the work has entered the pond
in sufficient quantity to cause polution? �Is this a likely cause?
There is also other wildlife living in the pond, newts frogs etc, and I
am worried as to the effect the cement has on them. �

What is the best way to go about cleaning up the pond so as not to
cause any further harm to the remaining wildlife?

Why did they use cement (you probably mean concrete), portland cement
and pond life don't mix. You hired a company that does masonary but
they obviously know nothing about ponds, nor do you. That "cement"
will leach into the pond for 20-30 years, maybe longer. Your only
remedy is to carefully and completely remove that stone and "cement"
coping. Properly set stonework is self-interlocking and needs no
adhesive... why pay for natural stone if it ends up looking ridiculous
when held together with an unnatural substance. You need to decide if
you want a pond or a pool.

Christine_B wrote:
I have recently had a company edge the pond with stone.

In carrying out this process, five tench I had in the pond have died.
After the work was carried out they were initially distressed, and
sadly died towards the end of the day.

I can only surmise that the cement from the work has entered the pond
in sufficient quantity to cause polution? Is this a likely cause?
There is also other wildlife living in the pond, newts frogs etc, and I
am worried as to the effect the cement has on them.

What is the best way to go about cleaning up the pond so as not to
cause any further harm to the remaining wildlife?

Hi,
Fresh concrete can upset the pH of the pond rapidly but (depending on
how much fell in) you can probably make adjustments. First if you do not
have a method to determine pH, GET IT. Get tests for KH (total
alkalinity) and GH (general hardness) also.
Get all the concrete possible out of the pond, assuming that some fell
in. If the new edge is under water lower the pond level temporarily.
I don't know what tench prefer but a stable pH is usually more desirable
than a particular number. There could be other problems, perhaps they
spilled something else in the pond.

If KH is high (above about 200 ppm or 11 degrees) and pH is high (above
9), then use muriatic acid. Available at hardware and pool supply
stores. Put 2 oz. acid in a five gallon bucket, fill with pond water,
and disperse it throughout the pond. A dose of 2 ounces per 1000 gallons
lowers KH by 1 degree (20 ppm) releasing it as CO2. CO2 suppresses
respiration in fish, so the pond should be well aerated. Next day the
pH and KH is tested again. Once KH is lowered, pH will follow. It
shouldn't be necessary to lower KH below about 150 ppm (8 degrees). Two
oz. per 1000 gallons is the maximum daily dose.

If KH is low (below 100 ppm) and pH is high (above 9), instead add
common baking soda. One-quarter pound per 1000 gallons increases KH
by 1 degree. Once KH is 100-150 ppm (6 to 9 degrees), pH should
stabilize near 8.4.

You will have to keep monitoring and treating.

HTH -_- how

--
no NEWS is good

yup. high pH, bring it down. however. baking soda blows off as CO2, need dolomitic
limestone in the pond to increase hardness.

whenever there is suspicion of poisoning start running water into the pond one end,
let it overflow the other. If this is city water then need to have some kind of
regulator like MELNOR AUTOMATIC WATER TIMER cheap, set it for X gallons and add
dechlor (get buckets of this from aquatic ecosystems, sodium thioglycolate).

INgrid

On Fri, 27 Jun 2008 02:23:53 -0500, how wrote:

Christine_B wrote:
I have recently had a company edge the pond with stone.

In carrying out this process, five tench I had in the pond have died.
After the work was carried out they were initially distressed, and
sadly died towards the end of the day.

I can only surmise that the cement from the work has entered the pond
in sufficient quantity to cause polution? Is this a likely cause?
There is also other wildlife living in the pond, newts frogs etc, and I
am worried as to the effect the cement has on them.

What is the best way to go about cleaning up the pond so as not to
cause any further harm to the remaining wildlife?

Hi,
Fresh concrete can upset the pH of the pond rapidly but (depending on
how much fell in) you can probably make adjustments. First if you do not
have a method to determine pH, GET IT. Get tests for KH (total
alkalinity) and GH (general hardness) also.
Get all the concrete possible out of the pond, assuming that some fell
in. If the new edge is under water lower the pond level temporarily.
I don't know what tench prefer but a stable pH is usually more desirable
than a particular number. There could be other problems, perhaps they
spilled something else in the pond.

If KH is high (above about 200 ppm or 11 degrees) and pH is high (above
9), then use muriatic acid. Available at hardware and pool supply
stores. Put 2 oz. acid in a five gallon bucket, fill with pond water,
and disperse it throughout the pond. A dose of 2 ounces per 1000 gallons
lowers KH by 1 degree (20 ppm) releasing it as CO2. CO2 suppresses
respiration in fish, so the pond should be well aerated. Next day the
pH and KH is tested again. Once KH is lowered, pH will follow. It
shouldn't be necessary to lower KH below about 150 ppm (8 degrees). Two
oz. per 1000 gallons is the maximum daily dose.

If KH is low (below 100 ppm) and pH is high (above 9), instead add
common baking soda. One-quarter pound per 1000 gallons increases KH
by 1 degree. Once KH is 100-150 ppm (6 to 9 degrees), pH should
stabilize near 8.4.

You will have to keep monitoring and treating.

HTH -_- how

Thank you all for your help, its very much appreciated.

We will begin with testing the water and take things from there.


Although...

We actually hired a landscape gardening company and so assumed ourselves to be in safe hands.

The pond has flourished since we originally dug it out some years ago with fish happily breeding and various wildlife setting up home. Help is appreciated but please reserve further comments.

I realise it must be frustrating answering 'beginners' questions with such a towering intellect such as your own but manners cost nothing.

Just for future reference its Masonry NOT masonary. Did I say towering intellect....



Again thak you to everyone who helped out.

In article ,
wrote:

yup. high pH, bring it down. however. baking soda blows off as CO2, need
dolomitic
limestone in the pond to increase hardness.
NaHCO3 + H+ --- Na+ + H2O + CO2(gas) --- Na+ + H2O

Ca(OH)2 + 2(H+) ---- Ca++ + 2(H2O)

Baking soda will work and it is a mild base but the sodium may
present a problem. So use INgrid's approach and use calcium carbonate
(limestone, chalk, a marble bust). The smaller the particle size, the
quicker it will work (It dissolves fairly slowly.) If the pH is
below 5, you may want to treat your pond with baking soda (stir and wait
a couple of days and then test) and then withdraw some water
into 5 gal. buckets (or larger) where you have the calcium carbonate,
Wait 24 to 48 hr.s and return the liquid, not the solids, to the
pond (repeat as needed). Don't add the solid calcium carbonate
because it works slowly and you may over shoot pH 7 and the pond
will go basic.

whenever there is suspicion of poisoning start running water into the pond
one end,
let it overflow the other. If this is city water then need to have some kind
of
regulator like MELNOR AUTOMATIC WATER TIMER cheap, set it for X gallons and
add
dechlor (get buckets of this from aquatic ecosystems, sodium thioglycolate).

INgrid

On Fri, 27 Jun 2008 02:23:53 -0500, how wrote:

Christine_B wrote:
I have recently had a company edge the pond with stone.

In carrying out this process, five tench I had in the pond have died.
After the work was carried out they were initially distressed, and
sadly died towards the end of the day.

I can only surmise that the cement from the work has entered the pond
in sufficient quantity to cause polution? Is this a likely cause?
There is also other wildlife living in the pond, newts frogs etc, and I
am worried as to the effect the cement has on them.

What is the best way to go about cleaning up the pond so as not to
cause any further harm to the remaining wildlife?

Hi,
Fresh concrete can upset the pH of the pond rapidly but (depending on
how much fell in) you can probably make adjustments. First if you do not
have a method to determine pH, GET IT. Get tests for KH (total
alkalinity) and GH (general hardness) also.
Get all the concrete possible out of the pond, assuming that some fell
in. If the new edge is under water lower the pond level temporarily.
I don't know what tench prefer but a stable pH is usually more desirable
than a particular number. There could be other problems, perhaps they
spilled something else in the pond.

If KH is high (above about 200 ppm or 11 degrees) and pH is high (above
9), then use muriatic acid. Available at hardware and pool supply
stores. Put 2 oz. acid in a five gallon bucket, fill with pond water,
and disperse it throughout the pond. A dose of 2 ounces per 1000 gallons
lowers KH by 1 degree (20 ppm) releasing it as CO2. CO2 suppresses
respiration in fish, so the pond should be well aerated. Next day the
pH and KH is tested again. Once KH is lowered, pH will follow. It
shouldn't be necessary to lower KH below about 150 ppm (8 degrees). Two
oz. per 1000 gallons is the maximum daily dose.

If KH is low (below 100 ppm) and pH is high (above 9), instead add
common baking soda. One-quarter pound per 1000 gallons increases KH
by 1 degree. Once KH is 100-150 ppm (6 to 9 degrees), pH should
stabilize near 8.4.

You will have to keep monitoring and treating.

HTH -_- how
--

Billy
Bush and Pelosi Behind Bars
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9KVTf...ef=patrick.net
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l0aEo...eature=related

In article ,
Christine_B wrote:

Thank you all for your help, its very much appreciated.

We will begin with testing the water and take things from there.


Although...

You hired a company that does masonary but
they obviously know nothing about ponds, nor do you

It¹s the old distribution of y curve.

Hope you and the pond prosper.

Bill

PS I'd add some extra water plants as they can balance mistakes too.

--
Garden in shade zone 5 S Jersey USA

http://dodd.senate.gov/index.php?q=node/4476

In article ,
Christine_B wrote:

You hired a company that does masonary but
they obviously know nothing about ponds, nor do you


Snip

I realise it must be frustrating answering 'beginners' questions with
such a towering intellect such as your own but manners cost nothing.

Just for future reference its Masonry NOT masonary. Did I say towering
intellect....

Oh, that be our junkyard-dog of a boy, Shelly. Sorry, but for
some reason the name Christian or Christine seems perturb his
otherwise normal abysmally abrasive, foul behavior, but he does
add balance to another wise stellar collection of gardeners;o)


Again thank you to everyone who helped out.

Down boy, down!



--
Christine_B
--

Billy
Bush and Pelosi Behind Bars
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9KVTf...ef=patrick.net
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l0aEo...eature=related

On Jun 27, 1:38�pm, Christine_B Christine_B.
wrote:
Thank you all for your help, its very much appreciated.

We will begin with testing the water and take things from there.

Although...

You hired a company that does masonary but
they obviously know nothing about ponds, nor do you

We actually hired a landscape gardening company and so assumed
ourselves to be in safe hands. �

The pond has flourished since we originally dug it out some years ago
with fish happily breeding and various wildlife setting up home. �Help
is appreciated but please reserve further comments.

I realise it must be frustrating answering 'beginners' questions with
such a towering intellect such as your own but manners cost nothing.

Just for future reference its Masonry NOT masonary. �Did I say towering
intellect....

Again thak you to everyone who helped out.

--
Christine_B

Thank has an "n"... it's you who has poor manners, you're disingenous,
you're an ignoranus, and you stink.

both chalk and marble will not reach equilibrium at a low enuf pH. It will continue
to dissolve and drive pH up to 10. only limestone (and NOT slaked limestone) will
reach equilibrium at a reasonable pH for fish. Up here in Milwaukee Wisconsin we
have limestone quarries and quarry swimming holes with fish... LOL. Ingrid

use calcium carbonate(limestone, chalk, a marble bust).

"Billy" wrote in message
...
In article ,
wrote:

yup. high pH, bring it down.

OK but you do this by dilution or by adding acid

however. baking soda blows off as CO2,

Yes in the presence of acid. Is that what you mean? You wouldn't add baking
soda if the pH is too high (ie alkaline) as it is alkaline and will make it
worse.


need dolomitic
limestone in the pond to increase hardness.

Why? What is wrong with soft water in a pond? What benefit is hard water for
pond life?

Dolomite is roughly calcium magnesium carbonate, that will tend to raise pH,
not what is required in this case.

NaHCO3 + H+ --- Na+ + H2O + CO2(gas) --- Na+ + H2O

Ca(OH)2 + 2(H+) ---- Ca++ + 2(H2O)

Baking soda will work and it is a mild base but the sodium may
present a problem. So use INgrid's approach and use calcium carbonate
(limestone, chalk, a marble bust). The smaller the particle size, the
quicker it will work (It dissolves fairly slowly.) If the pH is
below 5, you may want to treat your pond with baking soda (stir and wait
a couple of days and then test) and then withdraw some water
into 5 gal. buckets (or larger) where you have the calcium carbonate,
Wait 24 to 48 hr.s and return the liquid, not the solids, to the
pond (repeat as needed). Don't add the solid calcium carbonate
because it works slowly and you may over shoot pH 7 and the pond
will go basic.


This is all fine for treating an acid pond. Portland cement and its products
will make the pond too alkaline.

David

"Sheldon" wrote in message news:254681a5-fcae-43a3-9c7c-


you're an ignoranus, and you stink.

Another subtle touch of clever school-yard repartee from the opsimath. Only
you know how long it is since you left primary (junior) school in the flesh
but to many who read your words it might well have never happened.

David

yes. add muriatic as recommended by someone else on the list, dilute and drip it in
gradually. yes, baking soda dissociates to CO2 and H2O in the presents of acid.
Actually goldfish and koi do well in hard water, but lakes are naturally soft, they
just arent "softened". soft water is stripped of any buffering capacity, Ca+ and
Mg+. that means the pH will swing wildly and that makes the fish suffer. in
addition softening strips out chloride ions which are necessary to gill function,
breathing. and softening adds scads of Na+ which can sometimes be so high it is
toxic. http://tinyurl.com/5fsbu9

calcium and magnesium stabilize the HCO3- or carbonate hardness. it wont raise a
high pH. OTOH, you are tyring to get the calcium out of the pond because there is a
huge excess. it isnt a buffered calcium tho, which is what the problem is. the
water out of the well at my mothers ponds is so full of calcium that the water is
milky when the ponds are refilled after cleaning. but there is a buffer that
prevents the calcium from locking up the chloride ions. INgrid

On Sat, 28 Jun 2008 14:03:02 +1000, "David Hare-Scott" wrote:
OK but you do this by dilution or by adding acid
Yes in the presence of acid. Is that what you mean?
Why? What is wrong with soft water in a pond? What benefit is hard water for
pond life?

Dolomite is roughly calcium magnesium carbonate, that will tend to raise pH,
not what is required in this case.