David,
I must add that even though this has virtually eliminated
resistance, using SU's has really made farmers watch much closer what kind
of crops they are rotating. They can hold much longer in the soil,
especially on knolls, where organic matter is poor.





Dean















"Dean Ronn" @home wrote in message
...

"David Kendra" wrote in message
news:W3HNa.44123$926.4861@sccrnsc03...

"Dean Ronn" @home wrote in message
...

"Gordon Couger" wrote in message
news:3f052be8_3@newsfeed...


If they could kill wild oats they would. One of the people I talked
to
has
over 12 square miles of farm land as well as 3 million bushels of
grain
storage, a fertilizer and spraying business. Wild oats cost him
money
in
the
field, when he buys the grain from farmers and when he sell it to
the
mill
or larger grain merchant. I farmed for him for 10 year and did
business
with
him and his father all my life. If he tells me it is too dangerous
to
use
I
believe him. He has every reason to use the chemical and none not
to.

You can think what you damn well please.

Gordon


Gordon,

Just a quick question.(Definitely not trying to start
anything here) Why would buying grain that has wild oats in it cost
your
friend any extra money? Does he not deduct a percentage on payment for
dockage? I'm sure that they deduct him for that at the mill.
I've actually dealt with Puma for many years.
(phenoxaprop-p-ethyl) I've see it cause some leaf tip burning on
cereals
in
extreme heat conditions, but nothing that has damaged any yield
expectations. Also, it is sprayed quite earlier than the flag leaf
emergance, and I'm sure that you realize how important the flag is to
the
wheat plant. We have such a variety of soils here, and I've yet to
experience any catastrophes or for that matter, significant yield
losses
from Puma's use. It's such a universal chemical, as it can be used in
canola(off label), wheat, barley, and canary seed(off label). Are you
sure
that your not getting it mixed up with a group 2 herbicide, which can
be
ugly residual wise? ex. Sulfosulfuron(Sold as Sundance by Monsanto
here
in
Canada or Maverick in the U.S.A. We've had fits with this product with
crop
rotation.
I guess what really floors me a bit here is that I've
sold
about 20,000 acres of Puma here annually for a very long time and have
never
run into any situation such as the one that your stating, but in your
defense, I would sure like to hear you expand on it.

In the States, wild oat has developed resistance to the ACCase inhibitor
class of herbicides which Puma is a member. Please see
http://www.montana.edu/wwwpb/ag/herbres.html. for more information
Dean,
have you seen any wild oats that are resistant to Puma in your fields?
Thanks.

Dave

Dave,

There has been some in the past, more so with products such as
trifurallin(different chemistry). With proper rotations on different
groups
of pesticides, it's become mute. (ex.- changing from a group 1 chemistry
such as Puma to a group 2 chemistry such as Sundance.) Farmers aren't as
dependent on Group 1 chemistry as they once were. I'm not sure if you use
the same charts for rotating chemicals as we do, but in case you don't,
hopefully this link will work for you. Have a look.

http://www.westcoag.com/HerbicideGro...ups%202003.pdf



Dean