I have a tree (or weed or some kind of plant) growing out back of my
house. I've only seen one other like it in my life, and that was about
20 years ago, so they are either very uncommon or they are constantly
cut back by homeowners (although I've NEVER seen one in the woods).

Basically it has a single stem or trunk, although there are a couple
of minor offshoots coming off the base.

In its first few weeks in June, it grew roughly 6" per DAY! In the
last month it has only grown another foot and now stands about 15'.
What is more remarkable here is that its root structure HAS to be
horizontal: it is growing out from under a pile of roofing shingles
and tree branches that I discarded on a concrete slab.

The main stem/trunk is about 2" in diameter, woody at the base but
quickly becoming green about a foot or 2 up from the bottom.
About every foot or so are 3 "branches" radiating from the trunk at
roughly 120 degrees. These "branches" each terminate in a single leaf.
The leaf has a shape something like gum, but the lobes are not as
pronounced. The leaf is fuzzy on the bottom side, and the top tends
toward shininess although it also has a slight fuzz. It's pea green on
top and lighter on the bottom.

Now here is the clue that makes this tree unique: most of its leaves
are in excess of 20" across!

Now, you'd think that I could come up with something real quick on
the net to identify this critter with no problem. WRONG!
Almost every damned "plant identification" site is nothing but a
bunch of pictures. I guess you're supposed to look at them until you
see something that you can say "Hey! That's the one!" to. I couldn't
find one single site in which you could taxonomically zero in on an
ID. Is there such a place?

Anyway, I thought I'd try and see if I would have any luck here.

In article , Howd E.
Doodat ? writes
The main stem/trunk is about 2" in diameter, woody at the base but
quickly becoming green about a foot or 2 up from the bottom.
About every foot or so are 3 "branches" radiating from the trunk at
roughly 120 degrees. These "branches" each terminate in a single leaf.

I take it that these are the petioles (leaf-stalks) and laminae (leaf-
blades). Leaves in whorls of 3 should be helpful in identifying the
plant.

The leaf has a shape something like gum, but the lobes are not as
pronounced. The leaf is fuzzy on the bottom side, and the top tends
toward shininess although it also has a slight fuzz. It's pea green on
top and lighter on the bottom.

By gum you mean sweet gum (Liquidambar) and not Eucalyptus?


Now here is the clue that makes this tree unique: most of its leaves
are in excess of 20" across!

Now, you'd think that I could come up with something real quick on
the net to identify this critter with no problem. WRONG!
Almost every damned "plant identification" site is nothing but a
bunch of pictures. I guess you're supposed to look at them until you
see something that you can say "Hey! That's the one!" to. I couldn't
find one single site in which you could taxonomically zero in on an
ID. Is there such a place?

Thonner's Analytical Key to the Families of Flowering Plants is online
at

http://home.iae.nl/users/linea/

You could try this, but you'd probably find too many branches at which
you don't have the data to select either branch of the key. (Like when
it comes to a flower character.)

The key at

http://www.hort.uconn.edu/plants/key...treekey01.html

takes us to Catalpa, but that doesn't seem like a match to me.

Anyway, I thought I'd try and see if I would have any luck here.


--
Stewart Robert Hinsley

In article , Howd E.
Doodat ? writes
The main stem/trunk is about 2" in diameter, woody at the base but
quickly becoming green about a foot or 2 up from the bottom.
About every foot or so are 3 "branches" radiating from the trunk at
roughly 120 degrees. These "branches" each terminate in a single leaf.

I take it that these are the petioles (leaf-stalks) and laminae (leaf-
blades). Leaves in whorls of 3 should be helpful in identifying the
plant.

The leaf has a shape something like gum, but the lobes are not as
pronounced. The leaf is fuzzy on the bottom side, and the top tends
toward shininess although it also has a slight fuzz. It's pea green on
top and lighter on the bottom.

By gum you mean sweet gum (Liquidambar) and not Eucalyptus?


Now here is the clue that makes this tree unique: most of its leaves
are in excess of 20" across!

Now, you'd think that I could come up with something real quick on
the net to identify this critter with no problem. WRONG!
Almost every damned "plant identification" site is nothing but a
bunch of pictures. I guess you're supposed to look at them until you
see something that you can say "Hey! That's the one!" to. I couldn't
find one single site in which you could taxonomically zero in on an
ID. Is there such a place?

Thonner's Analytical Key to the Families of Flowering Plants is online
at

http://home.iae.nl/users/linea/

You could try this, but you'd probably find too many branches at which
you don't have the data to select either branch of the key. (Like when
it comes to a flower character.)

The key at

http://www.hort.uconn.edu/plants/key...treekey01.html

takes us to Catalpa, but that doesn't seem like a match to me.

Anyway, I thought I'd try and see if I would have any luck here.


--
Stewart Robert Hinsley

In article , Howd E.
Doodat ? writes
The main stem/trunk is about 2" in diameter, woody at the base but
quickly becoming green about a foot or 2 up from the bottom.
About every foot or so are 3 "branches" radiating from the trunk at
roughly 120 degrees. These "branches" each terminate in a single leaf.

I take it that these are the petioles (leaf-stalks) and laminae (leaf-
blades). Leaves in whorls of 3 should be helpful in identifying the
plant.

The leaf has a shape something like gum, but the lobes are not as
pronounced. The leaf is fuzzy on the bottom side, and the top tends
toward shininess although it also has a slight fuzz. It's pea green on
top and lighter on the bottom.

By gum you mean sweet gum (Liquidambar) and not Eucalyptus?


Now here is the clue that makes this tree unique: most of its leaves
are in excess of 20" across!

Now, you'd think that I could come up with something real quick on
the net to identify this critter with no problem. WRONG!
Almost every damned "plant identification" site is nothing but a
bunch of pictures. I guess you're supposed to look at them until you
see something that you can say "Hey! That's the one!" to. I couldn't
find one single site in which you could taxonomically zero in on an
ID. Is there such a place?

Thonner's Analytical Key to the Families of Flowering Plants is online
at

http://home.iae.nl/users/linea/

You could try this, but you'd probably find too many branches at which
you don't have the data to select either branch of the key. (Like when
it comes to a flower character.)

The key at

http://www.hort.uconn.edu/plants/key...treekey01.html

takes us to Catalpa, but that doesn't seem like a match to me.

Anyway, I thought I'd try and see if I would have any luck here.


--
Stewart Robert Hinsley

In article , en? [Howd E.
Doodat] wrote...

I have a tree (or weed or some kind of plant) growing out back of my
house. I've only seen one other like it in my life, and that was about
20 years ago, so they are either very uncommon or they are constantly
cut back by homeowners (although I've NEVER seen one in the woods).

Where do you live? That's often relevant to these questions.

Basically it has a single stem or trunk, although there are a couple
of minor offshoots coming off the base.

In its first few weeks in June, it grew roughly 6" per DAY! In the
last month it has only grown another foot and now stands about 15'.
What is more remarkable here is that its root structure HAS to be
horizontal: it is growing out from under a pile of roofing shingles
and tree branches that I discarded on a concrete slab.

The main stem/trunk is about 2" in diameter, woody at the base but
quickly becoming green about a foot or 2 up from the bottom.

So, it's an actual woody plant, not a giant herbaceous growth like:

http://www.poisoncentre.be/Nl/Heracl...egazzianum.htm
http://www.agf.gov.bc.ca/cropprot/gianthogweed.htm
http://whatcom.wsu.edu/ag/homehort/weed/hogweed.htm

About every foot or so are 3 "branches" radiating from the trunk at
roughly 120 degrees. These "branches" each terminate in a single leaf.

Sounds like whorls of three leaves.

The leaf has a shape something like gum, but the lobes are not as
pronounced.

You mean, slightly palmately lobed, something like Liquidambar [sweet gum]?

http://botany.cs.tamu.edu/FLORA/swts/hama003.jpg

The leaf is fuzzy on the bottom side, and the top tends
toward shininess although it also has a slight fuzz. It's pea green on
top and lighter on the bottom.

Now here is the clue that makes this tree unique: most of its leaves
are in excess of 20" across!

Might well be a seedling/sapling of _Paulownia tomentosa_. They can
grow very fast and do often have very large juvenile leaves. The
leaves are usually just in opposite pairs, but they can be whorled
like yours, especially on vigorous shoots. It eventually becomes a
branched woody tree with smaller leaves and ornamental flowers:

http://www.paulownia.com/
http://www.toadgully.com.au/are_paulownia.php
http://www.nps.gov/plants/alien/fact/pato1.htm
http://www.mediterraneangardensociet...tomentosa.html
http://www.wb2020.qld.gov.au/icm/baf...s/pawlonia.jpg
http://python.ex.ac.uk/ead/be/species/p/paulownia/
http://www.paulownia.it/
http://www.forestry.auburn.edu/samue...press_tree.htm
http://www.emilycompost.com/empress_tree.htm

Superficially similar trees are in the genus Catalpa [not actually
a very close relative of Paulownia], and they do have leaves in whorls
of three. The leaves can also sometimes have a few lobes. I don't recall
seeing any such vigorous, very-large-leaved saplings or suckers as
Paulownia often produces, but I suppose it's possible:

http://project.bio.iastate.edu/trees...pa_leaves.html
http://botany.cs.tamu.edu/FLORA/dcs420/fa06/fa06056.jpg
http://www.ces.ncsu.edu/depts/hort/c...nonioides.html

[snip]

cheers

I have a tree (or weed or some kind of plant) growing out back of my house.


Your description isn't bad, considering some that we have had. however, you
neglected to say where you live. That would help.
If you are in a warm climate, one possibility is a banana plant.
Iris,
Central NY, Zone 5a, Sunset Zone 40
"If we see light at the end of the tunnel, It's the light of the oncoming
train."
Robert Lowell (1917-1977)

On Thu, 7 Aug 2003 23:46:19 +0000 (UTC),
(mel turner) wrote:
Where do you live? That's often relevant to these questions.


On 08 Aug 2003 02:39:52 GMT, (Iris Cohen) wrote:
you neglected to say where you live. That would help.


======================================

Jeeeezzz....

I can't believe I left that out. My original (lengthy) note on this
(before I hacked it apart to a reasonable posting length) had the
following:

---------------------------
The plant looks kind of tropical or sub-tropical, yet it is thriving
like gangbusters here in South Jersey (I live right across the river
from Philadelphia).
---------------------------

I agree it's a critical piece of information, and I embarrassingly
apologize. ;-)
BTW, I'm trying to set up web space, and then I'm going to try
posting pix of this beast so you can see it.
I think the Paulownia is right, but all the refs I've found ONLY
have 2 opposing leaves as opposed to my triplets. Some of the images
show a tall, single trunked plant like mine, but the majority dwell on
the Princess/Empress Tree, which looks like a regular tree. Also, I'm
a bit confused over which tree is "P. Tomentosa" because some sites
seem to be describing different trees with the same term. Also, in
general, the sites seem to say that the tall skinny P. is commercially
viable, while the Princess/Empress tree is not. Finally, some sites
say the plant is easily propagated while others say it is not.
Hmm..

"And one more thing.." (as Jackie Chan's grandfather likes to say on
the cartoon):
Mel, you mentioned the remote similarity to a catalpa. Very
funny...that just happens to be my OTHER "pest plant" that grows on
the other side of my house! ;-)
Our "bean tree" (although we've never let it grow to fruition) is
also a fast grower and virtually indestructible. Unlike the other
plant, Catalpas are quite abundant around here, mostly domestic, but
also many in the wild. Where they can, they grow fairly large, about
30 feet and nicely spread.
We keep hacking it back to a stub, and it keeps coming right back.A
couple of years ago I actually tried digging the root out, and I got a
doublefisted sized knot with some heavy tendrils out and thought that
would do the job. It didn't. ;-(

Anyway, thank you all for your help so far, and I'll be back for more.
As ugly as this plant (the paulownia) is, it's agressiveness is
utterly fascinating to me, moreso because I wonder how such an
aggressive tree could possibly be so uncommon????

Anyway, thank you all for your help so far, and I'll be back for more.
As ugly as this plant (the paulownia) is, it's agressiveness is
utterly fascinating to me, moreso because I wonder how such an
aggressive tree could possibly be so uncommon????

In a word, it's *not* uncommon. princess tree is a nasty weed in places. If
you drive I40 from Asheville, NC to Knoxville, TN, right through a
magnificent gorge of the Pigeon River, princess tree is the dominant tree in
many areas. It doesn't do well in undisturbed places, but a little
disturbance and the seeds will germinate and then lots of princess trees.

The saplings of princess trees are notorious for having leaves arranged in
any fashion possible: alternate, opposite, whorled and anything else! Young
leaves can be entire or toothed, unlobed or lobed, little or big!

Nasty tree!

Scott Ranger

Well, it's sure uncommon around here. It's like I said earlier, the
only other one of these beasties I've ever seen was about 20 years
ago.
Be that as it may, if we have a population of "small-leaved"
Princess trees around here, it's possible that they wouldn't be so
remarkable as to make me notice them.
But the perverse looking beast we have out back now, if they were
common they'd be REAL hard to miss. ;-)



On Sat, 09 Aug 2003 21:21:38 GMT, "Scott Ranger"
wrote:

Anyway, thank you all for your help so far, and I'll be back for more.
As ugly as this plant (the paulownia) is, it's agressiveness is
utterly fascinating to me, moreso because I wonder how such an
aggressive tree could possibly be so uncommon????

In a word, it's *not* uncommon. princess tree is a nasty weed in places. If
you drive I40 from Asheville, NC to Knoxville, TN, right through a
magnificent gorge of the Pigeon River, princess tree is the dominant tree in
many areas. It doesn't do well in undisturbed places, but a little
disturbance and the seeds will germinate and then lots of princess trees.

The saplings of princess trees are notorious for having leaves arranged in
any fashion possible: alternate, opposite, whorled and anything else! Young
leaves can be entire or toothed, unlobed or lobed, little or big!

Nasty tree!

Scott Ranger

In article , en?
[Howd E. Doodat] wrote...

Well, it's sure uncommon around here. It's like I said earlier, the
only other one of these beasties I've ever seen was about 20 years
ago.

Perhaps saplings or suckers as vigorous as yours are scarce, but
there may be some adult trees nearby? You mentioned that Catalpa
trees were common in your neighborhood; maybe some of them are
actually Paulownia. [Although the trees and leaves are pretty
similar, Catalpa have the long "string-bean" fruits. Paulownia
fruits are very different, rounded seed pods].

http://www.nobleplants.com/classnote.../paulownia.htm

Be that as it may, if we have a population of "small-leaved"
Princess trees around here, it's possible that they wouldn't be so
remarkable as to make me notice them.

Again, the "small-leaved" forms are just the big-leaved form,
grown up.

But the perverse looking beast we have out back now, if they were
common they'd be REAL hard to miss. ;-)

[snip]

cheers

Stewart Robert Hinsley wrote:

Thonner's Analytical Key to the Families of Flowering Plants is online at

http://home.iae.nl/users/linea/

Stewart Robert Hinsley -- anagram
******************************
Nettles worry this bear!
******************************


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"Endeavor to persevere"
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