Self-Sufficiency Acreage Requirement?
"Richard Lewis" wrote in message
(George Cleveland) wrote: Jeez, I don't see that at all. The guy is keeping his day job. He can do it from home via a satellite link up. He just wants to know what he would need to keep himself in food and off the treadmill of consumerism. Noble goals, although the slant towards isolation is a bit worrying Really? The post I saw was about a guy building his own off-grid house on his own land and going totally self-sufficient. You are both reading into the original post something that was not there. The "slant towards isolation" is an interpretation and was not mentioned as is the "guy building his own off-grid house". Andrew may or may not intend to build and he may or may not intend to seek isolation but he certainly didn't mention doing either thing. It is still very possible in NZ to have a house built by a reasonably traditional builder, to be off the grid and collect one's own water off the roof to have a septic toilet (or even a composting toilet) and still live a full and active socially involved life. |
Self-Sufficiency Acreage Requirement?
"Noah Simoneaux" wrote in message
... I've noticed that many gardening books ignore potatoes, since they're so cheap to buy in the store it just doesn't pay to grow them at home. Just try finding some of the better varieties for home gardeners and taste them and the store-bought potatoes will never taste the same for you. I've done that with tomatoes. I think I'd ditch those gardening books as they are don't seem to know much about a very important subject :-)) Having just looked through some of my books I notice that a lot of them that I use most regularly emphasise the importance of growing even a few potatoes in even a restricted garden space. These books all seem to stress the same point which I find of most importance: - that it is impossible to buy a decent potato in any supermarket and finding a good spud is a very hard task if one doesn't have a garden. I have found one shop which does supply good potatoes (in a very large regional hunt) and they are still in the hessian (burlap) bag that comes from the grower. It is a matter of digging in and getting ones hands dirty in order to get the potatoes but they ARE good potoatoes (unlike anything that comes in a plastic bag). |
Self-Sufficiency Acreage Requirement?
(paghat) writes:
It seems strange to me that "normal" people so rarely buy into the self-sufficient cooperative idea. It's so often either antisemitic klan types trying to get away from the mark-of-cain ******s & world-taking-over yids, armed to the teeth & waiting for the Feds to break down the doors & kill everyone; or else complete stoners who never outgrew the far-out-man hippy era or wish they lived in an L-5 [..] ....or, say, much of India. -- mike [at] mike [dash] warren.com URL:http://www.mike-warren.com GPG: 0x579911BD :: 87F2 4D98 BDB0 0E90 EE2A 0CF9 1087 0884 5799 11BD |
Self-Sufficiency Acreage Requirement?
On Thu, 11 Dec 2003 15:16:55 -0800, Jim Dauven
said: North wrote: On Thu, 11 Dec 2003 11:28:30 -0800, Jim Dauven said: snipped all the the stuff The Independent Your getting better at this ;-) You know you should read a little before you accept all the bull shit that RAL puts out. (That is assuming that he and you are not the same person.) The Independent Sorry, but my flaming you has nothing to do with RAL. Had you been paying attention in past replys, you will find many times where I agree with you on many aspects. I just don't get caught up in all the TEOTWIDIOT crap. Instead of throwing a temper, you used the facts that I posted against me. Well done !! Here's my over all point. When you write a post and make claims, if you do not wish to get stepped on, for being a braggart, post a 'few' links to data to support your claim. Thats why when I posted the goat FAQ, I put "FWIW" (I wanted to see if you were paying attantion :-)) Understand my giving you shit, is all in good clean fun, its not personal. Only meant to spark up even further discussion. All the best, North. |
Self-Sufficiency Acreage Requirement?
"paghat" wrote in message
It would be nice if regular sober middle-of-the-road folks with NEITHER the cultic eco-jargon nor the fear/hate agenda could have rural eco-friendly dreams & then really achieve them, but one rarely sees that; if it exists it doesn't advertise itself as loudly. There are plenty of people like that. Perhaps not in the US but at least 3 other countries I can think of have lots of people like that. |
Self-Sufficiency Acreage Requirement?
On Thu, 11 Dec 2003 15:16:55 -0800, Jim Dauven
said: North wrote: On Thu, 11 Dec 2003 11:28:30 -0800, Jim Dauven said: (That is assuming that he and you are not the same person.) Learn to operate that computer Jim. Learn to read headers. |
Self-Sufficiency Acreage Requirement?
Here was a project to determine self sufficient needs and work. Done at UC Santa Cruz. Even in California he came up a few months short of a years supply. They say mainly because of a bad potato crop. But, it was only a 4500 sqaure foot garden. It lists the crops, the area planted in square feet and the yields in pounds per crop. Should give you a good idea of the size and numbers you might need. http://www.cityfarmer.org/albie.html. "Down Under On The Bucket Farm" wrote in message ... Hi Everybody, I am working on long-term plans for self-sufficiency, oriented to buying some bare land and building an off-grid house, rainwater catchment, composting toilet, etc, etc. One issue is the question of how much physical space would be needed to grow enough food to completely support myself? I am willing to eat anything that is healthy, preferably remaining vegetarian (although I am quite willing to have chickens for eggs, and perhaps a goat for milk.) This would involve one person living alone, in decent physical condition, willing to do hard work and learn whatever is needed. I realise that the yearly food yield will have to be spread out via preserving, canning, etc. My "day job" can be done remotely, via wireless Internet connection, with flexible hours, thus leaving time and opportunity for extensive gardening/farming, etc. I do understand the risk of, for example, having a bad year, bad weather, etc, and so would have money set aside to buy food in that case. But the plan is to avoid that if at all possible. I live in New Zealand, with plenty of rain in winter, but also reasonable sunshine in summer. So... How many acres of flat, farm-able land will I need? Thanks in advance! -V. -- Guide To DIY Living http://www.self-reliance.co.nz (Work in progress) |
Self-Sufficiency Acreage Requirement?
Here's another site that gives yields in pounds for a given area and number of plants. http://www.foodforeveryone.org/garde...s/yields.shtml "Down Under On The Bucket Farm" wrote in message ... Hi Everybody, I am working on long-term plans for self-sufficiency, oriented to buying some bare land and building an off-grid house, rainwater catchment, composting toilet, etc, etc. One issue is the question of how much physical space would be needed to grow enough food to completely support myself? I am willing to eat anything that is healthy, preferably remaining vegetarian (although I am quite willing to have chickens for eggs, and perhaps a goat for milk.) This would involve one person living alone, in decent physical condition, willing to do hard work and learn whatever is needed. I realise that the yearly food yield will have to be spread out via preserving, canning, etc. My "day job" can be done remotely, via wireless Internet connection, with flexible hours, thus leaving time and opportunity for extensive gardening/farming, etc. I do understand the risk of, for example, having a bad year, bad weather, etc, and so would have money set aside to buy food in that case. But the plan is to avoid that if at all possible. I live in New Zealand, with plenty of rain in winter, but also reasonable sunshine in summer. So... How many acres of flat, farm-able land will I need? Thanks in advance! -V. -- Guide To DIY Living http://www.self-reliance.co.nz (Work in progress) |
Self-Sufficiency Acreage Requirement?
"Fran" wrote in message u... "Noah Simoneaux" wrote in message ... I've noticed that many gardening books ignore potatoes, since they're so cheap to buy in the store it just doesn't pay to grow them at home. Just try finding some of the better varieties for home gardeners and taste them and the store-bought potatoes will never taste the same for you. I've done that with tomatoes. I think I'd ditch those gardening books as they are don't seem to know much about a very important subject :-)) Having just looked through some of my books I notice that a lot of them that I use most regularly emphasise the importance of growing even a few potatoes in even a restricted garden space. These books all seem to stress the same point which I find of most importance: - that it is impossible to buy a decent potato in any supermarket and finding a good spud is a very hard task if one doesn't have a garden. I have found one shop which does supply good potatoes (in a very large regional hunt) and they are still in the hessian (burlap) bag that comes from the grower. It is a matter of digging in and getting ones hands dirty in order to get the potatoes but they ARE good potoatoes (unlike anything that comes in a plastic bag). Another good reason to plant potatos is that they are a good way to condition the soil. They have a lot of foiliage, and after they start to grow nothing grow under them and the underground growth opens up the soil. We always planted potatoes where we had weed problems the year before because they were so good at crowding out the weeds. And home grown potatoes ar emuch better than store bought for some reason. At least so i recall. |
Self-Sufficiency Acreage Requirement?
North wrote: On Thu, 11 Dec 2003 15:16:55 -0800, Jim Dauven said: North wrote: On Thu, 11 Dec 2003 11:28:30 -0800, Jim Dauven said: (That is assuming that he and you are not the same person.) Learn to operate that computer Jim. Learn to read headers. Hay any body can have a hot mail account and send mail from that account to hide his native email account. That is a old troll trick from way back. Have you native email account, then have a hot mail account, a america online account, have a IBM account, etc., etc. That way you can post and answer it from 6 or 7 different accounts so no one know that your are the same person. Like I said an old troll trick and I don't put stock in anything anyone says that hides behind a unreachable address. Since your writing style is like RAL and you bow and pray to every utterance of RAL I suspect that you are RAL. In to the kill file with yea. The Independent |
Self-Sufficiency Acreage Requirement?
On Fri, 12 Dec 2003 11:49:10 +1100, "Fran"
wrote: The "slant towards isolation" is an interpretation and was not mentioned as is the "guy building his own off-grid house". Andrew may or may not intend to build and he may or may not intend to seek isolation but he certainly didn't mention doing either thing. It is still very possible in NZ to have a house built by a reasonably traditional builder, to be off the grid and collect one's own water off the roof to have a septic toilet (or even a composting toilet) and still live a full and active socially involved life. As did Henry David Thoreau at Walden Pond. He frequently walked into town to see family and friends, and people visited him at the cabin. He also would chat with the crews of the trains that passed nearby. But for the most part, the food he ate was food he grew himself, and he was able to devote a good deal of time to writing, the point of the whole exercise. Happy trails, Gary (net.yogi.bear) ------------------------------------------------ at the 51st percentile of ursine intelligence Gary D. Schwartz, Needham, MA, USA Please reply to: garyDOTschwartzATpoboxDOTcom |
Self-Sufficiency Acreage Requirement?
On Thu, 11 Dec 2003 18:19:56 -0800, Jim Dauven
said: North wrote: On Thu, 11 Dec 2003 15:16:55 -0800, Jim Dauven said: North wrote: On Thu, 11 Dec 2003 11:28:30 -0800, Jim Dauven said: (That is assuming that he and you are not the same person.) Learn to operate that computer Jim. Learn to read headers. Hay any body can have a hot mail account and send mail from that account to hide his native email account. That is a old troll trick from way back. Have you native email account, then have a hot mail account, a america online account, have a IBM account, etc., etc. That way you can post and answer it from 6 or 7 different accounts so no one know that your are the same person. Like I said an old troll trick and I don't put stock in anything anyone says that hides behind a unreachable address. Since your writing style is like RAL and you bow and pray to every utterance of RAL I suspect that you are RAL. In to the kill file with yea. The Independent Learn to read NNTP: posting hosts. Damn dude, you sure are dence, if you think I write like RAL. I can't help it if someone else, such as RAL, or anyother person calls you out on your stupidity. And fwiw, my real addy has been posted to the group, learn to use google, idiot. North. |
Self-Sufficiency Acreage Requirement?
Charles Scripter wrote:
But if you treat these as "vitamins", and grow your _real_food_ elsewhere... Then that 400 square feet begins to look pretty ridiculous in the total, doesn't it? It still gets added into the total land you're working and it makes the previous poster look pretty stupid for suggesting it, Charles. ral -- Charles Scripter * Use this address to reply: cescript at progworks dot net When encryption is outlawed, bayl bhgynjf jvyy unir rapelcgvba. Note: my responses may be slow due to ISP/newsgroup issues |
Self-Sufficiency Acreage Requirement?
North wrote:
Here's my over all point. Here's mine, since no one as of yet seems to have caught it.... The idiot made the claim that "three goats would keep you in meat"....but then goes on to edit that into "a herd of 16 will keep you in meat as long as you avoid eating meat for at least a year". It's hard for them to reproduce if you're eating them. The idiot then goes further to claim that the same three goats will "keep you in milk"....but then goes on to edit that into "a herd of 16 will keep you in milk as long as you avoid all milk from them for at least a year". It's hard for them to reproduce when you're taking all the milk. I really love the fact that not one "fact" cited be the idiot has stood up to examination without being changed once being called on it. Three goats became four and then sixteen....average weights went up and down (he finally said he has pygmy goats and claims they range in weight from 60-150 pounds, breed all year, and are absolutely trouble free. Pygmy goats almost never get above 70 pounds (45-60 is average), are very prone to freezing and illness due to weather (they were bred in desert Afrika), and will begin to modify their reproduction rate to fit any other goat in a non-equatorial climate within three to five years (do the research, idiot). There is a reason why pygmy goats are almost exclusively used as pets in the US and it isn't because it's they're supergoats that make the rest feel bad due to inadequacies. His original claim that "three goats will keep you in meat and milk" for the average survivalist/minimalist lifestyle has thus become "become a goatherd and maintain a minimum of 16 goats to keep yourself in meat and milk". ral |
Self-Sufficiency Acreage Requirement?
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