On Mon, 20 Apr 2009 12:53:28 -0400, "JoeSpareBedroom" wrote:

wrote in message
.. .
On Mon, 20 Apr 2009 11:17:00 -0400, "JoeSpareBedroom"
wrote:

wrote in message
...
On Sun, 19 Apr 2009 11:31:33 -0400, wrote:


Well, the s.o. and I walked the grounds today.... everything looks
fairly
good, except
something destroyed half the tulip bed yesterday night.

She decided my next project is to build a deer protection fence to
protect
a line of
shrubs from the critters.

About 20 - 25 feet long, 4 feet wide 4 feet high type of cage
(rectangle)
Needs to be about 6" off the ground to allow space for cutting small
areas
of grass,
clippers or string trimmer... doesn't matter which.
Temporary- will only be there for 2 - 3 years to allow plants to
establish themselves.
Discreet - something the neighbors will not notice ( ha - if THATS
possible).
Inexpensive -

A fence which is not a fence to protect a line of shrubs from persistent
deer. The
homeowners association goes into a frenzied panic with even a garden
plot... they'll
go totally beserk with any type of permanent structure.

I'm thinking those green posts with chicken wire. Perhaps even the
green
plastic fencing
with the more solid mesh.

Any other fencing material that might be considered. Its gotta be a
physical barrier...
all the other stuff has been tried.

Thanks !!

Peter


Thanks all, for the suggestions and recommendations....

Okay, I need to simplify just a little... as noted in the original
posting the fence
will be in the shape of a rectangle 25 foot long x 4 foot across.
Shallow enough
so that any bounding deer will probably bound right over it, unless they
are skilled
high divers.... or another deer holds them by the ankles and dips
them
into
the enclosure...... 25 foot long as I'm enclosing a row of shrubs
instead
of
caging them individually.

If it were me I wouldn't want anyone to hold me by the ankles and dip
me,
but
heck maybe deer are different).

So 4 foot from one edge of fence to the other side..

Val presented a good point.... they can probably get under a 6" fence...
it'll be
lowered to 4" above ground... gotta have some space to get a trimmer in
there.

This is for euonymous 'manhattan'. There is already another hedge
about
8' tall growing elsewhere on the property... Browseline is only about
5
foot
during winter. The bushes handle the stress fairly well and regrow
every
year. I'm
hoping to duplicate the hedge in another area.

The fence is temporary, to protect younger plants until they get
established. Thus
a 4' height.... (it's a trade off for temporary purposes)

turkey wire or chicken wire sounds good. I'm hesitant to stand on a
ladder
driving 7' green posts into the ground using a sledge...... are
there
3' green metal
fence posts that extensions can be bolted onto ???

Thought about using lumber and stapling the wire mesh, but 2 x 2's are
kinda
expensive at Home Depot... is this what is commonly used in gardens or
is there a "garden' variety lumber used for temporary fencing. ???

Hope this clarifies things a little....

Peter


Use the metal stakes made for the purpose. Not cheap, but you'll probably
find uses for them over the years. Use electrical wire ties to hold the
mesh
in place.

The deer will get over the 4' fence without even touching it. Not sure why
you have an aversion to using 6' fence, which is more likely to work. Do
you
like wasting money?


The height of the fence is based upon local availability of material.

The stores I've checked so far seem to have 6' post... 24 inches in the
ground
and 48" above... with rolls of 48" chicken wire.. thus 48" high.

If you did a 6' fence... what length metal posts and how to drive them
into the ground
without swinging a sledge while standing on a ladder. (no pickup truck
either).

I haven't seen any combo base post and extensions.... ie. 3' foot, drive
24" inches
into the ground and then use a 5' extension for the top portion. 6'
post with a 2'
extension ?? Does something like this exist?? Using off the shelf
materials
rather than cutting and drilling.

72" height chicken wire??

Peter




Where are you located?


Columbia, Maryland.... halfway between D.C. and Baltimore...

wrote:

Where are you located?


Columbia, Maryland.... halfway between D.C. and Baltimore...

Tractor Supply Co in Mt Airy lists 48" or 60" x 100' rolls of 2" x 4"
wire, along with 6 1/2' posts.

I'm in the process of doing some of the same as you. I'm in Highland,
MD and the deer are totally out of control on my street.

Steel & Wire Products in Baltimore has a much more extensive offering of
fencing & posts than TSC offers.
I ordered 7' posts and 5' wire from them.
You need to be a reseller or large commercial account to buy from S & W

Good luck on your fencing.

wrote:

If you did a 6' fence... what length metal posts and how to drive them into the ground
without swinging a sledge while standing on a ladder. (no pickup truck either).


A post driver:

http://www.tractorsupply.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay_10551_10001_44115_-1______14359|14374|44115?listingPage=true&Special= false

or

http://www.tractorsupply.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay_10551_10001_36128_-1______14359|14374|36128?listingPage=true&Special= false

wrote in message
...
On Mon, 20 Apr 2009 12:53:28 -0400, "JoeSpareBedroom"
wrote:

wrote in message
. ..
On Mon, 20 Apr 2009 11:17:00 -0400, "JoeSpareBedroom"
wrote:

wrote in message
m...
On Sun, 19 Apr 2009 11:31:33 -0400, wrote:


Well, the s.o. and I walked the grounds today.... everything looks
fairly
good, except
something destroyed half the tulip bed yesterday night.

She decided my next project is to build a deer protection fence to
protect
a line of
shrubs from the critters.

About 20 - 25 feet long, 4 feet wide 4 feet high type of cage
(rectangle)
Needs to be about 6" off the ground to allow space for cutting small
areas
of grass,
clippers or string trimmer... doesn't matter which.
Temporary- will only be there for 2 - 3 years to allow plants to
establish themselves.
Discreet - something the neighbors will not notice ( ha - if THATS
possible).
Inexpensive -

A fence which is not a fence to protect a line of shrubs from
persistent
deer. The
homeowners association goes into a frenzied panic with even a garden
plot... they'll
go totally beserk with any type of permanent structure.

I'm thinking those green posts with chicken wire. Perhaps even the
green
plastic fencing
with the more solid mesh.

Any other fencing material that might be considered. Its gotta be a
physical barrier...
all the other stuff has been tried.

Thanks !!

Peter


Thanks all, for the suggestions and recommendations....

Okay, I need to simplify just a little... as noted in the original
posting the fence
will be in the shape of a rectangle 25 foot long x 4 foot across.
Shallow enough
so that any bounding deer will probably bound right over it, unless
they
are skilled
high divers.... or another deer holds them by the ankles and dips
them
into
the enclosure...... 25 foot long as I'm enclosing a row of shrubs
instead
of
caging them individually.

If it were me I wouldn't want anyone to hold me by the ankles and dip
me,
but
heck maybe deer are different).

So 4 foot from one edge of fence to the other side..

Val presented a good point.... they can probably get under a 6"
fence...
it'll be
lowered to 4" above ground... gotta have some space to get a trimmer
in
there.

This is for euonymous 'manhattan'. There is already another hedge
about
8' tall growing elsewhere on the property... Browseline is only
about
5
foot
during winter. The bushes handle the stress fairly well and regrow
every
year. I'm
hoping to duplicate the hedge in another area.

The fence is temporary, to protect younger plants until they get
established. Thus
a 4' height.... (it's a trade off for temporary purposes)

turkey wire or chicken wire sounds good. I'm hesitant to stand on
a
ladder
driving 7' green posts into the ground using a sledge...... are
there
3' green metal
fence posts that extensions can be bolted onto ???

Thought about using lumber and stapling the wire mesh, but 2 x 2's
are
kinda
expensive at Home Depot... is this what is commonly used in gardens
or
is there a "garden' variety lumber used for temporary fencing. ???

Hope this clarifies things a little....

Peter


Use the metal stakes made for the purpose. Not cheap, but you'll
probably
find uses for them over the years. Use electrical wire ties to hold the
mesh
in place.

The deer will get over the 4' fence without even touching it. Not sure
why
you have an aversion to using 6' fence, which is more likely to work. Do
you
like wasting money?


The height of the fence is based upon local availability of material.

The stores I've checked so far seem to have 6' post... 24 inches in the
ground
and 48" above... with rolls of 48" chicken wire.. thus 48" high.

If you did a 6' fence... what length metal posts and how to drive them
into the ground
without swinging a sledge while standing on a ladder. (no pickup truck
either).

I haven't seen any combo base post and extensions.... ie. 3' foot,
drive
24" inches
into the ground and then use a 5' extension for the top portion. 6'
post with a 2'
extension ?? Does something like this exist?? Using off the shelf
materials
rather than cutting and drilling.

72" height chicken wire??

Peter




Where are you located?


Columbia, Maryland.... halfway between D.C. and Baltimore...


You want to go to Home Depot, inconveniently located in Columbia MD. Look
for rolls of 6 foot green metal fence with rectangular openings, and green
metal posts with notches matched to the openings in the fence wire. You
don't have to hook the fence material into those notches. I simply mentioned
the notches to help you identify the posts.

The posts do NOT have to be as high as the fence. All that matters is the
height of the fence. Tie small pieces of white cloth to the top of the fence
every few feet to be sure the deer see it at night. If you want, you can
dissolve some shards of Irish Spring soap in hot water and soak the rag
pieces in it. Couldn't hurt.

If you don't have a ladder that makes you feel safe when pounding the posts
into the ground, it's time to buy a better ladder. My posts are NOT 2' in
the ground and it doesn't matter. If some crazy deer decides to jump the
fence and hits the top on the way over, the posts will bend no matter how
deep you set them.

wrote in message
...
On Sun, 19 Apr 2009 11:31:33 -0400, wrote:


Well, the s.o. and I walked the grounds today.... everything looks fairly
good, except
something destroyed half the tulip bed yesterday night.

She decided my next project is to build a deer protection fence to protect
a line of
shrubs from the critters.

About 20 - 25 feet long, 4 feet wide 4 feet high type of cage
(rectangle)
Needs to be about 6" off the ground to allow space for cutting small areas
of grass,
clippers or string trimmer... doesn't matter which.
Temporary- will only be there for 2 - 3 years to allow plants to
establish themselves.
Discreet - something the neighbors will not notice ( ha - if THATS
possible).
Inexpensive -

A fence which is not a fence to protect a line of shrubs from persistent
deer. The
homeowners association goes into a frenzied panic with even a garden
plot... they'll
go totally beserk with any type of permanent structure.

I'm thinking those green posts with chicken wire. Perhaps even the green
plastic fencing
with the more solid mesh.

Any other fencing material that might be considered. Its gotta be a
physical barrier...
all the other stuff has been tried.

Thanks !!

Peter


Thanks all, for the suggestions and recommendations....

Okay, I need to simplify just a little... as noted in the original
posting the fence
will be in the shape of a rectangle 25 foot long x 4 foot across.
Shallow enough
so that any bounding deer will probably bound right over it, unless they
are skilled
high divers.... or another deer holds them by the ankles and dips them
into
the enclosure...... 25 foot long as I'm enclosing a row of shrubs instead
of
caging them individually.

If it were me I wouldn't want anyone to hold me by the ankles and dip me,
but
heck maybe deer are different).

So 4 foot from one edge of fence to the other side..

Val presented a good point.... they can probably get under a 6" fence...
it'll be
lowered to 4" above ground... gotta have some space to get a trimmer in
there.

This is for euonymous 'manhattan'. There is already another hedge about
8' tall growing elsewhere on the property... Browseline is only about 5
foot
during winter. The bushes handle the stress fairly well and regrow every
year. I'm
hoping to duplicate the hedge in another area.

The fence is temporary, to protect younger plants until they get
established. Thus
a 4' height.... (it's a trade off for temporary purposes)

turkey wire or chicken wire sounds good. I'm hesitant to stand on a
ladder
driving 7' green posts into the ground using a sledge...... are there
3' green metal
fence posts that extensions can be bolted onto ???

Thought about using lumber and stapling the wire mesh, but 2 x 2's are
kinda
expensive at Home Depot... is this what is commonly used in gardens or
is there a "garden' variety lumber used for temporary fencing. ???

Hope this clarifies things a little....

Peter

You are making much too much of this... try not thinking so much. First of
all regarding deer there is no such thing as temporary, they will eat plants
of any age at any time of year, so you had best consider something permanent
and long lasting. And it's not just deer, many critters eat plants,
especially bunnies, but so do burrowers. Sink 6" X 6" treated fence posts
into the ground so to circumscribe the perimneter of your enclosure...
that'll keep all but the most persistant burrowers out. Next use fish
plates to join the posts, and especially in the corners. Then to stabilze
the lumber from frost heaving drill 1/2" holes through at 4' intervals and
drive 18" lengths of rebar through. Then along the inside perimeter drive
4' metal wire fencing posts every 4' and in each corner so tehe foot plate
is even with the top face of the lumber, a good way to keep all the same
height. Then bolt them to the lumber (you will probably need to drill holes
in the metal posts). Next attach 4' wide turkey wire to the posts, leaving
a section removable for entry. You'll have no opening at the bottom but
won't need one for grass trimming, just string trim right to the lumber. No
deer are going to leap over a 4' fence into a narrow enclosure, because they
instinctively know that they'll have no way out. For a 24' X 4' enclosure
you're looking at like $175 in material.

Really not very noticable and no deer get in:
http://i39.tinypic.com/9thky8.jpg

I assure you there are deer here, I also need to fence young trees:
http://i41.tinypic.com/flv5sg.jpg

My vegetable garden has a 4 foot wire fence around it and it is
electric. Any animal that gets a jolt won't get near it again. It is
charged all year so everyone learns.

On Mon, 20 Apr 2009 13:45:57 -0400, "JoeSpareBedroom" wrote:

wrote in message
.. .
On Mon, 20 Apr 2009 12:53:28 -0400, "JoeSpareBedroom"
wrote:

Peter@yah


snipped so we don't go crazy reading all the stuff....

72" height chicken wire??

Peter




Where are you located?


Columbia, Maryland.... halfway between D.C. and Baltimore...


You want to go to Home Depot, inconveniently located in Columbia MD. Look
for rolls of 6 foot green metal fence with rectangular openings, and green
metal posts with notches matched to the openings in the fence wire. You
don't have to hook the fence material into those notches. I simply mentioned
the notches to help you identify the posts.

The posts do NOT have to be as high as the fence. All that matters is the
height of the fence. Tie small pieces of white cloth to the top of the fence
every few feet to be sure the deer see it at night. If you want, you can
dissolve some shards of Irish Spring soap in hot water and soak the rag
pieces in it. Couldn't hurt.

If you don't have a ladder that makes you feel safe when pounding the posts
into the ground, it's time to buy a better ladder. My posts are NOT 2' in
the ground and it doesn't matter. If some crazy deer decides to jump the
fence and hits the top on the way over, the posts will bend no matter how
deep you set them.


That's a workable plan..... I was thinking the posts should be as high
as the fence.... your alternative should work just as well.....

Don't set so deep,
work with existing material height
bring the fencing up past the posts
place markers on top.

Fortunately I use Irish Spring myself so there's always a plentiful supply
of soap chips available.

There are 3 HD's and 1 Lowes within a 10 mile radius....

Another poster 'newsreader' mentioned a supply shop over in Mt. Airy...which
is a driveable distance. Always worth a trip to a new supply shop... just
to browse.

brooklyn1 suggestedd a removeable section of fence to get inside. that'll
work.

Looks like all the bases have been covered.... time to get to work.

Thanking you all for your help, advice and expertise !!!! The s.o. will
be happy, the shrubs will be happy, the deer will not have to be dipped,
(making them happy) and hopefully I won't kill myself on the ladder....

Sounds like a winner all around !!

Peter

On Mon, 20 Apr 2009 13:32:38 -0400, newsreader wrote:

wrote:

Where are you located?


Columbia, Maryland.... halfway between D.C. and Baltimore...

Tractor Supply Co in Mt Airy lists 48" or 60" x 100' rolls of 2" x 4"
wire, along with 6 1/2' posts.

I'm in the process of doing some of the same as you. I'm in Highland,
MD and the deer are totally out of control on my street.

Steel & Wire Products in Baltimore has a much more extensive offering of
fencing & posts than TSC offers.
I ordered 7' posts and 5' wire from them.
You need to be a reseller or large commercial account to buy from S & W

Good luck on your fencing.

Just a homeowner so I'll swing over to TSC .... always fun to visit a
new supply shop, even just to browse.

I'm in a development off 29 and 175...... From first glance it's pretty heavily
developed, however my property is lowest point in the valley backing onto open space.
There's a EPA protected stream in the backyard and wetlands slightly higher. The land
along route 29 is wooded... home to a lot of deer and other critters.

The old Smith Farm is just a walk away.... used to be herds of deer over there, but the
county purchased the land after old lady Smith died. Feisty old lady, she chased the
governor off her property once. Anyway, the county cut down the trees to turn 300 acres
of woodland into ballfields and horseshoe pits.

Lots of new strip malls, Wal Mart, townhouses.... all available property was developed
during the housing boom, plus a lot of infill. My neighborhood was untouched...
although we did have to fight off a developer or two... and their politician buddies.

To further compound the problem... Columbia is a 'company' town. The original
developer Rouse Corporation, bought all the property... developed the houses,
and held onto the commercial property. So they are the biggest 'landlord' with
control over almost everything. Rouse sold out to General Growth Properties
which just declared bankruptcy... the area is a mess.

Even though this is 'Columbia reserved open space' the HOA mowers
still chop down everything.... place is bare during the winter months. (think 'Edward
Scissorhands' or 'Over the Hedge' type of community... that's Columbia. Bedroom
type of community, everyone commutes to Washington D.C. They used
to measure the height of the grass.

So the deer and wildlife congregate over at my house... furthest house back in the
development. Probably the only place with year round vegetation.

It's always a balancing act between critters and me.... we kinda tolerate
each other.... everybody has their section of the yard... IF these shrubs get
high enough... they'll provide some food and shelter. I'll have more privacy...
and the s.o. who is here only on weekends will be able to see her stuff growing.

Peter

wrote in message
...
On Mon, 20 Apr 2009 13:45:57 -0400, "JoeSpareBedroom"
wrote:

wrote in message
. ..
On Mon, 20 Apr 2009 12:53:28 -0400, "JoeSpareBedroom"
wrote:

Peter@yah


snipped so we don't go crazy reading all the stuff....

72" height chicken wire??

Peter




Where are you located?


Columbia, Maryland.... halfway between D.C. and Baltimore...


You want to go to Home Depot, inconveniently located in Columbia MD. Look
for rolls of 6 foot green metal fence with rectangular openings, and green
metal posts with notches matched to the openings in the fence wire. You
don't have to hook the fence material into those notches. I simply
mentioned
the notches to help you identify the posts.

The posts do NOT have to be as high as the fence. All that matters is the
height of the fence. Tie small pieces of white cloth to the top of the
fence
every few feet to be sure the deer see it at night. If you want, you can
dissolve some shards of Irish Spring soap in hot water and soak the rag
pieces in it. Couldn't hurt.

If you don't have a ladder that makes you feel safe when pounding the
posts
into the ground, it's time to buy a better ladder. My posts are NOT 2' in
the ground and it doesn't matter. If some crazy deer decides to jump the
fence and hits the top on the way over, the posts will bend no matter how
deep you set them.


That's a workable plan..... I was thinking the posts should be as high
as the fence.... your alternative should work just as well.....

Don't set so deep,
work with existing material height
bring the fencing up past the posts
place markers on top.

Fortunately I use Irish Spring myself so there's always a plentiful supply
of soap chips available.

There are 3 HD's and 1 Lowes within a 10 mile radius....

Another poster 'newsreader' mentioned a supply shop over in Mt.
Airy...which
is a driveable distance. Always worth a trip to a new supply shop...
just
to browse.

brooklyn1 suggestedd a removeable section of fence to get inside.
that'll
work.

Looks like all the bases have been covered.... time to get to work.

Thanking you all for your help, advice and expertise !!!! The s.o.
will
be happy, the shrubs will be happy, the deer will not have to be dipped,
(making them happy) and hopefully I won't kill myself on the ladder....

Sounds like a winner all around !!

Peter

If you want to pound in 6' posts (which I think are ridiculous for your
purpose) don't try to swing a full handled sledge hammer from atop a step
ladder, you'll kill yourself, at least cripple yourself. Use an engineer's
hammer while standing on a milk box or a rubbermaid step stool... everyone
who anticipates any heavy hammering needs an engineer's hammer.

wrote in message
...
On Mon, 20 Apr 2009 11:17:00 -0400, "JoeSpareBedroom"
wrote:

wrote in message
. ..
On Sun, 19 Apr 2009 11:31:33 -0400, wrote:


Well, the s.o. and I walked the grounds today.... everything looks
fairly
good, except
something destroyed half the tulip bed yesterday night.

She decided my next project is to build a deer protection fence to
protect
a line of
shrubs from the critters.

About 20 - 25 feet long, 4 feet wide 4 feet high type of cage
(rectangle)
Needs to be about 6" off the ground to allow space for cutting small
areas
of grass,
clippers or string trimmer... doesn't matter which.
Temporary- will only be there for 2 - 3 years to allow plants to
establish themselves.
Discreet - something the neighbors will not notice ( ha - if THATS
possible).
Inexpensive -

A fence which is not a fence to protect a line of shrubs from persistent
deer. The
homeowners association goes into a frenzied panic with even a garden
plot... they'll
go totally beserk with any type of permanent structure.

I'm thinking those green posts with chicken wire. Perhaps even the
green
plastic fencing
with the more solid mesh.

Any other fencing material that might be considered. Its gotta be a
physical barrier...
all the other stuff has been tried.

Thanks !!

Peter


Thanks all, for the suggestions and recommendations....

Okay, I need to simplify just a little... as noted in the original
posting the fence
will be in the shape of a rectangle 25 foot long x 4 foot across.
Shallow enough
so that any bounding deer will probably bound right over it, unless they
are skilled
high divers.... or another deer holds them by the ankles and dips
them
into
the enclosure...... 25 foot long as I'm enclosing a row of shrubs
instead
of
caging them individually.

If it were me I wouldn't want anyone to hold me by the ankles and dip
me,
but
heck maybe deer are different).

So 4 foot from one edge of fence to the other side..

Val presented a good point.... they can probably get under a 6" fence...
it'll be
lowered to 4" above ground... gotta have some space to get a trimmer in
there.

This is for euonymous 'manhattan'. There is already another hedge
about
8' tall growing elsewhere on the property... Browseline is only about
5
foot
during winter. The bushes handle the stress fairly well and regrow
every
year. I'm
hoping to duplicate the hedge in another area.

The fence is temporary, to protect younger plants until they get
established. Thus
a 4' height.... (it's a trade off for temporary purposes)

turkey wire or chicken wire sounds good. I'm hesitant to stand on a
ladder
driving 7' green posts into the ground using a sledge...... are
there
3' green metal
fence posts that extensions can be bolted onto ???

Thought about using lumber and stapling the wire mesh, but 2 x 2's are
kinda
expensive at Home Depot... is this what is commonly used in gardens or
is there a "garden' variety lumber used for temporary fencing. ???

Hope this clarifies things a little....

Peter


Use the metal stakes made for the purpose. Not cheap, but you'll probably
find uses for them over the years. Use electrical wire ties to hold the
mesh
in place.

The deer will get over the 4' fence without even touching it. Not sure why
you have an aversion to using 6' fence, which is more likely to work. Do
you
like wasting money?


The height of the fence is based upon local availability of material.

The stores I've checked so far seem to have 6' post... 24 inches in the
ground
and 48" above... with rolls of 48" chicken wire.. thus 48" high.

If you did a 6' fence... what length metal posts and how to drive them
into the ground
without swinging a sledge while standing on a ladder. (no pickup truck
either).

I haven't seen any combo base post and extensions.... ie. 3' foot, drive
24" inches
into the ground and then use a 5' extension for the top portion. 6'
post with a 2'
extension ?? Does something like this exist?? Using off the shelf
materials
rather than cutting and drilling.

72" height chicken wire??

Peter



Some of my thoughts:
Even "chicken wire" requires some tensioning. The corner posts are critical
in holding tension. You may need something in a more permanent nature for
the corner posts, especially if the ground is soft when dry or wet.

Look for places that supply farms and ranches for fencing that's not
normally carried in the local "box" store.
--
Dave

"Dioclese" NONE wrote in message
m...
wrote in message
...
On Mon, 20 Apr 2009 11:17:00 -0400, "JoeSpareBedroom"
wrote:

wrote in message
...
On Sun, 19 Apr 2009 11:31:33 -0400, wrote:


Well, the s.o. and I walked the grounds today.... everything looks
fairly
good, except
something destroyed half the tulip bed yesterday night.

She decided my next project is to build a deer protection fence to
protect
a line of
shrubs from the critters.

About 20 - 25 feet long, 4 feet wide 4 feet high type of cage
(rectangle)
Needs to be about 6" off the ground to allow space for cutting small
areas
of grass,
clippers or string trimmer... doesn't matter which.
Temporary- will only be there for 2 - 3 years to allow plants to
establish themselves.
Discreet - something the neighbors will not notice ( ha - if THATS
possible).
Inexpensive -

A fence which is not a fence to protect a line of shrubs from
persistent
deer. The
homeowners association goes into a frenzied panic with even a garden
plot... they'll
go totally beserk with any type of permanent structure.

I'm thinking those green posts with chicken wire. Perhaps even the
green
plastic fencing
with the more solid mesh.

Any other fencing material that might be considered. Its gotta be a
physical barrier...
all the other stuff has been tried.

Thanks !!

Peter


Thanks all, for the suggestions and recommendations....

Okay, I need to simplify just a little... as noted in the original
posting the fence
will be in the shape of a rectangle 25 foot long x 4 foot across.
Shallow enough
so that any bounding deer will probably bound right over it, unless
they
are skilled
high divers.... or another deer holds them by the ankles and dips
them
into
the enclosure...... 25 foot long as I'm enclosing a row of shrubs
instead
of
caging them individually.

If it were me I wouldn't want anyone to hold me by the ankles and dip
me,
but
heck maybe deer are different).

So 4 foot from one edge of fence to the other side..

Val presented a good point.... they can probably get under a 6"
fence...
it'll be
lowered to 4" above ground... gotta have some space to get a trimmer in
there.

This is for euonymous 'manhattan'. There is already another hedge
about
8' tall growing elsewhere on the property... Browseline is only about
5
foot
during winter. The bushes handle the stress fairly well and regrow
every
year. I'm
hoping to duplicate the hedge in another area.

The fence is temporary, to protect younger plants until they get
established. Thus
a 4' height.... (it's a trade off for temporary purposes)

turkey wire or chicken wire sounds good. I'm hesitant to stand on
a
ladder
driving 7' green posts into the ground using a sledge...... are
there
3' green metal
fence posts that extensions can be bolted onto ???

Thought about using lumber and stapling the wire mesh, but 2 x 2's are
kinda
expensive at Home Depot... is this what is commonly used in gardens or
is there a "garden' variety lumber used for temporary fencing. ???

Hope this clarifies things a little....

Peter


Use the metal stakes made for the purpose. Not cheap, but you'll probably
find uses for them over the years. Use electrical wire ties to hold the
mesh
in place.

The deer will get over the 4' fence without even touching it. Not sure
why
you have an aversion to using 6' fence, which is more likely to work. Do
you
like wasting money?


The height of the fence is based upon local availability of material.

The stores I've checked so far seem to have 6' post... 24 inches in the
ground
and 48" above... with rolls of 48" chicken wire.. thus 48" high.

If you did a 6' fence... what length metal posts and how to drive them
into the ground
without swinging a sledge while standing on a ladder. (no pickup truck
either).

I haven't seen any combo base post and extensions.... ie. 3' foot,
drive 24" inches
into the ground and then use a 5' extension for the top portion. 6'
post with a 2'
extension ?? Does something like this exist?? Using off the shelf
materials
rather than cutting and drilling.

72" height chicken wire??

Peter



Some of my thoughts:
Even "chicken wire" requires some tensioning. The corner posts are
critical in holding tension. You may need something in a more permanent
nature for the corner posts, especially if the ground is soft when dry or
wet.

Look for places that supply farms and ranches for fencing that's not
normally carried in the local "box" store.
--
Dave


I've not seen chicken wire in widths over 48". And chicken wire can only be
tensioned lengthwise, (in the direction the single strand wires run),
attempting to tension it widthwise it'll just keep stretching until all the
octogon holes close up, it'll be ruined. Chicken wire is too flimsy to span
more than like 30" between fence posts. Chicken wire is really not designed
to be tensioned like chain link fence, it's best to use chickenwire totally
relaxed as it comes off the roll, no tension applied at all... applying
tension will cause chicken wire to distort, making it quite difficult to
work with. I use chicken wire to temporarilly afford some protection to
young trees, I would never use it for serious fencing, it definitely won't
keep deer out... deer won't need to leap over, they'll simply knock
chickenwire down low enough with their hoofs (and necks) to walk right over
it. Chicken wire is weak, a good sized chicken can distort it enough to
find a way through (imagine a two hundred pound deer), that's why turkey
wire is more often used, and in conjunction with chicken wire to contain
tiny poultry. I used chicken wire attached at the bottom of my turkey ware
vegetable garden fence to keep rabbits out but chicken wire doesn't last
long, it rusts and rots and within three years begins to disintergrate,
especially the portion right near the ground... I now use heavy gauge
hardware cloth.

"brooklyn1" wrote in message
...

"Dioclese" NONE wrote in message
m...
wrote in message
...
On Mon, 20 Apr 2009 11:17:00 -0400, "JoeSpareBedroom"
wrote:

wrote in message
m...
On Sun, 19 Apr 2009 11:31:33 -0400, wrote:


Well, the s.o. and I walked the grounds today.... everything looks
fairly
good, except
something destroyed half the tulip bed yesterday night.

She decided my next project is to build a deer protection fence to
protect
a line of
shrubs from the critters.

About 20 - 25 feet long, 4 feet wide 4 feet high type of cage
(rectangle)
Needs to be about 6" off the ground to allow space for cutting small
areas
of grass,
clippers or string trimmer... doesn't matter which.
Temporary- will only be there for 2 - 3 years to allow plants to
establish themselves.
Discreet - something the neighbors will not notice ( ha - if THATS
possible).
Inexpensive -

A fence which is not a fence to protect a line of shrubs from
persistent
deer. The
homeowners association goes into a frenzied panic with even a garden
plot... they'll
go totally beserk with any type of permanent structure.

I'm thinking those green posts with chicken wire. Perhaps even the
green
plastic fencing
with the more solid mesh.

Any other fencing material that might be considered. Its gotta be a
physical barrier...
all the other stuff has been tried.

Thanks !!

Peter


Thanks all, for the suggestions and recommendations....

Okay, I need to simplify just a little... as noted in the original
posting the fence
will be in the shape of a rectangle 25 foot long x 4 foot across.
Shallow enough
so that any bounding deer will probably bound right over it, unless
they
are skilled
high divers.... or another deer holds them by the ankles and dips
them
into
the enclosure...... 25 foot long as I'm enclosing a row of shrubs
instead
of
caging them individually.

If it were me I wouldn't want anyone to hold me by the ankles and dip
me,
but
heck maybe deer are different).

So 4 foot from one edge of fence to the other side..

Val presented a good point.... they can probably get under a 6"
fence...
it'll be
lowered to 4" above ground... gotta have some space to get a trimmer
in
there.

This is for euonymous 'manhattan'. There is already another hedge
about
8' tall growing elsewhere on the property... Browseline is only
about 5
foot
during winter. The bushes handle the stress fairly well and regrow
every
year. I'm
hoping to duplicate the hedge in another area.

The fence is temporary, to protect younger plants until they get
established. Thus
a 4' height.... (it's a trade off for temporary purposes)

turkey wire or chicken wire sounds good. I'm hesitant to stand on
a
ladder
driving 7' green posts into the ground using a sledge...... are
there
3' green metal
fence posts that extensions can be bolted onto ???

Thought about using lumber and stapling the wire mesh, but 2 x 2's
are
kinda
expensive at Home Depot... is this what is commonly used in gardens
or
is there a "garden' variety lumber used for temporary fencing. ???

Hope this clarifies things a little....

Peter


Use the metal stakes made for the purpose. Not cheap, but you'll
probably
find uses for them over the years. Use electrical wire ties to hold the
mesh
in place.

The deer will get over the 4' fence without even touching it. Not sure
why
you have an aversion to using 6' fence, which is more likely to work. Do
you
like wasting money?


The height of the fence is based upon local availability of material.

The stores I've checked so far seem to have 6' post... 24 inches in the
ground
and 48" above... with rolls of 48" chicken wire.. thus 48" high.

If you did a 6' fence... what length metal posts and how to drive them
into the ground
without swinging a sledge while standing on a ladder. (no pickup truck
either).

I haven't seen any combo base post and extensions.... ie. 3' foot,
drive 24" inches
into the ground and then use a 5' extension for the top portion. 6'
post with a 2'
extension ?? Does something like this exist?? Using off the shelf
materials
rather than cutting and drilling.

72" height chicken wire??

Peter



Some of my thoughts:
Even "chicken wire" requires some tensioning. The corner posts are
critical in holding tension. You may need something in a more permanent
nature for the corner posts, especially if the ground is soft when dry or
wet.

Look for places that supply farms and ranches for fencing that's not
normally carried in the local "box" store.
--
Dave


I've not seen chicken wire in widths over 48". And chicken wire can only
be tensioned lengthwise, (in the direction the single strand wires run),
attempting to tension it widthwise it'll just keep stretching until all
the octogon holes close up, it'll be ruined. Chicken wire is too flimsy
to span more than like 30" between fence posts. Chicken wire is really
not designed to be tensioned like chain link fence, it's best to use
chickenwire totally relaxed as it comes off the roll, no tension applied
at all... applying tension will cause chicken wire to distort, making it
quite difficult to work with. I use chicken wire to temporarilly afford
some protection to young trees, I would never use it for serious fencing,
it definitely won't keep deer out... deer won't need to leap over, they'll
simply knock chickenwire down low enough with their hoofs (and necks) to
walk right over it. Chicken wire is weak, a good sized chicken can
distort it enough to find a way through (imagine a two hundred pound
deer), that's why turkey wire is more often used, and in conjunction with
chicken wire to contain tiny poultry. I used chicken wire attached at the
bottom of my turkey ware vegetable garden fence to keep rabbits out but
chicken wire doesn't last long, it rusts and rots and within three years
begins to disintergrate, especially the portion right near the ground... I
now use heavy gauge hardware cloth.


All wire type fencing requires some tensioning. I never and won't say how
much. I never suggested use of "chicken wire". Too bad you can't get over
that...

Turkey wire fencing has to be tight and you need at least corner posts to
support that tension. You addressed that in your own response elsewhere.
But failed to say the words "corner posts" as it would easily be correlated
to my previious response, therefore, I would be correct.

"Turkey wire" is a very ambiguous/vague term. If you're going to designate
its use, you need to be specific in the wire gauge, wire material, and its
wire spacing.

"Hardware cloth" is also vague. Especially in use near or on the ground.
It material make-up is extremely important as result when suggesting using
it.
--
Dave

"Dioclese" NONE wrote in message
...
"brooklyn1" wrote in message
...

"Dioclese" NONE wrote in message
m...
wrote in message
...
On Mon, 20 Apr 2009 11:17:00 -0400, "JoeSpareBedroom"
wrote:

wrote in message
om...
On Sun, 19 Apr 2009 11:31:33 -0400, wrote:


Well, the s.o. and I walked the grounds today.... everything looks
fairly
good, except
something destroyed half the tulip bed yesterday night.

She decided my next project is to build a deer protection fence to
protect
a line of
shrubs from the critters.

About 20 - 25 feet long, 4 feet wide 4 feet high type of cage
(rectangle)
Needs to be about 6" off the ground to allow space for cutting small
areas
of grass,
clippers or string trimmer... doesn't matter which.
Temporary- will only be there for 2 - 3 years to allow plants to
establish themselves.
Discreet - something the neighbors will not notice ( ha - if THATS
possible).
Inexpensive -

A fence which is not a fence to protect a line of shrubs from
persistent
deer. The
homeowners association goes into a frenzied panic with even a garden
plot... they'll
go totally beserk with any type of permanent structure.

I'm thinking those green posts with chicken wire. Perhaps even the
green
plastic fencing
with the more solid mesh.

Any other fencing material that might be considered. Its gotta be
a
physical barrier...
all the other stuff has been tried.

Thanks !!

Peter


Thanks all, for the suggestions and recommendations....

Okay, I need to simplify just a little... as noted in the original
posting the fence
will be in the shape of a rectangle 25 foot long x 4 foot across.
Shallow enough
so that any bounding deer will probably bound right over it, unless
they
are skilled
high divers.... or another deer holds them by the ankles and dips
them
into
the enclosure...... 25 foot long as I'm enclosing a row of shrubs
instead
of
caging them individually.

If it were me I wouldn't want anyone to hold me by the ankles and
dip me,
but
heck maybe deer are different).

So 4 foot from one edge of fence to the other side..

Val presented a good point.... they can probably get under a 6"
fence...
it'll be
lowered to 4" above ground... gotta have some space to get a trimmer
in
there.

This is for euonymous 'manhattan'. There is already another hedge
about
8' tall growing elsewhere on the property... Browseline is only
about 5
foot
during winter. The bushes handle the stress fairly well and regrow
every
year. I'm
hoping to duplicate the hedge in another area.

The fence is temporary, to protect younger plants until they get
established. Thus
a 4' height.... (it's a trade off for temporary purposes)

turkey wire or chicken wire sounds good. I'm hesitant to stand
on a
ladder
driving 7' green posts into the ground using a sledge...... are
there
3' green metal
fence posts that extensions can be bolted onto ???

Thought about using lumber and stapling the wire mesh, but 2 x 2's
are
kinda
expensive at Home Depot... is this what is commonly used in gardens
or
is there a "garden' variety lumber used for temporary fencing. ???

Hope this clarifies things a little....

Peter


Use the metal stakes made for the purpose. Not cheap, but you'll
probably
find uses for them over the years. Use electrical wire ties to hold the
mesh
in place.

The deer will get over the 4' fence without even touching it. Not sure
why
you have an aversion to using 6' fence, which is more likely to work.
Do you
like wasting money?


The height of the fence is based upon local availability of material.

The stores I've checked so far seem to have 6' post... 24 inches in the
ground
and 48" above... with rolls of 48" chicken wire.. thus 48" high.

If you did a 6' fence... what length metal posts and how to drive
them into the ground
without swinging a sledge while standing on a ladder. (no pickup
truck either).

I haven't seen any combo base post and extensions.... ie. 3' foot,
drive 24" inches
into the ground and then use a 5' extension for the top portion. 6'
post with a 2'
extension ?? Does something like this exist?? Using off the shelf
materials
rather than cutting and drilling.

72" height chicken wire??

Peter



Some of my thoughts:
Even "chicken wire" requires some tensioning. The corner posts are
critical in holding tension. You may need something in a more permanent
nature for the corner posts, especially if the ground is soft when dry
or wet.

Look for places that supply farms and ranches for fencing that's not
normally carried in the local "box" store.
--
Dave


I've not seen chicken wire in widths over 48". And chicken wire can only
be tensioned lengthwise, (in the direction the single strand wires run),
attempting to tension it widthwise it'll just keep stretching until all
the octogon holes close up, it'll be ruined. Chicken wire is too flimsy
to span more than like 30" between fence posts. Chicken wire is really
not designed to be tensioned like chain link fence, it's best to use
chickenwire totally relaxed as it comes off the roll, no tension applied
at all... applying tension will cause chicken wire to distort, making it
quite difficult to work with. I use chicken wire to temporarilly afford
some protection to young trees, I would never use it for serious fencing,
it definitely won't keep deer out... deer won't need to leap over,
they'll simply knock chickenwire down low enough with their hoofs (and
necks) to walk right over it. Chicken wire is weak, a good sized chicken
can distort it enough to find a way through (imagine a two hundred pound
deer), that's why turkey wire is more often used, and in conjunction with
chicken wire to contain tiny poultry. I used chicken wire attached at
the bottom of my turkey ware vegetable garden fence to keep rabbits out
but chicken wire doesn't last long, it rusts and rots and within three
years begins to disintergrate, especially the portion right near the
ground... I now use heavy gauge hardware cloth.


All wire type fencing requires some tensioning. I never and won't say how
much. I never suggested use of "chicken wire". Too bad you can't get
over that...

Turkey wire fencing has to be tight and you need at least corner posts to
support that tension. You addressed that in your own response elsewhere.
But failed to say the words "corner posts" as it would easily be
correlated to my previious response, therefore, I would be correct.

"Turkey wire" is a very ambiguous/vague term. If you're going to
designate its use, you need to be specific in the wire gauge, wire
material, and its wire spacing.

"Hardware cloth" is also vague. Especially in use near or on the ground.
It material make-up is extremely important as result when suggesting using
it.
--
Dave


Let me not be vague... you are a pointy headed imbecile... in fact you win
the Pointy Headed Imbecile Award® for the month of April.

/\
/ \
/ \
/ \
| ¤ ¤ |
| ¿ |
| «» |
|_______| --- Dave

Pointy-Headed Imbecile Award® April 2009

wrote:
Well, the s.o. and I walked the grounds today.... everything looks fairly good, except
something destroyed half the tulip bed yesterday night.

She decided my next project is to build a deer protection fence to protect a line of
shrubs from the critters.

About 20 - 25 feet long, 4 feet wide 4 feet high type of cage (rectangle)
Needs to be about 6" off the ground to allow space for cutting small areas of grass,
clippers or string trimmer... doesn't matter which.
Temporary- will only be there for 2 - 3 years to allow plants to establish themselves.
Discreet - something the neighbors will not notice ( ha - if THATS possible).
Inexpensive -

A fence which is not a fence to protect a line of shrubs from persistent deer. The
homeowners association goes into a frenzied panic with even a garden plot... they'll
go totally beserk with any type of permanent structure.

I'm thinking those green posts with chicken wire. Perhaps even the green plastic fencing
with the more solid mesh.

Any other fencing material that might be considered. Its gotta be a physical barrier...
all the other stuff has been tried.

Thanks !!

Peter

We have used 6 wire electric fence to protect a row of bushes. The
fence is 6 feet high and the deer go around the fence now and not one
bush was chewed up this winter.

--
Sheila
http://swdalton.com