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#1
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gardening on building waste...
Hope I might be able to get some ideas or recommendations...
I have patch of land around .5 acres, south facing and sloping at around 35 degrees (going up from my property) to a height of around 30 feet to a hedge and substation the other side. The land is composed of a rough soil mixed with bricks, coal ash / clinker and stone. The only things growing are dandelions etc. The depth of the waste appears to be at least 6 feet (I believe its from an old mill clearance, bulldozed out of the way in the 80's to build the houses), so clearance to 'real earth' is out of the question. The land has had Japanese knotweed on it which has (after 4 years of work, lots of weed killer and a large garden incinerator) been brought under control, so clearance off site would not be practical given the costs likely for disposal So - my problem is how to develop the land to garden. At the moment my thought is to terrace into levels and put a layer (12 inches ? 18 inches ???) of compost / soil and grow in that. I am really not sure how to go about this - can anyone advise on the correct levels of compost / soil I would need, depths to work to, or recommend any books for developing a garden on what I suppose is a 'brown field site'. Or for that matter, any other thoughts / ideas from the gardening community on getting this land workable ? Thanks in advance Steve |
#2
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Hi, maybe not exactly the info you're looking for but the RHS magazine 'The Garden' had a really interesting feature in it recently about a study of plants experimentally grown on various diferent piles of 'waste material', ie broken bricks, cement etc. Lots of things will thrive apparently! It was one of the later issues of last year, maybe September or October. Perhaps you might be able to chase this up and work out a way to not use any top soil at all!
Cheers, Bob |
#3
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gardening on building waste...
On Mon, 9 Jan 2006 19:16:38 +0000, undergroundbob
wrote: Hi, maybe not exactly the info you're looking for but the RHS magazine 'The Garden' had a really interesting feature in it recently about a study of plants experimentally grown on various diferent piles of 'waste material', ie broken bricks, cement etc. Lots of things will thrive apparently! It was one of the later issues of last year, maybe September or October. Perhaps you might be able to chase this up and work out a way to not use any top soil at all! Cheers, Bob Thanks Bob - i'll look into getting back issues... Steve |
#4
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gardening on building waste...
The message
from Fevets contains these words: Hope I might be able to get some ideas or recommendations... I have patch of land around .5 acres, south facing and sloping at around 35 degrees (going up from my property) to a height of around 30 feet to a hedge and substation the other side. The land is composed of a rough soil mixed with bricks, coal ash / clinker and stone. The only things growing are dandelions etc. The depth of the waste appears to be at least 6 feet (I believe its from an old mill clearance, bulldozed out of the way in the 80's to build the houses), so clearance to 'real earth' is out of the question. So - my problem is how to develop the land to garden. At the moment my thought is to terrace into levels and put a layer (12 inches ? 18 inches ???) of compost / soil and grow in that. I am really not sure how to go about this - can anyone advise on the correct levels of compost / soil I would need, depths to work to, or recommend any books for developing a garden on what I suppose is a 'brown field site'. The fact that dandelions and knotweed grow, shows that there's enough soil to support plants and seedlings. Unless you are exceedingly rich don't attempt to change it. Garden with what you've got, it makes a lot more sense, and you will be following the footsteps of some of the UK's greatest gardens. Use the conditions you have, grow the kind of plants which will thrive superbly in those conditions. (Somewhere, some desperate millionaire is spending a fortune to construct a rocky scree slope like the one you've been blessed with). You haven't said where you are (in the UK), what elevation above sealevel, and which way the garden faces.(North /south, sunny/shaded) That would be helpful before we all launch into plant suggestions. Janet |
#5
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gardening on building waste...
The message
from Janet Baraclough contains these words: I have patch of land around .5 acres, south facing and sloping at /snip/ ^^^^^^^^^^ You haven't said where you are (in the UK), what elevation above sealevel, and which way the garden faces.(North /south, sunny/shaded) That would be helpful before we all launch into plant suggestions. -- Rusty Direct reply to: horrid dot squeak snailything zetnet point co period uk Separator in search of a sig |
#6
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gardening on building waste...
On Mon, 9 Jan 2006 18:56:30 GMT, Janet Baraclough
wrote: The message from Fevets contains these words: Hope I might be able to get some ideas or recommendations... I have patch of land around .5 acres, south facing and sloping at around 35 degrees (going up from my property) to a height of around 30 feet to a hedge and substation the other side. The land is composed of a rough soil mixed with bricks, coal ash / clinker and stone. The only things growing are dandelions etc. The depth of the waste appears to be at least 6 feet (I believe its from an old mill clearance, bulldozed out of the way in the 80's to build the houses), so clearance to 'real earth' is out of the question. So - my problem is how to develop the land to garden. At the moment my thought is to terrace into levels and put a layer (12 inches ? 18 inches ???) of compost / soil and grow in that. I am really not sure how to go about this - can anyone advise on the correct levels of compost / soil I would need, depths to work to, or recommend any books for developing a garden on what I suppose is a 'brown field site'. The fact that dandelions and knotweed grow, shows that there's enough soil to support plants and seedlings. Unless you are exceedingly rich don't attempt to change it. Garden with what you've got, it makes a lot more sense, and you will be following the footsteps of some of the UK's greatest gardens. Use the conditions you have, grow the kind of plants which will thrive superbly in those conditions. (Somewhere, some desperate millionaire is spending a fortune to construct a rocky scree slope like the one you've been blessed with). You haven't said where you are (in the UK), what elevation above sealevel, and which way the garden faces.(North /south, sunny/shaded) That would be helpful before we all launch into plant suggestions. Janet Thanks Janet. Location is north of Manchetser, elevation maybe 300 feet above sea level and south facing. My ideal is a more controlled garden than, say, wild flower meadow - the big problem is not so much it being a rockey scree - the 'rocky' bit consists of anything from lumps of concrete to old acrington brick, with occasional large pockets of cola slag / ash and clinker.... My real ideal would be find a way of putting veg onto parts of this - which goes back to my thoughts of terracing and re-soiling (maybe over a membrane)....Assuming my will power, budget and back all stands up to the work ! Regards Steve |
#7
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gardening on building waste...
On Tue, 10 Jan 2006 15:55:55 +0000, Steve Fitton wrote
(in article ): snip Location is north of Manchetser, elevation maybe 300 feet above sea level and south facing. My ideal is a more controlled garden than, say, wild flower meadow - the big problem is not so much it being a rockey scree - the 'rocky' bit consists of anything from lumps of concrete to old acrington brick, with occasional large pockets of cola slag / ash and clinker.... My real ideal would be find a way of putting veg onto parts of this - which goes back to my thoughts of terracing and re-soiling (maybe over a membrane)....Assuming my will power, budget and back all stands up to the work ! Have you visited the Centre for Alternative Technology at Macchynleth? http://www.cat.org.uk. They have a garden created on the site of an old slate quarry, with terracing. You might get some useful ideas there and it's well worth a visit. -- Sally in Shropshire, UK bed and breakfast near Ludlow: http://www.stonybrook-ludlow.co.uk Burne-Jones/William Morris window in Shropshire church: http://www.whitton-stmarys.org.uk |
#8
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gardening on building waste...
The message
from Steve Fitton contains these words: My real ideal would be find a way of putting veg onto parts of this - which goes back to my thoughts of terracing and re-soiling (maybe over a membrane)....Assuming my will power, budget and back all stands up to the work ! That sounds the option for the short term, but it will mean a lot of work, and you might just as well use the energy in removing a lot of the rubble - a bit at a time. -- Rusty Direct reply to: horrid dot squeak snailything zetnet point co period uk Separator in search of a sig |
#9
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gardening on building waste...
The message
from Steve Fitton contains these words: You haven't said where you are (in the UK), what elevation above sealevel, and which way the garden faces.(North /south, sunny/shaded) That would be helpful before we all launch into plant suggestions. Janet Thanks Janet. Location is north of Manchetser, elevation maybe 300 feet above sea level and south facing. My ideal is a more controlled garden than, say, wild flower meadow - Wildflower meadows require annual hay-cutting and removal, which would be difficult on 5 acres at 30 degrees slope..so I wouldn't even contenplate that. But a slope, tilted to the south, is brilliant for other plantings. the big problem is not so much it being a rockey scree - the 'rocky' bit consists of anything from lumps of concrete to old acrington brick, with occasional large pockets of cola slag / ash and clinker.... What the eye doesn't see the heart doesn't grieve. That composition below the surface means "good drainage".. a great combination with the southfacing slope. My real ideal would be find a way of putting veg onto parts of this - Now, there you may have a problem. Some old industrial spoilheaps are so heavily contaminated with heavy metals, chemicals etc they may never be suitable for growing food crops on. The only way to tell, would be A) some serious reseaerch into who made the heap, from what, when; or a professional soil analysis. Other than food-production, you have great conditions for growing lots of great sun-loving plants from drier climates than the UK. Many of them positively thrive in rocky-thin-uneven soils, I recommend asling for a book called "The gravel Garden" by Beth Chatto at your local library, to see what possibilities lie before you. One possibility (since you have a fair bit of land) is to approach local environmental groups/college departments etc, and offer it as a location for their work-parties/ assistance (or, university soil/environmental research). This could bring some free expertise and labour your way. Local environmental groups, and your local council (environmental dept), should be able to advise you about grants available for land reclamation /replanting/environmental improvements. There's a pot of money out there for the tapping. Resoiling 5 acres at a 30 degree slope (over membrane) is, in my view, totally impractical without huge resources of money, machinery, labour etc. You're talking about buying and distributing thousands of tons of topsoil. Calculate the volume and cost--just for the soil.. from the site below. I recommend you drop in at a landscaping website called www.paving expert, run by an expert professional called Tony Mc Cormack who is very close to you, and used to be an active memeber of this group. He will be able to advise you about resoiling, membrane, terracing (safely) etc (free, afaik) Janet |
#10
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gardening on building waste...
"Janet Baraclough" wrote in message ... The message from Steve Fitton contains these words: You haven't said where you are (in the UK), what elevation above sealevel, and which way the garden faces.(North /south, sunny/shaded) That would be helpful before we all launch into plant suggestions. Janet Thanks Janet. Location is north of Manchetser, elevation maybe 300 feet above sea level and south facing. My ideal is a more controlled garden than, say, wild flower meadow - Wildflower meadows require annual hay-cutting and removal, which would be difficult on 5 acres at 30 degrees slope..so I wouldn't even contenplate that. But a slope, tilted to the south, is brilliant for other plantings. the big problem is not so much it being a rockey scree - the 'rocky' bit consists of anything from lumps of concrete to old acrington brick, with occasional large pockets of cola slag / ash and clinker.... What the eye doesn't see the heart doesn't grieve. That composition below the surface means "good drainage".. a great combination with the southfacing slope. My real ideal would be find a way of putting veg onto parts of this - Now, there you may have a problem. Some old industrial spoilheaps are so heavily contaminated with heavy metals, chemicals etc they may never be suitable for growing food crops on. The only way to tell, would be A) some serious reseaerch into who made the heap, from what, when; or a professional soil analysis. Other than food-production, you have great conditions for growing lots of great sun-loving plants from drier climates than the UK. Many of them positively thrive in rocky-thin-uneven soils, I recommend asling for a book called "The gravel Garden" by Beth Chatto at your local library, to see what possibilities lie before you. One possibility (since you have a fair bit of land) is to approach local environmental groups/college departments etc, and offer it as a location for their work-parties/ assistance (or, university soil/environmental research). This could bring some free expertise and labour your way. Local environmental groups, and your local council (environmental dept), should be able to advise you about grants available for land reclamation /replanting/environmental improvements. There's a pot of money out there for the tapping. Resoiling 5 acres at a 30 degree slope (over membrane) is, in my view, totally impractical without huge resources of money, machinery, labour etc. You're talking about buying and distributing thousands of tons of topsoil. Calculate the volume and cost--just for the soil.. from the site below. I recommend you drop in at a landscaping website called www.paving expert, run by an expert professional called Tony Mc Cormack who is very close to you, and used to be an active memeber of this group. He will be able to advise you about resoiling, membrane, terracing (safely) etc (free, afaik) Janet I think he is talking about 0.5 acres not a full 5 acres ? Your comments are still relevant but he could do other things if he has indeed got a half acre. |
#11
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gardening on building waste...
The message
from "Rupert" contains these words: I think he is talking about 0.5 acres not a full 5 acres ? Your comments are still relevant but he could do other things if he has indeed got a half acre. You're right, sorry..I missed the dot! It's a half acre. Still a gigantic amount required to re-soil it. Janet |
#12
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gardening on building waste...
On Tue, 10 Jan 2006 22:53:27 -0000, "Rupert"
wrote: "Janet Baraclough" wrote in message ... The message from Steve Fitton contains these words: You haven't said where you are (in the UK), what elevation above sealevel, and which way the garden faces.(North /south, sunny/shaded) That would be helpful before we all launch into plant suggestions. Janet Thanks Janet. Location is north of Manchetser, elevation maybe 300 feet above sea level and south facing. My ideal is a more controlled garden than, say, wild flower meadow - Wildflower meadows require annual hay-cutting and removal, which would be difficult on 5 acres at 30 degrees slope..so I wouldn't even contenplate that. But a slope, tilted to the south, is brilliant for other plantings. the big problem is not so much it being a rockey scree - the 'rocky' bit consists of anything from lumps of concrete to old acrington brick, with occasional large pockets of cola slag / ash and clinker.... What the eye doesn't see the heart doesn't grieve. That composition below the surface means "good drainage".. a great combination with the southfacing slope. My real ideal would be find a way of putting veg onto parts of this - Now, there you may have a problem. Some old industrial spoilheaps are so heavily contaminated with heavy metals, chemicals etc they may never be suitable for growing food crops on. The only way to tell, would be A) some serious reseaerch into who made the heap, from what, when; or a professional soil analysis. Other than food-production, you have great conditions for growing lots of great sun-loving plants from drier climates than the UK. Many of them positively thrive in rocky-thin-uneven soils, I recommend asling for a book called "The gravel Garden" by Beth Chatto at your local library, to see what possibilities lie before you. One possibility (since you have a fair bit of land) is to approach local environmental groups/college departments etc, and offer it as a location for their work-parties/ assistance (or, university soil/environmental research). This could bring some free expertise and labour your way. Local environmental groups, and your local council (environmental dept), should be able to advise you about grants available for land reclamation /replanting/environmental improvements. There's a pot of money out there for the tapping. Resoiling 5 acres at a 30 degree slope (over membrane) is, in my view, totally impractical without huge resources of money, machinery, labour etc. You're talking about buying and distributing thousands of tons of topsoil. Calculate the volume and cost--just for the soil.. from the site below. I recommend you drop in at a landscaping website called www.paving expert, run by an expert professional called Tony Mc Cormack who is very close to you, and used to be an active memeber of this group. He will be able to advise you about resoiling, membrane, terracing (safely) etc (free, afaik) Janet I think he is talking about 0.5 acres not a full 5 acres ? Your comments are still relevant but he could do other things if he has indeed got a half acre. I am definately talking about 0 point 5 acres ! - putting .5 in the initial mail without the leading '0' was a bit confusing sorry - Steve |
#13
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gardening on building waste...
Janet Baraclough wrote:
Wildflower meadows require annual hay-cutting and removal, which would be difficult on 5 acres at 30 degrees slope.. He only* has half an acre...his OP says .5 of an acre, still a lot to manually double dig while removing skip after skip of rubble though. * only! |
#14
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gardening on building waste...
The message
from Fevets contains these words: Hope I might be able to get some ideas or recommendations... I have patch of land around .5 acres, south facing and sloping at around 35 degrees (going up from my property) to a height of around 30 feet to a hedge and substation the other side. The land is composed of a rough soil mixed with bricks, coal ash / clinker and stone. The only things growing are dandelions etc. The depth of the waste appears to be at least 6 feet (I believe its from an old mill clearance, bulldozed out of the way in the 80's to build the houses), so clearance to 'real earth' is out of the question. The land has had Japanese knotweed on it which has (after 4 years of work, lots of weed killer and a large garden incinerator) been brought under control, so clearance off site would not be practical given the costs likely for disposal So - my problem is how to develop the land to garden. At the moment my thought is to terrace into levels and put a layer (12 inches ? 18 inches ???) of compost / soil and grow in that. I am really not sure how to go about this - can anyone advise on the correct levels of compost / soil I would need, depths to work to, or recommend any books for developing a garden on what I suppose is a 'brown field site'. Or for that matter, any other thoughts / ideas from the gardening community on getting this land workable ? Coo! You've got a job on your hands, and no mistake. Firstly, you don't say which part of the country you are in, though when you say 'old mill', the odds on somewherre north of Watford begin to stack up. Your problem will be drainage - too much of it - and the only thing which springs to mind for that sort of a situation is grape vines. You might begin to 'landscape' your plot by excavating to the original soil, a bit at a time, and using some of the stone for building features, dry stone walls, etc, and maybe selling the excess or getting a builder to exchange it for subsoil and topsoil. If I were forty years younger... -- Rusty Direct reply to: horrid dot squeak snailything zetnet point co period uk Separator in search of a sig |
#15
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gardening on building waste...
Fevets wrote:
Hope I might be able to get some ideas or recommendations... I have patch of land around .5 acres, south facing and sloping at around 35 degrees (going up from my property) to a height of around 30 feet to a hedge and substation the other side. The land is composed of a rough soil mixed with bricks, coal ash / clinker and stone. The only things growing are dandelions etc. The depth of the waste appears to be at least 6 feet (I believe its from an old mill clearance, bulldozed out of the way in the 80's to build the houses), so clearance to 'real earth' is out of the question. The land has had Japanese knotweed on it which has (after 4 years of work, lots of weed killer and a large garden incinerator) been brought under control, so clearance off site would not be practical given the costs likely for disposal So - my problem is how to develop the land to garden. At the moment my thought is to terrace into levels and put a layer (12 inches ? 18 inches ???) of compost / soil and grow in that. I am really not sure how to go about this - can anyone advise on the correct levels of compost / soil I would need, depths to work to, or recommend any books for developing a garden on what I suppose is a 'brown field site'. PEFECT conditions fo a wild flower meadow - low nutrient/fertility so grass competition will not be an issue pk http://www.rspb.org.uk/gardens/guide...meadowarea.asp Meadow area Wild flower meadows are extraordinarily beautiful and teeming with wildlife: spiders spinning webs, caterpillars munching leaves, butterflies and moths supping nectar, all sorts of bees gathering pollen, birds foraging for insects and seeds and small mammals searching for food. Such meadows are usually created by a particular pattern of mowing and grazing. Cattle graze in the winter, then, in spring, the plants are allowed to grow, flower and set seed. In June the meadow is cut for hay. Nowadays wild flower meadows are extremely rare - we have lost 95% in the last 50 years. Planting one in your garden will really help local wildlife. Make the most of your garden a.. Cordon off a sunny area of lawn and don't mow it. If your lawn is weedy, some wild flowers will thrive. But for a true wild flower meadow you must have poor soil. Most gardens have too many nutrients, and you may need to remove some topsoil. b.. Mow a winding grass path to allow access to the meadow and other parts of the garden. c.. Remove all clippings and never add fertiliser to your wild flower meadow. |
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